Your fixes for 32 cal Crockett????

[410-er]

"A poor man can only afford the best!" :thumbsup:

 

[gizamo]

I bought my Crockett used. When I got it home I found the ramrod would stick at about three inches from where it should have. Turns out that some nimrod had loaded it up three times... :hmm:

I never blamed the gun for the idiot that did that and traded it in, nor the small shop that sold it. Never have blamed a gun for numnutz that owned it prior to me, or some idjit' that knew squat about maintaining one....

Take a Chambers Flintlock and give it to a fool to abuse for a year....then try to blame the maker for the problems with the gun. :shake:

Just sayin' that there is sometimes two sides to the story....

giz

 

[hithard]

So that patch sticking thing is bad? hummm...maybe that's why the ball hesitates to come out the barrel when the hammer drops, unlike my centerfire's. Geeeze, the ball-patch must be gett'n hung up too. I thought this was normal, know it sounds like it might be broke? yupp...broke...only shoots four leaf clovers, and not three...broke...

I could careless if the patches stick, thats what the little jag thing wiff them wires are for, or maybe not?

Sooner or later what ever little thing is stickin' to those patches will wear down...ya just need to shoot it more.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

I fail to see how leakage at the breechplug is dangerous, unless it is a huge leak. Remember that the tolerances of the original guns were far less stringent than todays, and many had breechplugs that could be removed by hand. Oddly enough, these guns didn't kill anyone in their years of service. So, a little seepage of liquid at the breech seems inconsequential....

However, I will agree that you get what you pay for, and a cheap gun is still a cheap gun.

I think that the point is this: Traditions is asking $434.00 for a Spanish made, birch stocked entry level gun with at least two known problem areas, one of which--the leaking breech--is an incredibly dangerous problem. It is easily recognized as such by any experienced muzzleloader, though a novice might well not realize the danger until his hair caught fire or, in a worst case scenario, the breech plug wound up in his sinus cavity. Considering the company's knowledge of the problem and the ease and low cost of fixing these problems, Traditions is showing a reprehensible lack of concern for its customers. But then it seems that some of their customers have a rather cavalier disregard for their own safety, so perhaps the company, the gun and these customers are made for each other. There is a certain symmetry in that I suppose...

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

So that patch sticking thing is bad? hummm...maybe that's why the ball hesitates to come out the barrel when the hammer drops, unlike my centerfire's. Geeeze, the ball-patch must be gett'n hung up too. I thought this was normal, know it sounds like it might be broke? yupp...broke...only shoots four leaf clovers, and not three...broke...

I could careless if the patches stick, thats what the little jag thing wiff them wires are for, or maybe not?

Sooner or later what ever little thing is stickin' to those patches will wear down...ya just need to shoot it more.

But you should care! When you buy a gun it should be in working condition. And when the problem has been pointed out to the distributor and nothing is done to fix the problem, you are dealing with people who are either incompetent or just don't care about their customers. And as long as customers such as yourself are willing to accept shoddy workmanship that is what you will get. I have no idea as to your level of experience, but from your post you sound very young and maybe cannot afford a better gun right now. Perhaps, if that is the case, as you mature you will come to realize that you deserve better. :v

 

[Billnpatti]

I don't have a .32 Crockett but I recently purchased a .50 cal. Hatfield that had a similar problem. It would snag a cleaning patch and the breach scraper would not turn when it was all the way down the bore. I removed the barrel from the stock and de-breached it. What I found was that the nipple drum actually was too long and protruded into the bore about 1/16 inch. I removed the nipple drum and ground off enough so that it was flush with the inside of the bore. I reassembled my gun and found that the patch snagging problem was solved and that my breach scraper would reach all the way to the breach and could be turned to scrape any fouling off the breach just as it was intended.

While it is a bit drastic, you might try removing the breach plug and see if anything is protruding into the bore that would snag your patches.

 

[hanshi]

I've seen this same thing occur with costly custom guns; vent liner a fraction too long. This common glitch doesn't reflect on the quality of the piece necessarily and is easily corrected. Sometimes just shooting it enough will remove burrs left over from manufacturing. Things do slip by QC on occasion. I once bought an S&W revolver and when I got it home noticed the barrel wiggled in the frame. No threads had been cut on the frame end of the barrel!

If any make of firearm is a potential time bomb, you'll hear verifiable accounts, not "I heard about....". There will be recalls, too. My main concern would be the price of any "production" gun.

 

[hanshi]

Should mention, MANY production rifles have what is called (I think) a "patent breach". This is a smaller than bore size, shallow "hole" cut in the end of the breach face rather than having the bore end in a flat, full caliber breach. This sometimes makes them more difficult to clean especially in the smaller calibers. A bore size patch/rod won't fit in the tiny recess. Stuck patches are easily removed and there are rod tips designed for this. IMHO this is a non issue.

 

[J.D.]

IMHO, the issue isn't sticking patches, the issue is leaking breeches and drums. Apparently, the patch thing is only a symptom of a larger issue.

If none of y'all care about your eyes, fingers, and fellow shooters, go ahead and shoot 'em as they are. I hope and pray that nothing bad happens, however, IMHO, it is beyond lunacy to continue to shoot a gun that has known safety issues. At least have a competent gunsmith check out those guns for safety's sake.

timetohunt,
Keep us informed as to Traditions response.

God Bless,
J.D.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

If you are getting stuck patches on a regular basis, it is an issue. Along with the other, more serious issue of gas leaks at the breech, this is or at least should be, a deal breaker. If the price of saving money when buying a gun is a dangerous flaw and a rough breech that snags patches, then you have not gotten a bargain at all. Only the rankest newbie or someone awfully easy to please would consider these things acceptable and be naive enough to post that they are non-issues on a public forum. At the price that Traditions is gouging people for these things, such problems are shameful and unforgiveable.

 

[gizamo]

Ok, is this a problem with the current production guns...? Or is this a problem with past production?

Somebody needs to quantify this. It's gettin akin to the Ford Pinto's and gas tank explosions. Because one period in a company's history had some obvious product issue...such as Ford Motor Co....Do you blanketly label all of their production as dangerous forever?

I have three current production Traditions rifles. Two caplocks and one flintlock. Not one exhibits any of the problems identified here. All are excellent guns in my opinion.

giz

 

[hithard]

Actually my take is what the heck do you expect for the price you pay for one of these. We have a supply and demand type economy here, even if it is Kalifornia. Ya get what you pay for.If ya don't like it don't buy it, save up. The gun does not leak,so no worries there, and if you know where your patch is hanging up you'll know what the problem is, I do. A couple of years at Lassen College in the smith program helped form that opinion.So no problem. As for my age, well it's not relevant. As for afford, I'm not put'n a 1k gun in my 11yr olds hands to go beat'n around the ranch with.

As you'll notice I have not made statements about anyone here in any reguards, unlike you. So please re-think your maturity statements.

If I'm guilty of anything it's not telling the original poster to either return the gun or take it to a qualified smithy. But those are obvious choices.

Your opinion may differ, and I do respect that. Keep your powder dry Pilgrim.

 

[timetohunt]

I just got this gun this summer from Traditions so I assume that it is a current production gun and not an older one. I still don't have the barrel back yet and am still working with Traditions to get this resolved.

 

[Zonie]

I don't own a Crockett but as I understand the problem it is that the breech plug is short.

Because it is short, the plug stops on the rear face of the barrel leaving a gap between the end of the rifling and the face of the breech plug.

When someone runs a patched jag down the bore to the breech face the patch sometimes becomes lodged in this gap which then keeps the jag (and cleaning rod) from being removed.

My fix for this problem would be to fill the gap with a metal spacer.
This fix would require removing the breech plug (and very likely the nipple drum to allow the breech plug to be unscrewed).
Then, by measuring the distance from the rear face of the barrel to the shoulder where the threads stop and the bore starts I would know the depth that is needed.
Measuring the distance from the shoulder on the breech plug to the breech plugs face would be the next dimension that is needed.
Subtracting the plugs dimension from the barrels dimension would tell me the thickness of the spacer that I would need.
When making the spacer I would make it about .001 (one thousandth of an inch) thicker than the gap so that when the breech plug was reinstalled it would be pinched or compressed in its location.

Steel would make the best spacer although brass or copper would work quite well. After all, brass and copper make excellent high pressure gaskets and in addition to filling the void a gasket is the second function of this spacer in this application.

I would also polish the bore side to a mirror finish (as I do with most of the breech plugs in the guns I've built).

When reassembled, the gap would be gone, the breech of the barrel would be sealed and I would be a happy camper.

I don't know why Traditions doesn't contact the Spanish company that makes these rifles and very strongly suggest that they fix the problem.
Maybe our members are the only ones who really use their guns so the thousands that are sold to non shooting folks and end up hanging on the wall as a decoration seem to make the problem less important?
I don't know why this problem wasn't fixed years ago but I agree with those who feel the company should fix the problem.
When a brand new product has a design defect, even if it is a low cost product, the company making it has a duty to fix it.

 

[hanshi]

I'm definitely not a newbie and not particularly easy to please. The posts concerning the gas leaking problem are worth considering but I have seen no evidence of this in my particular rifle. As far as sticking patches goes, I just don't see this as a symptom of a dangerous problem. Though I've never encountered such a problem in any gun I've ever owned. I'll agree that if a patch is "there to stay" after reasonable attempts to remove it with the proper tools, a problem exists but not one with life and limb risks. I can't imagine a patch so firmly attached at the breach that it will not and can not be removed. If this IS the case, by all means remove the breach plug, send the gun back, see a gunsmith or whatever is necessary. We want to enjoy our sport not struggle to make our equipment work safely. :thumbsup: :hatsoff:

 

[timetohunt]

Apparently these breech plugs are not removable, and should you manage to remove one it voids your warranty. So I am still waiting on Traditions to come up with a solution.

 

[timetohunt]

The problem is the jag gets stuck and is almost impossible to remove. I managed to get my neighbor pulling on the ramrod and me on the gun and luckily it came free. It should never have gotten stuck in the first place.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

My take is this: if you are willing to settle for a gun that comes with built-in problems that's your choice. I would never put something like this in the hands of my eleven year old son or anyone else's son for that matter. A gun that snags patches might be something of a turn off to a young user don't you think? I sincerely wish you good luck with the gun and hope all remains well. :v

 

[Leatherbark]

Thread the end of your jag for a 10-32 thread and screw a pan head screw in the end of the jag for a built in "Stop" to impede the passage of the patch into this recess. Then use your "Worm" to clean out the breech area..Or get a 10-32 to 8-32 adapter and use a slotted rod tip.................Bob

 

[F.G. Ford]

Dear JD,
You have such a way with words!
BUT you do tell it like it is.
They are manure!
Old Ford