Unplugging patent breech? Loaded rifle…

Stykbow said:

Well yeah, but if someone using so much oil it puddles up then they’re doing it wrong.

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Wonder why the topic comes up so often?

Stykbow said:

You’re on the right track. Pull the nipple, dribble in some powder and shoot it out. Out of curiosity, when you cleaned did you pull the nipple to pump water thru it? I’m with @Phil Coffins on this one. I always pop a cap or two before loading on a clean barrel. It’ll dry up any leftover oil and push out any crud.

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That’s exactly what I have done and would do. If it didn’t work the first time I woul try it a couple more times before I resorted to a ball puller.

If you have to resort to a ball puller use a good range rod with a T handle and hook the handle on something that isn’t going to move and pull the rifle not the range rod.

Ditch the 777 it has the highest ignition temperature of the substitute powders.

Bob

Horizontal Hunter said:

That’s exactly what I have done and would do. If it didn’t work the first time I woul try it a couple more times before I resorted to a ball puller.

If you have to resort to a ball puller use a good range rod with a T handle and hook the handle on something that isn’t going to move and pull the rifle not the range rod.

Ditch the 777 it has the highest ignition temperature of the substitute powders.

Bob

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All I use in my ROA if I can’t get my hands on some Swiss 3F or any real deal 4F. Never an issue in the revolver.
I have around 3/4 pound of Swiss 3F. Will switch to it, 20-30gr under a couple 50gr T7 pellets. Last time I shot that load (.54 GPR) it holed a beer can at 60yds the first shot.

SDSmlf said:

Wonder why the topic comes up so often?

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Simple, they’re using too much oil.

Grimord said:

One caution when using the c02 discharger. Sometimes, the c02 blasts a hole thru the powder and exits the projectile, but leaves a ring of compressed powder around the inside of the barrel like a donut. With the next loading, you may get a hangfire, or will have a much larger powder charge that may affect your sight in point of impact. When using these dischargers I run a bore scraper down the barrel to dislodge any remaining powder ring before re-loading.

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I've never experienced this or heard of it in 30 years of using one back when we had a local territorial match 1 of the guys adapted a 15 lb fire extinguisher for the matches but then most of the use was for dry balls

Rebel bull said:

I've never experienced this or heard of it in 30 years of using one back when we had a local territorial match 1 of the guys adapted a 15 lb fire extinguisher for the matches but then most of the use was for dry balls

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I have seen it twice in my 45 years of shooting BP guns. Once it happened to me with an old T/C New Englander. I unloaded the gun at the end of deer season using the c02 discharger, ran a patch with Barricade down the bore and put the gun in the safe. The following fall, I went to load the gun with my standard load and noticed the witness mark on the ram rod was a 1/2" above the muzzle. I pulled the ball and dumped the powder, then ran a patch down the bore and it wouldn't go all the way to the breech. A bore scope look showed the ring of powder around the walls of the barrel. I had to scrape out the powder with a breech scraper.
The other time a friend had the same ting happen to him
I suspect that in both cases, the load was heavily compressed and the powder became stuck to the barrel over time.

I've found on my T/C that I can take a slotted tip in the .30 cal range from my cleaning kit, stick a cotton cleaning patch through about halfway, and fold the remainder of the patch over the rounded end of the tool to clean out the breech. Seems to work famously on my rifle.

100 gr T7 3f = @ a min. 120gr BP
Mag cap not needed

And ya didn't remove the nipple so the paten breech is all gunked up.

#BPBReloadingFFL said:

100 gr T7 3f = @ a min. 120gr BP
Mag cap not needed

And ya didn't remove the nipple so the paten breech is all gunked up.

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Magnum caps were all that was available the last few years. Freshest tin I have. I keep 10s and 11s on hand. Have taken the TC hunting years ago, only shot the GPR for fun a couple times. Friend I inherited them from rarely shot either, so got probably 300 11s along with the rifles.

Punched through the breech blockage. When the rain stops (Hurricane Francine remnants) will try shooting it clear.
Nipple pick and a stiff paint gun cleaner, think wire core plastic bristel pipe cleaner…

When I shoot my TC 56 SB I learned many years ago that after wiping the bore with alcohol to clear the RIG from the bore I then shoot a blast of brake cleaner thru the nipple. Never had a problem with doing that it fires every time with a #11 cap.

SDSmlf said:

I’ve got bad habits too, but learned early on that too much oil in a muzzleloader breech was one that had to be kicked.

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My wife keeps me well informed as to my bad habits.

So this is a recurring theme: "TC such and such, with a patented breech won't shoot". Not being sarcastic here at all, but I have 2 "cheap, cr_ppy, budget" Ardessas that fire every single time with very good accuracy, and 2 TC Hawkens that are a royal PIA. I can make them both shoot with t-7 and cci #11's, but they are very fussy about ignition, until you have the bag of tricks down, and one is a terrible shooter [crappy bore] with everything I have put through it. And the other is no more accurate than either Ardessa. Guess which rifles I take hunting ? And both TC's have chronic flash channel/nipple issues that my other 2 rifles don't have. And I don't have to play nipple roulette to figure out what my Ardessas like. I can spend more money for more durable nipples for them, but they won't go bang any better. I walk into my local SGS and grab a 2 pack of Traditions nipples and back in business. No endless debates about the best nipple for an Ardessa. [or CVA]
So what is all the nostalgia about TC coming back to life with the same old Hawken ? How about an American company producing a moderately priced Hawken with a moderately higher price, reflecting better wood, fit and finish, better ramrod and ironing out the drawbacks of the TC ignition design. It happened in Spain with an American original. Maybe it could happen in America, even better, for a few dollars more. It wouldn't hurt either if the accuracy climbed a notch over the original TC's.
I notice, as well, a steady stream of threads complaining about the same problems with the Euro and Japanese TC Hawken knockoffs. I like the solid feel and walnut of the TC's, but their issues are just not that attractive to me.
I really wanted to love them, but they turned out pretty frigid. SW

SeaBee133 said:

Deep cleaned my TC .50 “Hawken” last week. Had fluid running out of the nipple. Dried, lightly oiled, kept muzzle down.
Got it out this evening. Loaded in the house, went out back, brand new tin of CCI #11 Magnum caps. Triple 7 3F 100gr load, lubed patch and ball (noidea how old, was white). 5 good hard cap set off strikes. Pulled the nipple, dislodged some crud. Tried again, no change. Ran the pick into the breach, hitting either the ball or a hard obstruction.
Is it safe to pull the nipple, add 5-10gr of Swiss 3F and try to fire it out? Did the breech plug ingest the entire charge and the round is blocking the channel? Not sure that is actually possible…
I know I can, and likely should, just use a ball puller. First time the rifle has been loaded in at least 10 years. Almost never have to pull a revolver ball.

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What do you mean by “fluid”? You may have been using something that will not loosen BP fouling.

Actually used a blackpowder solvent. Some Ballistol product (labeled) that is in reality a cheap Chicom knock off. Wife picked it up with a .50 cleaning kit and patches.

SeaBee133 said:

All I use in my ROA if I can’t get my hands on some Swiss 3F or any real deal 4F. Never an issue in the revolver.
I have around 3/4 pound of Swiss 3F. Will switch to it, 20-30gr under a couple 50gr T7 pellets. Last time I shot that load (.54 GPR) it holed a beer can at 60yds the first shot.

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OK I am going to say it. The ROA is basically an in line. So of course it would handle synthetic powder better. By the way Precussion sxs double guns are also basically an inline.

Kudos' go to Idaholewis for this image of his cut-down TC breech which he'd posted way back in 2019, as it clearly shows the patent breech and the angled flash channel in which some crud could impede flash from the nipple.



When I had a TC Hawken, I'd use a .36 or .40 cal bore brush (in a .50 bore) to get it into that rounded part of the breech. You can get a small diameter pipe cleaner into that channel too, but make sure you blow out any lint from it afterwards, And, as was noted above, popping off a cap or two before loading -- aim at a leaf or blade of grass on the ground, and you should see it move from the gas pressure -- will also help prevent any misfires.

Hope this image helps you "see" what the issue could be.

Old No7

"Freedom and the Second Amendment... One cannot exist without the other." © 2000 DTH

SDSmlf said:

cap on. Personally, have always relied on a clean oil free dry bore.

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That works very well for me too.

IME: There's no need to pop caps prior to loading a well maintained rifle.

flconch53 said:

OK I am going to say it. The ROA is basically an in line. So of course it would handle synthetic powder better. By the way Precussion sxs double guns are also basically an inline.

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Have one of those as well. A Moore and Harris that has basically been shot apart. Stock is split between the locks, barrel ends are razor thin, checkering is worn to just shallow lines… It’s at the local history museum, which was built on the shotgun owner’s property. Confederate veteran, state house member after the war.

This recurring discussion is the reason all my percussion guns are drum and nipple with a cleanout screw. Just avoid the problem.