Which states have a sidelock hunting season?

[kevindj]

I am a field rep for the NMLRA and a Trainer/Instructor for the muzzle loading discipline for 4-H.

I am trying to get a traditional sidelock only hunting season established for South Dakota. How many states other than PA have special seasons for external flint and caplocks?

I would appreciate any information. You can reply or email me direct at [email protected]

Thanks!

 

[Ron LaClair]

I'd like to know that also. We'd like to get a primitive season in Michigan

 

[kevindj]

In SD we have a nice long ML Deer season but the inlines have dominated it and for us traditional shooters it isn't much different than rifle season.

 

[wtilenw]

We had one until this year. The inline crowd :barf: cried discrimination loud enough and with the help of one of the F&G commissioners from Northern Idaho and an infamous inline promoter :barf: who supported a lawsuit against the IDFG they got included again. They still have to use loose powder and a full bore size all lead projectile. They also succeded in getting the number of permits reduced by almost 50% because of the anticipated increase in harvest statistics DUH!

 

[kevindj]

The inline crowd :barf: cried discrimination loud enough

I am sorry to hear of your loss, of a season, that is. At the risk of ruffling SOME feathers, most inline shooters I know are just rifle hunters wanting another tag or who didn't draw a rifle tag. :cursing: Most of them have no interest in history, or the sportsmanship involved in the traditional methhods.

The test of a traditional muzzle loader should be simple - if the ignition system didn't exist in 1850, you can't use it! :nono:




LFOD - Live Free or Die

 

[bigbore442001]

Massachusetts had a primitive arms season that involved a date. Any ignition system prior to 1865 could be used. Well someone did research and came up with some early inline actions and that helped changed the law in the Bay State.

You need to be careful how it is worded. Maybe something requiring an exposed hammer would be better?

 

[Len Graves]

As you know Ron our Mich ML season started out traditional only. I think dollar signs got in the DNR eyes. Now "muzzle loaders" can shoot conical bullets powered by brickettes. I wish we could go back to the way Pa Keeler and the boys had it in the first place. They worked hard to get a ML season.

 

[kevindj]

whoever did the research on inlines is correct. The exposed hammer is a another trap since guns like the T/C Omega have an exposed hammer.

We do have a very long ML season in SD and maybe I shouldn't rock the boat. Again, what I have found is that most ML hunters have tags for anything that moves and every season. I know a number of ML traditionalists that have given up because it has been difficult to draw a tag.

I think the state only has the ML season for doe management since the trend in rfle hunting is for the trophy, not the hunt or the meat.

Then there is the sportsmanship aspect. One store owner told me the night before the seaon opened, a man walked in and bought everything he needed, then asked how to load the thing. The owner then asked if he was going to have time to sight in and the response was, "it's a muzzle loader, why would I have to sight in?"

No respect!

 

[grizzy adams]

here in kansas , we have a special primitve muzzle loader hunt. It starts the same time as bow, think its oct 1 and also u can use a muzzle loader in regular firearm season , u can use any muzzle loader inline or caplock , scope or iron sights . only black powder or subitute ( 777 or prodex ) ,round ball or minnie . I have taken a few deer wiff my caplock wiff open sights .

 

[biliff]

FWIW, Here are the Oregon regs for muzzleloaders. They allow inlines, with alot of restrictions. Figure they must be O.K. if Toby Bridges singles 'em out as some of the worst muzzleloading regs on the books.

MUZZLELOADER
â–  Scopes (permanent and detachable), fiber optics sights, sights that use artificial light or energy and sights that enhance, gather, or concentrate natural
light are not allowed during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/
muzzleloader only, except for visually impaired hunters who have a visual acuity of ≤ 20/200 with lenses or visual field of ≤ 20 degrees (a permit is required;
please see page 88). Open and peep sights made from alloys, plastic, or other materials that do not have the properties described above are legal sights.
â–  It is illegal to hunt with jacketed bullets, sabots and bullets with plastic or synthetic bases during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts
where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/muzzleloader only. Conical lead or lead alloy bullets with a length that
does not exceed twice the diameter and lead or lead alloy round balls used with cloth, paper or felt patches are allowed.
â–  It is illegal to hunt with centerfire primers as an ignition source during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon
restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/muzzleloader only.
â–  It is illegal to hunt with pelletized powders or propellants during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction
of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/muzzleloader only. Granular (loose) black powder and black powder substitutes are the only legal
propellants during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/
muzzleloader only.
â–  No other firearm may be used for hunting during a muzzleloader-only season. See definition on page 82.
â–  Muzzleloading firearms with revolving actions are prohibited during muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon
restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/muzzleloader only.
â–  For muzzleloader-only seasons and 600 series hunts where there is a weapon restriction of shotgun/muzzleloader only or archery/
muzzleloader only, the muzzleloader must have an open ignition. See definition on page 82.

“Open Ignition” is an ignition system
where the percussion cap, frizzen, or
flint is visible and exposed to the
weather at all times and is not capable
of being closed or covered by any piece
of the weapon.

 

[TimJ]

Good luck.
I think the best luck you might have is getting a flintlock with round ball only early season. Maybe in Sept or early Oct. No way will the archery hunters want/allow adult 'rifle' hunters in the woods during the rut in early nov, can't blame them either. The inline guys would be all over the SD GF&P if they did not allow them in any season that you can pop some type of cap.

I just got my first caplock but would sure think about a flintlock if there was a special season just for them, especially early. All the youth are hunting then with rifles so it's not like the bowhunters have it all to themselves anymore.

Maybe promote it as a heritage season or something like that instead of primitive, that leaves it too wide open. I don't think there is any question that the first rifles in the Dakotas were flintlocks shooting round balls.

I think it would have to be an addition and not a part cut off of the current season. I highly doubt at this time you would get many 'any deer' tags for such a season though. At best I could see them allowing the use of the regular antlerless tags early if you use a flintlock.
Start small and well defined.
I'd have the success rates and regs for states with more traditional muzzleloader seasons in front of you when you talk to the GF&P.

btw I'd stay away from the game commission for now and try to get the men and women who know something, CO's and biologists, on your side first.

Tim

 

[jim m]

fish and game managements main priority with hunting seasons is to generate income. limiting a season to traditional methods would limit this. a flintlock season would be great but I think it will never happen.

 

[lonedave]

Nothing for traditional only here in Washington. In fact we did lose just a bit more with this years new 3 year regulation package. Still no scopes or primers allowed, but we'll see what happens in 3 years when they work up the next set of regulations.

 

[kevindj]

I appreciate the input. Our current season runs December 13th through January 31. Un filled 'Any Deer' tags convert to anterless after January 1.

Last year they issued 400 tags and for this year there will be 1,000 statewide. Doe tags are like archery - no limit to number of tags issued.

Okay, I know I should be thrilled that we have the season that we do. But what I see happening is that the majority of the 'any deer' tags go to non-traditional muzzle loader shooters. Heck, I think everybody that hunts deer applies for the tags - if they get one they go buy a muzzle loader.

My goal is really to give the traditional shooter the same chance or opportunity to take a trophy in a traditional manor (any buck is a trophy with a flinter). I like the concept of an early "Herritage Hunt', around here that might work.

If you have hunted in South Dakota in mid December and January you know that traditional muzzle loading is and extreme sport. Temperatures will range from 15 degrees to -30 not calculating wind chill.

A lubed patch becomes a piece of cardboard, any lube or fouling in the bore becomes tar, and you can hardly feel your fingers to seat a cap or prime your pan.

To avoid controversial ignition systems, flint lock only would be a good place to start.

 

[Ken Morrison]

Pennsylvania has a flint lock only season which starts on 12-26. It runs for 2 1/2 weeks +-.
Very nice time to hunt.

 

[luieb45]

That'd be nice if Illinois had a primitive season. It's just not fair that us flintlock and caplock shooters who take on more difficulty have to hunt the same date as inlines.

 

[jmforge]

Even with these restrictions, you could build a monster traditional rifle using the old Purdey 2 groove "winged' bullet express rifle setup. You would have a sidelock rifle that uses a full bore lead projectile that meets the 2 to 1 ratio and it would still be a 200+ yard gun with the potential to exceed 2000fps in the "smallbore" sizes.