Why the lack of

[Zutt-man]

patchboxes on fowlers? I realize some did, but it feels like original examples or versions of fail to have them. Was this simply, because it took more time and effort to make them?

Personal opinion: I love them. Hard to imagine a flintlock without a patchbox as they’re so practical. They also become a focal piece and add depth to the gun.

 

[SOLANCO]

Google "Perineal". Google perennial.

That aside, I like a patchbox on any muzzle loading sporting gun.

 

[tenngun]

patchboxes on fowlers? I realize some did, but it feels like original examples or versions of fail to have them. Was this simply, because it took more time and effort to make them?

Perineal opinion: I love them. Hard to imagine a flintlock without a patchbox as they’re so practical. They also become a focal piece and add depth to the gun.

Patch boxes were called butt traps in Europe. They became a feature on Central European rifles. Central Europe was rifle country. Their hunting culture was built around red deer boar and chamois.
The Low Countries, Britain and France tended toward small game hunting. Fowling, especially shooting a bird on the wing was the dominant hunting in these lands.they didn’t warm up to rifles, Central Europe didn’t warm up to fowling.
European gunmakers came to America they built the same old rifles an adapted them to American taste, including the patch box. Fowling gun makers tended to follow English or French designs, no butt trap
When the army started to make guns it made the European style musket, fowling guns on steroids, and no patch box. But when it made rifles, 1792,97, 1803, and later guns like the Mississippi rifle they got a patch box handy toy

 

[Robby]

I put them on a couple. At the time, had I been more knowledgable on the subject, I probably would not have done it. But I did and still like what it does for the gun(s).

Robby

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
The patch box was originally for what the name says, patches and probably some sort of grease. They were used on rifles. Fowlers were mainly bird hunting guns and loaded with shot not patched round ball (although they can shoot those as well) so the utility of a patch box was much less.

dave

 

[Zutt-man]

Google "Perineal". Google perennial.

That aside, I like a patchbox on any muzzle loading sporting gun.

Stupid fat fingers

 

[Zutt-man]

Hi,
The patch box was originally for what the name says, patches and probably some sort of grease. They were used on rifles. Fowlers were mainly bird hunting guns and loaded with shot not patched round ball (although they can shoot those as well) so the utility of a patch box was much less.

dave

This makes sense, although one would think they would’ve seen the usefulness of storing cleaning supplies or wadding inside.

 

[Brokennock]

I agree with the usefulness of a patchbox, and often wish fowling pieces had them... it means less stuff in the shot pouch. Mostly thinking this way because I am one of those who would keep things like jags/worms, ball puller, tow, and such in the box instead of the pouch. I would think some of the reasoning this utility was not seen by fowling hunters was that they probably didn't need it. They were probably less likely to have a problem than someone shooting a tight patched ball in a rifled barrel, and also were probably not out far from home or "farm" for extended periods of time. Being of upper class society they also probably didn't have to deal with the dirty problematic gun. They had a "boy" for that.

 

[Pukka Bundook]

With a sporting gun,
For shooting flying that is, there was never any need for a butt trap or patch box.
Everything was very conveniently at hand without.
The ramrod had a worm on the opposite end, either covered with a cap or not,
The wadding went in a side pocket, as did the powder flask, to ensure against sparks,
The shot flask on a belt over the shoulder, Or the shot belt (Shot snake to some) worn in similar manner,
A small rolled case fit in any pocket holding flints and a pick, plus a turnscrew. No need for any bags, just a jacket with decent side pockets.
A waistcoat was usually worn, and things like caps fit ideally in a weskit pocket.
For just a few or say a dozen or two shots, (how many pheasants can you eat all at once?) wads could fit in a weskit pocket too, Thin wads in top pocket, somewhat thicker wads in the lower pocket.
A bit of tow in another pocket, sometimes used also to hold shot in place, but used for wiping the bore if it became fouled.
No, all was taken care of with no need for a patch box.

Best,
Rich.

 

[dave_person]

Hi Guys,
You do occasionally see patch boxes on Germanic fowlers but they also had a vibrant rifle culture. The French and British had no such distinct culture and they both borrowed from the Germans when they produced rifles. Hence, their rifles often have sliding wood patch boxes like German jaegers. However, that influence appears not to have spilled over into their fowlers and of course many American made fowlers imitated British and French styles. I believe there are a few American examples of fowlers made in Germanic style that have patch boxes. Also, fowlers made in America were generally cheaper guns compared with rifles, sometimes half the price. So there might have been a price point common among buyers for fowlers that excluded much extra work like patchboxes. Of course, there are always exceptions and a number of fine and ornate fowlers were made in America demonstrating that some folks were willing to pay for extras.

dave

 

[springfield art]

Hi,
The patch box was originally for what the name says, patches and probably some sort of grease. They were used on rifles. Fowlers were mainly bird hunting guns and loaded with shot not patched round ball (although they can shoot those as well) so the utility of a patch box was much less.

dave

The grease hole on my Garner SMR, I filled with beeswax just to have it filled with something; didn't want to actually use grease in there, and it looks neat!