Wheel weights for roundballs

[dlemaster]

pharmvet
You have it figured out. The wheelweights shrink less than pure lead upon cooling but because of the alloy it will weigh lighter. This is why when black powder cartridge rifle shooters order a custom bullet mould the mould maker will usually ask what alloy your are using. If you order a mould to cast a bullet .458 with an alloy of 20/1 lead/tin and cast bullets of pure lead in it, it will cast bullets at about .457 to .4575.

Regards, Dave

 

[BS]

This is a "draft" that I saved talking about shoooting Paper Patched Hard Lead Balls:

According to Daryl S. a slow twist with wide shallow groves is best. No
deeper than .008, with .005 or .006 better. He uses .003 bubble jet paper
and 2 and a bit wraps in his .69 cal with a .684 WW ball. The shallow
rifling doesn't foul as quickly as deep ones.

I have been trying different thickness and wraps with my 62......it shoots
well at 50, but have not found the right combination at 100. The rifling is
.012 deep, with equal lands and groves.

I am going to try heavier loads next time, and see if that helps. My lead is
only about 1/2 as hard as WW, that may make a difference too!

Daryl shoots 165FF with his 69 cal. and is getting 1 1/2" groups at 100yds.
Green River barrel with a 1in66 twist.
-----------------------------------------------

Narrow lands and wide groves, slow twist, about .006-7 deep seem to be the secret.

I am getting ready to order one, now I just need to decide....62, 69, or 73 cal!

 

[BS]

Some of my 50 yard work!

and ......my 73 cal.

These are Dary S's cartriges and pouch, also notice the tapered wood form used for rolling the paper to size.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I think you will have to use some kind of card wad, or felt wad under that ball and patch combination in that gun with 12 thousandths grooves. You are not filling the grooves and protecting the ball and patching from the gases. Using a wad may eliminate the use of paper " cartridges" for this kind of shoot, but you should get better and consistent velocities using the wads to seal the bore, which should then give you better accuracy. You could use your current " Cartridge", by just biting off the end, pouring the powder down the barrel, inserting a card or fiber, or felt wad into the barrel, and then the patched ball, and run the assembly down in one stroke. You might also consider running a lubed patch down the barrel after seating the ball, to help clean the barrel, soften the fouling in the grooves, and make it easier for the ball to travel forward down the barrel when you fire each shot. Enterprising folks use a rod with a cleaning jag on the end, with that lubed patch, to seat the ball on the powder and wad, so that the whole thing is done with just one pass of the rod.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If you do use a wad on top of the powder, you will be able to reduce the powder charge you are using to something that will not move your shoulder back quite so hard. Like maybe only 75 grains of 2F. After all, you are only shooting paper at this stage.

 

[BS]

If you do use a wad on top of the powder, you will be able to reduce the powder charge you are using to something that will not move your shoulder back quite so hard. Like maybe only 75 grains of 2F. After all, you are only shooting paper at this stage.

I went and checked my "notes" and I don't think I tried a wad under the paper cartriges......and I am a big 'wad' fan.......I use them under everting else........I will have to try them and see if they stop the 'blow by' with the deeper cut rifling.

My 62 shoots very well with a wad and patched RB with 80FF...........the 125 loads have a very mild kick also, not till you get to the 160-180FF do they start to KICK!

Wads, Wads, Wads, don't forget the WADs! :grin: :grin: :grin:

 

[scott k]

Lehigh... :redface:

 

[BS]

just tried some "WADs" over my powder!

After the first shot, I thought I had missed the paper with the second! [if you ever have shot hard lead, you will understand]

Third shot, I called low after the shot, and it was!

I will move the target out to 100 and try some more at a later date.

Some history on this barrel:

The most inconsistent barrel that I have ever owned. Especially with patched round balls! Why? Part may be the chatter marks in the bore. One really long section just above the LOAD, and some minor ones about 3"s from the muzzle.

In the past It has shot some good 50 yd. groups, but the 100 yd. are a different story.

I have been putting off "lapping" the barrel with a poured lead slug and compound.

We will see if the patches [wads] are the KEY!

OH!................the columns of paper were intact, not shredded like in the past. It looked like the wad held the gasses from cutting around the ball!

 

[BS]

A picture of the "used wads". They look like tapered accordians.

 

[paulvallandigham]

BS: Sure wish you would chronograph the before and after wad use loads and share that with our readers. That group tells me that you do have a good load, but I suspect that a lighter load may be just as good. The wad is protecting the base of the ball, and the patching, proving its utility. You should find that it also reduces standard deviation in velocity, which is how you shoot those small groups( with a good shooter behind the gun, of course! )

 

[BS]

BS: Sure wish you would chronograph the before and after wad use loads and share that with our readers. That group tells me that you do have a good load, but I suspect that a lighter load may be just as good. The wad is protecting the base of the ball, and the patching, proving its utility. You should find that it also reduces standard deviation in velocity, which is how you shoot those small groups( with a good shooter behind the gun, of course! )

That's a good idea, to check the speed before and after the wad.......I also think it will help diagnose some of my fliers at the 100 yard range.

It would be nice to know if the velocity changes when a 'drifting' shot appears. That may be key to solving the blown shots.

I still think most of my problen is the poor finish of the bore.

 

[BS]

If you go back a read [wheel weights for round balls] all my info is in that post, this should be the link:
Link to Wheel weights for round balls

 

[lyman]

I use wheel wieghts for all my casting [ my son is the tire manager for Costco ] Food for thought, save up as much lead as you can it may become very hard to get if those tree huggers have anything to say about it. I just shoot round ball in the Lyman GPR and have never had a problem with W/W for the last 25 years.
Bob

 

[rebel727]

I use wheel wieghts for all my casting [ my son is the tire manager for Costco ] Food for thought, save up as much lead as you can it may become very hard to get if those tree huggers have anything to say about it. I just shoot round ball in the Lyman GPR and have never had a problem with W/W for the last 25 years.
Bob

I shot wheel weights years ago. It was my experience that they're too hard and brittle. Most of them broke in half on impact.

 

[TN.Frank]

I've used WW metal for round balls as has been said, they'll come out just a bit larger then the pure lead balls. Stay away from any shinny WW because they'll contain zinc which won't let the metal flow into the mold properly, only use the dull lead looking ones. From what I've read you can also use a small amount of Borax to de-alloy your WW metal a bit. Just be careful because it'll expand and spit a bit then you put it into the lead. WW metal isn't all that much harder then pure lead IIRC so for general use(plinkin' small game) it should work just fine but for big game I'd personally want to use pure lead so it'll expand and transfer more energy.

 

[Bountyhunter]

I always shot pure lead or in a pinch plumbers lead, but the guys that were shootin wheelweights put a lot of wear on their barrels. Wheelweights wont obiturate into the rifling proplerly and they have a lot of antimony which puts wear on the barrel.

 

[TN.Frank]

I always shot pure lead or in a pinch plumbers lead, but the guys that were shootin wheelweights put a lot of wear on their barrels. Wheelweights wont obiturate into the rifling proplerly and they have a lot of antimony which puts wear on the barrel.

I could see where this would be a consern to a target shooter but I don't shoot enough to ware out a barrel either way so WW's or pure it's all the same to me. If I put 100 shots a year thru one of my muzzle loaders it's a big year for me, generally I'll only shoot about 15-20 shots a session and only do that 3 or 4 times a year, generally I'll check the sights before deer season by shooting 8 or 10 shots then that's about it. Pure lead is IIRC about a 7 on the BHS where WW metal is somewhere around 9. Don't quote me on that, just going from memorey and it's not what it used to be,LOL.

 

[paulvallandigham]

With a Patched Round Ball, there is no contact between the ball and the barrel, so it can't wear out the barrel! What you do have is a ball of a slightly different size- almost always larger, and that can make a difference on your group size when you don't adjust the thickness of your patch. If your gun has deep cut rifling, you may get gas cutting of your patch and ball using WWs, where using pure lead would seal the bore properly. If you see evidence of gas cutting, using a filler, or wads under the ball for your seal, and shoot away. For informal shooting, and most off-hand shooting, WWs work just fine.The difference in their hardness is not enough to affect much besides their diameter as cast.