Ramrod difference??

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Banjoman

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On a half stock muzzleloader, have you noticed a difference in accuracy with the ramrod in the thimbles vs out of the thimbles when shooting? As soon as I get a chance to shoot again I’ll try it myself. Until then, I’d like to hear from y’all.
 
On a half stock muzzleloader, have you noticed a difference in accuracy with the ramrod in the thimbles vs out of the thimbles when shooting? As soon as I get a chance to shoot again I’ll try it myself. Until then, I’d like to hear from y’all.
I have never noticed a difference but then again, I've not looked for a difference either. When I shoot from a rest I remove the rod. Mainly because I rest the barrel near the muzzle and don't want it resting on the rod.
 
On a half stock muzzleloader, have you noticed a difference in accuracy with the ramrod in the thimbles vs out of the thimbles when shooting? As soon as I get a chance to shoot again I’ll try it myself. Until then, I’d like to hear from y’all.
Yes. It can be quite minor to OMG.
 
I’d never really thought much about it beyond thinking I hunt with the rod in place, so I sight in that way. I’d be interested in what you find out if you test it.
 
Just how in the world would a ⅞” or 1” x 28 to 30” barrel, with a soldered or screwed on solid under rib be influenced by a 5/16” or ⅜” wood ramrod?
Don’t make sense.
Might have something to do with resonance???
I don’t know, never have purposely fired with out the ramrod under the gun.
Had a mentor Old Shultz , when I was 19 who saw me step up to shoot with the rod leaned against the table
Told me to make sure the rod is put back in. If you get used to leaving it out you’ll be in the woods load and leave it against a tree and it won’t be where you need it when you need it.
So I’ve always tried to do that
 
Just how in the world would a ⅞” or 1” x 28 to 30” barrel, with a soldered or screwed on solid under rib be influenced by a 5/16” or ⅜” wood ramrod?
Don’t make sense.
Doesn’t make sense until it does.

Try a solid brass ramrod if you want to expand your subject matter knowledge. Personally found some impact variation inside of 100 yards, though limited testing at 300 yards with paperpatched bullets a 24” square target was relatively safe compared to consistent 4-6” groups with a no ramrod out of the same gun. Based on a spotter’s observation that bullet impacts were high, low, left and right of the 24” target along with a few hits after 10 shots. Did not test with a wooden ramrod as it was of no interest to me at the time, so uncharted territory if you want to test.

I’m going to stay with actual range testing over ‘how in the world’ speculation every time.
 
Just how in the world would a ⅞” or 1” x 28 to 30” barrel, with a soldered or screwed on solid under rib be influenced by a 5/16” or ⅜” wood ramrod?
Don’t make sense.

A feller I used to work with several years ago swore up and down that it made a difference in a half stock muzzleloader. Something to do with the resonance.

I’d forgotten about this till recently so I gotta go try it as soon as I get a chance. If it matters where you rest the gun on a sand bag then a ramrod in or out might make a difference. It might make a difference in some guns and maybe none in others.

For hunting it makes sense to leave the ramrod in while sighting in and hunting. But if you’re just target shooting and the gun shoots better without the ramrod, there might be something to it. I’ll let you know what I find out.
 
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I was thinking about this very same subject a few days ago.

Surely it has to make a difference in resonance, even if it is a small difference. I would think the snugger or looser the ramrod fit would be liable to change the resonance even more. I wish I had the time and the equipment to give this theory a test

Is there a meter or a gauge of some sort that can be attached to a barrel to measure such things, that doesn't cost as much as a house?
 
Just how in the world would a ⅞” or 1” x 28 to 30” barrel, with a soldered or screwed on solid under rib be influenced by a 5/16” or ⅜” wood ramrod?
Don’t make sense.
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Just how in the world would a ⅞” or 1” x 28 to 30” barrel, with a soldered or screwed on solid under rib be influenced by a 5/16” or ⅜” wood ramrod?
Don’t make sense.
Its like a dieter counting calories! You can't see it but it must be there? I dare say that the shooter has more effect on accuracy than a ram rod? LOL!
 
Interesting question. Haven't ever thought about it. But actually makes sense to ask it. I load with a range rod and the ramrod just stays in place for loading and shooting, and I know I'm always irritated by how the brass tip gets discolored from discharge. So it makes sense that there's likely some effect from the gas impacting and being deflected by that tip. Whether it happens after the ball is already well past, I can't guess.

Anybody here have the ability to take some super slow-motion video?

I think it's a bit of a stretch to assign any difference to barrel harmonics. These aren't free-floating barrels, and the mass of the ramrod is very little compared to the mass of the forestock.

Ahhhhh ..... just re-read the OP and see he refers to a half-stock gun. Hmmmm .... maybe never mind my last comment? :dunno:
 
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Well I suppose it (might) make a difference. Due to any barrel moves during firing. The wave or resonance of the barrel fluctuating can affect impact. Modern center fire barrels are sometimes floated to free the barrel of this.
I’ve never thought about it since a muzzloader has some mounts such as a forearm orca full stock and is attached to the wood. Plus the ramrod is just needed.
Now I will say this. I’ve had underammers that shot extremely accurate but still had a small forearm and the ramrod was still there.
 
Accuracy is the visible effect of the projectile leaving the barrel at the exact same point in barrel harmonics from shot to shot. I was taught that attachments such as a bayonet will affect the harmonics.

A solidly attached rib may or may not affect it. I personally think it might because it's still not an integral part of the barrel. But being solidly attached may minimize the effect to the extent of being almost negligible.

But a ramrod is not. Particularly if you use the ramrod and replace it after loading, it undoubtedly has an effect. Since it'll never be replaced in the exact same position from shot to shot a potential variation in barrel harmonics is achieved. Very slight difference in how deep it is seated on the thimbles, slight curves in the RR, slightly harder or or softer places in it, heating up or cooling down during the shooting, changes in humidity possibly creating different densities, all potentially creating different amounts of pressure somewhere could create variation in the harmonics.

A half stock may very well be more affected as a full stock has the "support" out to the same point near the muzzle all the time. Helping to negate the effect of the ramrod.

As long as your gun is doing is performing to your needs/expectations, more an exercise in mental gymnastics than anything.

Load, shoot, enjoy.
 
Accuracy is the visible effect of the projectile leaving the barrel at the exact same point in barrel harmonics from shot to shot. I was taught that attachments such as a bayonet will affect the harmonics.

A solidly attached rib may or may not affect it. I personally think it might because it's still not an integral part of the barrel. But being solidly attached may minimize the effect to the extent of being almost negligible.

But a ramrod is not. Particularly if you use the ramrod and replace it after loading, it undoubtedly has an effect. Since it'll never be replaced in the exact same position from shot to shot a potential variation in barrel harmonics is achieved. Very slight difference in how deep it is seated on the thimbles, slight curves in the RR, slightly harder or or softer places in it, heating up or cooling down during the shooting, changes in humidity possibly creating different densities, all potentially creating different amounts of pressure somewhere could create variation in the harmonics.

A half stock may very well be more affected as a full stock has the "support" out to the same point near the muzzle all the time. Helping to negate the effect of the ramrod.

As long as your gun is doing is performing to your needs/expectations, more an exercise in mental gymnastics than anything.

Load, shoot, enjoy.
I agree with your statement and might add that anything added or taken away will effect how a rifle performs.If you can't take something away you can cancel it out by adding weight to the barrel. A thick heavy barrel is used in target rifles because of this very thing. Muzzle loading rifles by their nature are heavy barreled therefore It is logical to think that something the weight of a ram rod should make little difference to the accuracy of the rifle? Am I right? I don't know but I don't worry about the weight of a ram rod when I am shooting>
 

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