:haha: just looked at your avatar BB and now have silly image of a brown bear trying the same :rotf:
B :hatsoff:
B :hatsoff:
28 gauge double shot load
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Mr. Brown Bear, 2nd attempt to answer and post pictures. Shotgun was purported to have been a flinter, I can see a plug in barrel ahead of cap area. Barrels are 28" long end to end, stock looks good, possibly refinished. it is light around 6.5lbs. There are no markings anywhere on rifle, I have not taken off the locks yet. Will try to do pictures again,
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54ball
62 Cal.
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That gun looks to be a restock with original parts. The lock inlets look "fresh". The stock has some, what I consider "modern features.
Could have been done within the last 50 years or so and well carted for.
Nice gun :hatsoff:
Could have been done within the last 50 years or so and well carted for.
Nice gun :hatsoff:
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What a sweet little gun! Small gauge doubles are scarce as hen's teeth, so you're fortunate to have it.
Don't even think of parting with it, unless of course, it goes to a guy named BrownBear! :grin:
Don't even think of parting with it, unless of course, it goes to a guy named BrownBear! :grin:
So funny, when I saw that heading my fist thought was why would any one load a double amount of shot. :haha:
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Well Mr. Brown Bear, tried the shotgun today at our monthly shooting day. Both barrels failed to pop the cap. I got them to fire if I held the trigger in and pulled the hammer back as far as possible and let her go. Seems the hammers are dragging on the edge of the nipple as strikes the cap. looks like it is dragging on the side of the cap as the hammer goes over it. One member of our club suggested I grind the side of the hammer opening, not sure if I want to do that as it looks like it has a bronze bush around the edge of the opening. I am going to pull the locks tomorrow to see if spring strength can be increased or if I can figure out a way to have the hammers lock back further than they are now. They have plenty of more movement, they seem to lock too far forward.
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Cleaning and lubing the locks might be all you need to do. You can also look into shorter nipples.
I'm betting that gun had a long and happy life and worked well until it's later years without mods. Then later in life someone changed to longer nipples or failed to adequately clean and lube the locks.
Still sounds like a great gun, and I most certainly wouldn't go to hacking on it!
I'm betting that gun had a long and happy life and worked well until it's later years without mods. Then later in life someone changed to longer nipples or failed to adequately clean and lube the locks.
Still sounds like a great gun, and I most certainly wouldn't go to hacking on it!
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Mr. BB, I chucked the nipples in a lathe and shortened them a bit, seemed to help. Tried them again and it took at least 3 times of cocking them and letting the current spring action to fire them. Looking at the mating of the nipple and the opening of the hammer, one can see that they are off to the side in different directions. When a cap is on there I think it is hitting the side more than a direct hit. I am taking it apart today to check to see what's up. Don't know if I have to shim the hammers out or what, but I won't do any hacking. Think maybe it used different style caps like musket?
When I get the hammers off I will take a picture of the opening, so we can take a look.
When I get the hammers off I will take a picture of the opening, so we can take a look.
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Here is a picture of the hammers, the opening are .208 and .211 in diameter, maybe a little small. they looks like they have a copper sleeve around the hole. As far as the locks, well there are not many parts that match from one side to the other, tightened up the internal screws and lubricated them. Seems the stock needs some repair on the left lock area, so I will do that.
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Musket caps would be much too large for the nipples. I would try and remove the copper looking inserts, or grind a taper on them to allow clearance for the caps.
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Huh....
I've never seen anything like those inserts in the hammer cups, but there are much bigger brains than mine with lots more experience.
I'm with bpd303 on lightly tapering the inner radius of each. Looks like a pretty tight squeeze for caps as they sit right now, but I'm ready to be vetoed by anyone more familiar with them.
I've never seen anything like those inserts in the hammer cups, but there are much bigger brains than mine with lots more experience.
I'm with bpd303 on lightly tapering the inner radius of each. Looks like a pretty tight squeeze for caps as they sit right now, but I'm ready to be vetoed by anyone more familiar with them.
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I haven't seen anything like those copper sleeves in a hammer before.
That is a new one on me!
B :hmm:
B :hmm:
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In the 1800's some caps were made out of copper.
I wonder if what you are seeing are caps stuck in the hammers from firing?
Copper cups in the hammers would reduce nipple damage.
I wonder if what you are seeing are caps stuck in the hammers from firing?
Copper cups in the hammers would reduce nipple damage.
They would also tend to dampen the hammers blow.
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I may be wrong but if I remember correctly primers back then were more shock sensitive and nipples were not as durable as stainless ones are today.
Looking at those copper inserts it seems someone for reasons I can't figure intentionally put them into the hammers.
They are not old cap fragments because those would appear as unequal layers, not the obviously filed flush condition we are seeing.
The small inner diameter is the most likely thing that is causing your guns problems and if the gun were mine I would remove them.
This would probably envolve drilling them out to a larger size and then prying the remaining material out of the hammers with a pick.
Even if some small amount of copper were left at the bottom of the pockets the hammers would not tend to "hang up" on the percussion caps so in all likelihood they would fire much more reliably.
They are not old cap fragments because those would appear as unequal layers, not the obviously filed flush condition we are seeing.
The small inner diameter is the most likely thing that is causing your guns problems and if the gun were mine I would remove them.
This would probably envolve drilling them out to a larger size and then prying the remaining material out of the hammers with a pick.
Even if some small amount of copper were left at the bottom of the pockets the hammers would not tend to "hang up" on the percussion caps so in all likelihood they would fire much more reliably.
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So far I have drilled them to a larger size (.234) and beveled the edge with a countersink bit. Waiting for the repairs to dry on the stock so I can install the locks and see what happens.
After I drilled them out a bit, I could see that they are brass inserts, not copper.
After I drilled them out a bit, I could see that they are brass inserts, not copper.
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Well guys, final report. Repairs on stock are dried, installed locks and hammers and gave it a try, right one fired, left one hung up. Took hammers off drilled them to .250, tried again same result. I could see that the left hammer was nipping the cap on the way down, marked the spot with a marker and used a dremel to elongate that point just a bit. Tried them again, success.
When I tightened the screw holding the locks in the stock, the right lock started acting up, it would not hold when cocked,, half spot gone. Took it apart again, saw issue was parts of the internals were cocked as they were slightly different thickness. Shimmed them up to equal height, deepened the relief in the stock where screws were bottoming out. Tried them again after everything was tightened and not wobbling around, bang, bang!!
When I tightened the screw holding the locks in the stock, the right lock started acting up, it would not hold when cocked,, half spot gone. Took it apart again, saw issue was parts of the internals were cocked as they were slightly different thickness. Shimmed them up to equal height, deepened the relief in the stock where screws were bottoming out. Tried them again after everything was tightened and not wobbling around, bang, bang!!
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Wow!
That's my kind of love story! :wink:
Sincere congratulations on getting that sweet gun back in action. May it serve you and your descendants with distinction! :hatsoff:
That's my kind of love story! :wink:
Sincere congratulations on getting that sweet gun back in action. May it serve you and your descendants with distinction! :hatsoff:
