What size diamond shelter?

[Homesteader]

Question for those of you experienced with them: what size diamond shelter would you recommend for a single trekker who'd carry it on either a broad back as in a blanket roll or in a canoe? I'm thinking 12 oz natural canvas (Red Hawk mfg, maybe?). I do live in a very humid area, though, so maybe Sunforger would be better.

I'd welcome any suggestions, observations, or critiques of the diamond itself, material, use, etc. Thank you very much.

 

Not knowing your size, physical condition, experience, I offer observations and opinion only.

1. 12oz canvas 9'x9' diamond will weigh 7 1/2 lbs. This will be the heaviest piece of gear in your kit. Anything much smaller will be a waste since it will not actually shelter you. Smaller scraps of canvas are best used as sunshades.

2. My 10oz 10'X10' rolls up into a 6"x18" roll, very bulky.

Due to these considerations I have never carried a "canvas" diamond shelter on any trek. I use a 9'X9' oilcloth made from cotton broadcloth, washed hot to shrink the weave and treated with waterproofing. It weighs 3 lbs and rolls into a bundle only 3"X 12".

Some people will leave off the shelter when trekking. For me it is essential. We can no longer move around freely and use shelter wherever we come across it as they did in past times.

My blanket weighs 6 lbs, my shelter 3 lbs. + 4-5 lbs other gear & food gives a manageable load. I try to keep all gear, including rifle and shooting bag, under 25 lbs. Two back surgeries make this my personal limit when moving on foot. In a canoe, the load limit of the boat is my only boundry.

Most trekking is simply ultralight backpacking with primitive gear. You make comprimises with safty and your experience and ability in mind. I have friends that look like pack mules moving through the woods. That would be impossible for me. Just because you CAN carry it does not mean you NEED to cary it. However, each person's need and abilities will vary.

 

[Homesteader]

Ghost, thanks very much for the info. Just what I was after. I'm a very stout boy (been a bodybuilder for about a decade now), but age is catching up with me. I couldn't agree more with your comment that just because I can carry it, doesn't mean I should.

The idea of oilcloth is pretty intriguing. Did you make it yourself or buy it somewhere? Could you point me in the direction of a merchant or info on making one myself? (Is this the trail tarp that was discussed in Mark Lewis' thread?)

Thanks again for the help. It's really much appreciated.

 

Trail tarp is the term Panther uses for their diamond shelters of all types. Panther makes them from both canvas and a comercal "oilcloth". The oilcloth is both light and durable but the expense is a factor.

The commercial shelter will run you $125-$150 in either fabric. You can make oilcloth for a fraction of that yourself.

We have about 100 pages of discussion on making oilcloth in the archives. Lots of opinions for proper size and what mix to use. Most deal with a mixture of boiled linseed oil cut 50/50 with either mineral spirits or turpintine. I have not used turpintine and my experience with minerial spirits has been good. Some folks like turpintine better. Either way, allow the tarp to cure for several weeks before you fold and store it.

The one I am usiong now has been with me since 2000, so they hold up pretty well. I once made one from a bed sheet and even though very light it lasted two or three years. Storage does my gear more harm than use.

 

[Roy]

Oil cloth runs about $15/yard. So you will still be looking at $75 + dollars to make a 9x9 shelter. I am making one that'll be 7.5 sqaure. Lots of stiching to be done. :youcrazy: :haha:

 

[Roy]

To help you imagine the work there will be atleast 5 90" seams if I do finished edges and then theres the re-enforced corners and middles. :shocked2:

 

[FireMaker]

I dont have reinforcement on mine. Use lead balls or marbles tied in the fabric to use to tie. This spreads out the stress and you dont need the extra layers.

 

[Roy]

I was toying with the idea of making linnen thread grommets (round button holes), instead of loops or the lead ball trick. My canvas fly I use lead balls for the ties, just don't really care for it that much. There won't be no noticable weight difference, and after all of the other sewing the corners will be easy. The question will be will I really want to do them when I get fineshed with the edges.

 

I would expect that making the round stiched gromets would be a weak link in the fabric. I have seen way too many awning flys ripped to shreads by the wind even with brass gromets.

The round ball trick has been working well for many centuries and I think I can tolerate it a few more years if it will keep the shelter in one piece.

You can always dogear fold and tie a loop at each corner without compromising the fabric if you just can not stand the rifle ball system.

 

[sequoia]

Can cotton broadcloth be found at regular fabric stores or at Wally-world? What weight should I be looking for? What about a modern waterproofing solutions? I'm thinking about a trek this summer and want to keep the weight down.

 

[Roy]

Instead of punching a circular hole whith a brass grommet, I am going to cut a small x lay a linnen loop around that, then fold the x open over the linnen loop and do a button hole stitch over that.

 

[chipper]

Can cotton broadcloth be found at regular fabric stores or at Wally-world? What weight should I be looking for? What about a modern waterproofing solutions? I'm thinking about a trek this summer and want to keep the weight down.

My wife works at a fabric store and mentioned that broad cloth is very pominent and very inexspensive but normally blended with nylon. You can get it without nylon, you just have to ask. The stuff usually goes for $2 per yard. The best stuff to use is 300 thread count or better, it's used in making bedding. It goes for about $15 per yard. As far as modern waterproofing, Canvac works great and costs about $20 a gallon. I used one gallon to treat a 12' tipi with a weed sprayer.
Walmart has been a hit and miss thing for me. One day they have great stuff and great prices, the next it's all florecent pink junk. Shopping around is your best bet.
Regards

 

[Seamus]

Also check Home Depot or Lowes for canvas drop cloths. My local HD carries them in different weights. May be slightly more expensive than buying from the fabric store but you can save a lot of stitching with a bigger cloth.
I made my first tent out of that material.

 

[sequoia]

I know grommets are not PC and some people use the rock or roundball method of tying off a tarp. I was thinking of using tie strips sewn to various parts of the tarp. Has any used these type of fasteners?

 

[Seamus]

I put tie strips on the small tent that I built. As long as you take the time to sew them in carefully you should be happy with the results. If you haven't sewn much, take some materials to make repairs on your first outing just to be safe.

 

[Slamfire]

Basting tape makes good tie strips.

 

[chipper]

I know grommets are not PC and some people use the rock or roundball method of tying off a tarp. I was thinking of using tie strips sewn to various parts of the tarp. Has any used these type of fasteners?

I built a tipi last year and used pieces of scrap canvas rolled inward and sewn down the center with a zig zag stitch to hide the raw edges. This worked real well and it was cheap.
Regards

 

[Roy]

I know grommets are not PC

Ever looked at a Sail from an early built ship?

 

[romcneil]

The grommets used on early sails were metal rings sewn on the sail similar to a button hole stitch to reinforce the hole. They were not the two piece metal rings used on modern canvas tarps.

Bob

 

[Roy]

"I was toying with the idea of making linnen thread grommets (round button holes), instead of loops or the lead ball trick. My canvas fly I use lead balls for the ties, just don't really care for it that much. There won't be no noticable weight difference, and after all of the other sewing the corners will be easy. The question will be will I really want to do them when I get fineshed with the edges."

I wrote this earlier and this was the reply

"I know grommets are not PC and some people use the rock or roundball method of tying off a tarp. I was thinking of using tie strips sewn to various parts of the tarp. Has any used these type of fasteners?"

I was not suggesting that the two piece metal rings were used. :v