What would this rifle be called?

[Stubert]

Bought this used a few years ago at a gun show. Seller didn't know much about it. Some people tell me it's a Hawkin, some a Lehmen, still others call it a trade rifle. it is .62 caliber, has a Sharon barrel, 1-72 twist, L&R lock and trigger. Steel furniture. Barrel is 34"and coned. Does anyone know what is it? Thanks, Stu

 

[Grenadier1758]

Gaudy is my first thought. Decorated after it left the maker's shop.

What you have is a full stock Hawken Flint Lock. This is primarily based on the scroll trigger guard in the early style that was flat along the wrist and the double set triggers. The caliber is consistent with a Plains or Mountain Rifle. I see the wedges. Does this rifle have a hooked breech? Barrel is consistent with the later Hawken rifles.

I do believe that there were very few flint lock rifles made by Jake and Sam Hawken. So few that only a few rifles exist with percussion locks that may have been flint locks. The Flint Hawken rifles are fantasy rifles that are representative of a flint lock rifle that may have been built in the Hawken brothers' shop.

Calling your rifle a Hawken is a better description of the rifle than the other makers.

Based on just picture, you have a very nice looking rifle although too overly decorated for my tastes.

 

[hanshi]

I, too, say it's more a full stock flint Hawken than anything else. She does have a tad too much makeup. Otherwise you have a nice rifle.

 

[Spikebuck]

I would just call it a Plains Rifle, though it does have, as Grenadier pointed out, some Hawken features.

With some judicious wood removal (forestock through wrist especially) could make it a very nice rendition of a fullstock flintlock "Hawken."

As some references to styles you mentioned:

Here are some original J Henry "Trade Rifles" for the Mountain Man Trade (middle two). You can see differences in the furniture. If the description plates at the bottom weren't there, you'd see the buttplates are different as well. Of course these are just a couple examples of rifles made for the mountain man trade.

Here are a number of original Hawken and I think some Hawken-like rifles in the Cody Museum. Note how much slimmer the wrist and lock areas are, which extends into the forestock. #3 is a Full Stock attributed to Samuel Hawken (if I'm reading my fuzzy picture in the word section) correctly.

Here are two more "Hawken" rifles. The one on the left is a "Plains and Indian Trade Rifle by Samuel Hawken, St Louis, circa 1850. The one to it's right is a "Kentucky" Rifle by Christian and Jacob Hawken, circa 1800, Hagerstown, MD! So just what is "a Hawken?" Go back far enough and you're looking at Berks rifles from Reading, PA (of course the spelling was different and it was a different generation.) Here's a neat little writeup on the Hawken brothers and their business. Jacob Hawken (1786–1849) and Samuel Hawken (1792–1884) | Missouri Encyclopedia

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

I believe you have a Sharon S. Hawken Full Stock. I own a Sharon Trade rifle .50. Sharon Barrels are excellent and very accurate.

http://grrw.org/sharon-rifle-barrel-co

 

[William Sublette]

I saw (at a gun show) a table with zip lock sandwich baggies full of "real Indian tacks"


$3.50 for a 25ct baggie.




I s&#* you not.

 

[rich pierce]

Hatchet Jack nailed it.

 

[Stubert]

You should have seen it when I bought it. It had MORE tacks. The're not brass either, a magnet sticks to them. I'd like to remove them but I don't know how to hide all the holes. Yes it has 3 wedges and a hooked breech. The wedges go through square wires that appear to be staked into the barrel. One of these days I'll un-decorate it a bit.

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

You should have seen it when I bought it. It had MORE tacks. The're not brass either, a magnet sticks to them. I'd like to remove them but I don't know how to hide all the holes. Yes it has 3 wedges and a hooked breech. The wedges go through square wires that appear to be staked into the barrel. One of these days I'll un-decorate it a bit.

@Stubert Just shoot it. It should be great. Here's some history of Sharon Rifle Barrel Company.

http://grrw.org/sharon-rifle-barrel-co

 

[Stubert]

I can't believe how cheap they sold for back then. Wow

 

[Cowboy]

Yes, Like mentioned above, it’s a full stock Sharon Hawken kit gun.

Sharon also used L&R locks on all their offerings.

I personally own a couple of their muzzleloader’s. Sharon Trade rifle in .50, and a Sharon Hawken in .58 caliber.

Sharon barrels have an excellent reputation and known for their accuracy. Was up there with the best of them in the late 70’s.

Yours definitely has some bling to it. It’s an individual and one of a kind my friend.

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

You should have seen it when I bought it. It had MORE tacks. The're not brass either, a magnet sticks to them. I'd like to remove them but I don't know how to hide all the holes. Yes it has 3 wedges and a hooked breech. The wedges go through square wires that appear to be staked into the barrel. One of these days I'll un-decorate it a bit.

I had a thought (it happens sometimes) why not get some brass black or antiquing and darken up that bling? It might improve the looks very easily.

 

[SamTex1949]

Cheap ! No just a little less then GRRW yes . I also had actually got 2 ! A half stock Hawken (.54cal) and a full stock Hawken (.62cal) both percussion and in the :white". Had a good friend, Roy Ultey, who offered to finish them up for me. Both enjoyable
shooters but that .62cal was a hoot to shoot ! We had steel critter shoots at the AMLGC and Id only load 50 gr BP
in the 62 and it would kick the squirrels from the 25 yd line half way to 50 ! When Roy and I were shooting and taunting each other on the squirrels I shot at a squirrel, missed but we observed the steel tree rat rotate 90 degrees on wood stand but didnt fall. All we could conclude is the turbulence form that 320gr ball going by was enough to spin it !

 

[rickystl]

Appears the original owner of the gun got a bit carried away with the decoration. LOL But I seem to recall back in the mid-1970's and later, during the so-called Hawken craze, that some shooters would add a small amount of decoration to their guns. Usually a large, flat bead inlet to the butt stock, or maybe a strand of beads hanging from the trigger guard, or a small amount of tack decoration. If done tastefully, it seemed to look right on plains style rifles.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Sharon rifles cheap? They look that way today but if you were raising a family with kids in the late 70s or early 80s they weren't all that cheap.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Wasn’t uncommon for Indian guns to have decorative tack work, but that gun is a little “much” in that regard.

 

[Stubert]

I'm thinking of taking all the tacks off the wrist and mabey wraping it with leather.

 

[Many Klatch]

I bought a Bess Carbine that had a lot of tacks on it. Found out that when I shot it that it pulled out hairs on my beard. Talk about a flinch. It didn't take long for me to pull out the tacks. I filled the holes with natural colored Plastic Wood. Still has a trace of the patterns on the stock but it doesn't pull out beard hair.

 

[Cowboy]

Many examples of original NW Trade Guns are found to be tacked up.

The Native American Indian’s loved colorful decoration. Wether it was dress, teepee, or firearms.

On their firearms, they used broken pieces of mirror, glass, bone, to include tacks. Was the norm in their culture.

As far as the decor on the OP’s Hawken. I would only add that beauty is in the eye of the beholder? I personally think that the individual who did the tacking had a vision on how he wanted his rifle to look? I’ll also add that he did a good job in uniformity. Definitely an eye catcher! One of a kind with its own personality.

Lastly, I own a NW Trade Gun that I tacked up. Looked at pics of existing original’s and put my own spin on how I envisioned my own to be. Let my imagination be my guide. Was extremely pleased with the end result. Probably like the original owner was pleased with his end result? Definitely has its own personality my friends.

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[user 48679]

If the tacks are removed, the holes can be filled with a little sawdust made from a hole drilled into the buttstock, taken from under the butt plate, with a two-part epoxy.

The method would be to remove the tacks and apply a paste wax (Johnson's come to mind) to the stock wood, being careful to not get any wax into the holes - do not buff the wax yet.

Mix the epoxy with stock sawdust to help with making the repair invisible, and with the tip of wooden toothpick, place a small drop of the epoxy mix into each hole, wiping the top of the hole lightly with a clean portion of a rag for each hole. Try to be careful not to wipe the stock beyond the hole(s).

Polish the wax off the stock after the epoxy has cured.