you say frizzen, I say...

[hawkeye2]

Are you referring to a hammer stall that is a device such as a leather cover put on the frizzel as a safety device?

 

[roundball]

Yes...

 

[Robert Egler]

If someone subscribes to the Oxford English Dictionary, it will tell when the words "frizzen" and "frizzle" are first found in print.

I have the OED, and frizzen isn't in it.

Spence

Well, as an Oxonian, I have to say if it isn't in the OED, its not an English word. :blah:
So I will never say it again. :haha:
(Luckily, we don't have an Académie française equivalent to rule on such things!)

 

[Black Hand]

..also known as a "battery" in period literature.

 

[Jumpshot]

I just say the sparks are struck between a rock and a hard place.

 

[Coot]

If someone subscribes to the Oxford English Dictionary, it will tell when the words "frizzen" and "frizzle" are first found in print.

I have the OED, and frizzen isn't in it.

Spence

Well, as an Oxonian, I have to say if it isn't in the OED, its not an English word. :blah:
So I will never say it again. :haha:
(Luckily, we don't have an Académie française equivalent to rule on such things!)

It's even in Webster's - you just have to use an unabridged copy. :wink:

 

[Robert Egler]

Doing some research on my own, I find that when 'frizzen' itself came into use is not clear, but the part of a flint lock that we're all referring to was called the 'frezell' in the 1600s. (Given period spelling variations 'frizzle' would be reasonably equivalent)

In the OED we find, from 1629: "He is euer readie to strik fyre with his frezell and his flint."

Also, an actual definition eventually appears in 1892: "Frizzle: In flint and steel guns the piece of iron acted on by the flint to produce the explosion."

Having thus proved (to myself if no one else :blah: ) that Frizzen is based on a historic English word, I can now freely continue to use the word. :haha:

 

[George]

In the OED we find, from 1629: "He is euer readie to strik fyre with his frezell and his flint."

Yes, I found the same thing. The quotation you give from the OED is confusing, though, because I have the two-volume OED, and it's not in that one. I tried to find that quotation elsewhere, but had no luck.

Spence

 

[George]

Squirrel Tail, I found further info. That phrase said to be from the OED shows up in the 1841 edition of the Scottish Dictionary and Supplement: In Four Volumes. A-Kut, Volume 1. Then, what is apparently the original is in “The last battle of the soul in death” by Mr. Zacharie Boyd, Minister of the Barony Church, Glasgow, 1629.

Spence

 

[Celt5494]

Interesting digging as usual Spence.
Another thought might be dates associated with the use of the phrase "Hammer Stall" which I came to understand (right or wrong) was a fairly historical term.

Just to throw another curve ball into the mix "Stall" could also be "Stahl" German for steel effectively refering to it as hammer steel? I really like these discussions and origins of words throughout time.

 

[Joel/Calgary]

Just to throw another curve ball into the mix "Stall" could also be "Stahl" German for steel effectively refering to it as hammer steel? I really like these discussions and origins of words throughout time.

Interesting possibility, but on the other hand, when you put your horse into the stall, or your car into a parking stall, etc. it's a place, a receptacle, or an enclosure, not a piece of metal.

Various on-line dictionaries give something similar to these for the origins:

Middle English, from Old English steall; akin to Old High German stal place, stall and perhaps to Latin locus (Old Latin stlocus) place; First Known Use: before 12th century

[Middle English stalle, from Old English steall, standing place, stable; see stel- in Indo-European roots.]

Regards,
Joel

 

[Wes/Tex]

Just to throw another curve ball into the mix "Stall" could also be "Stahl" German for steel effectively refering to it as hammer steel? I really like these discussions and origins of words throughout time.

Das Machine ist nicht fur Fingerpoking! :rotf:

 

[roundball]

I don't know about dictionary's definitions...but IMO, thinking about the context that was being dealt with back then, I believe the following to be the case.
The word "stall" in the phrase "Hammer Stall" means that the leather on the Hammer (what we call the frizzen today) causes the flint to stop (stall) when it gets to the frizzen...thus preventing an accidental discharge.

 

[Carl Fowler III]

Okay Roundball, what is that thingy you have under your flint...covering the pan? For photo purposes or some kind of shield perhaps? :v

As far as the frizzen name, I like rock sparker...Hmmm...that sounds like a good name for the next Hollywood mountainman movie star!

 

[roundball]

Okay Roundball, what is that thingy you have under your flint...covering the pan? For photo purposes or some kind of shield perhaps? :v

I had taken that photo for another forum to show what I do after loading the rifle to go hunting.
Its a strip of dry adhesive duct tape that I seal the vent with until I get where I'm going to hunt.
Prevents any chance of accidental ignition source from getting in to the powder, and also keeps out any moisture.
I peel it off, stick it on the offside lock panel while hunting, reuse it for the trip home.