.40ish single barreled, Half stock shotgun

[Old Shepherd]

Does anybody still have one of those little half stock .40 cal shotguns that Dixie Gun Works sold back in the 60's or early 70's?
They had a long steel ramrod with a brass tip and made in a very utilitarian fashion. They were like having a handy single shot
.410 shotgun only a muzzle loader. The locks were marginal at best but they were fun and cheap to feed. If you do, do you still play with it?
Old Shepherd

 

[Old Shepherd]

The sound of crickets on this one don't surprise me. As stated above these were at best cheaply built and probably haven't survived past being given to a child as a play gun. I never owned one but worked on one for a friend when I was back in my 30's. The lock internals were all soft and wore quickly. I annealed and repaired and re-worked rounded edges. Then hardened and tempered the pieces and the lock worked well for him. All in all the work was worth way more the whole gun was worth. I charged him beer money and figured it was good practice. However the concept of a .40 or .41 caliber muzzle loading "Barn Yard" shotgun appeals to me. Hence my inquiry. So how about this. What is the smallest bore or diameter smooth bore or fowling piece that you may be acquainted with? I may build one myself in a year or two and would like some thoughts from the tribe.
Old Shepherd

 

[ppg1949]

I have one of the DGW shotguns. It is my preferred woods gun. But mine is 13.3mm or .526. Weight is about three and a half pounds. My usual charge is 55 grains of whatever I have and 3/4 ounce of shot. The only things I have done to it, is refinish the stock and give it a proper ramrod. The stock was that crappy burnt orange color but underneath was a nice dark wood. I bought it because it said Dixie Gun Works 28 gauge and I wanted a 28 gauge single barrel. But at 13.3mm it is a 32 gauge but still loads of fun. It also shoots a heavy patched .490 round ball reasonably well out to twenty yards. I did a thread on these guns some years ago and there are several members who have or had them.

 

[Old Shepherd]

Thank you for your reply. If you can remember back to your thread, did anyone say that they had smaller or larger tubes on the little guns? I wonder if they just built whatever size of barrel blanks they had until those ran out and then went to the next size. I remember when Dixie had just a whole pile of Belgian made barrels of odds and ends. That would of been a good way to sell them.
Old Shepherd

 

[ppg1949]

Mine at 13.3mm was one of the smaller ones that was listed. I had to inquire to the thread responders about the millimeter size. Most were 13.9 & 13.8 with one at 14.1, so none were apparently below .526. These were all Spanish made. I have never seen one with Belgium proofs. When I was a teen in the 60’s almost every outdoor magazine had ads for similar shotguns. I think Turner Kirkland missed it when he discontinued these little guns. I even looked into having some made. I contacted the old owners of Deer Creek Products but they had sold all their old barrels but they put me in touch with a barrel maker in the south. His prices plus stocks and furniture would have a kit cost of about $200 my cost. He would not sell less than ten barrels at a time but it included patent breech plugs. I gave up on the idea trying to sell kits. But I’m sure some one could piece together one in a smaller caliber if you were willing to buy everything seperate.

 

[Billy-by-gosh]

YES! I'd like to find an inexpensive little gun in a 40-44 bore diameter (smooth bored). Maybe with a 24-28 inch barrel length with a slightly thick external muzzle diameter. Here in the U S A we can still shoot single ball loads; I believe a stiff powder charge in these bores would give high velocity, low trajectory, and real possibilities of long range accuracy, yet with low felt recoil. AND it would be a perfect shotgun for barnyard pests, or, for hunting small upland game!

 

[ppg1949]

Britsmoothie routinely uses a 45 caliber smoothbore to hunt. His looks like a Kentucky rifle.

 

[OldRust]

I've had more than a few of these small bore Spanish and one Belgian manufactured single barrel shotguns over the years. The Belgian was a 10mm bore and unmarked as to the manufacture like a lot of the old Belgian guns are. I can't remember the phrase in French that I was told by an older Belgian Engineer acquaintance, but it was basically Garden Gun to keep the hare out of the cabbage.

The couple of Spanish guns that were stamped Dixie had the locks completely worn out and were pretty much parts guns.

Now in my opinion they aren't Kibler's but the older better quality guns along with the proofs are stamped by the manufacture, one a 10 mm AyA Aguirre y Aranzabal manufactured in 1929 and an A.A. Azanza y Arrizabalaga 28ga a true .550 bore manufactured in 1949. Neither of these two are stamped Dixie. I still have the 28ga and its my go to gun for a bunny or squirrel walk.

I understand a lot of them were exported to Africa and South America and sold to the natives for monkey or bird guns. Not sure of the time or date range of that.

A side note I personally will not shoot round ball out of these little guns as they were proofed at lower pressures. Only shot and never hot loads for me.

Thanks,
O.R.

 

[Old Shepherd]

OldRust,
Thank you very much for sharing. The gun I wrote about working on must have been a 10mm. If memory
serves me I loaded it with only 25 grs of 3F and about 30grs by volume of #8 shot. I used news print for wadding and a stamped out milk carton over shot card. Fun to shoot and effective out to about 40 feet before the pattern opened up. I want one if I can find one or as stated above I will build one of sorts.
Old Shepherd

 

[ADK Bigfoot]

I will soon be the proud owner of one of these in .50 caliber smooth bore. I will have more details when I get my hands on it.

ADK Bigfoot

 

[planefixer da50]

funny you should ask. today finished n shot my .410. used a stevens bolt,had seller saw off reveiver so no FFL. used underhammer reveiver n stock. drilled n taped barrel for 5/8 x18, used grade 8 bolt cut to fit barrel n receiver. metal set threads into barrel. reamed n polished choke area. load 35gr 3f,1 teaspoon cornmeal,to fill chamber area. 410 shotcup 10z #6 n overshot cards. nice pattern at 30yds. terroize tree rats. was fun mike

 

[ppg1949]

planefixer da50, Sounds really interesting. How about a couple of pictures? Was the barrel a full choke before you polished it?
Thanks for sharing.

 

[OldRust]

OldRust,
Thank you very much for sharing. The gun I wrote about working on must have been a 10mm. If memory
serves me I loaded it with only 25 grs of 3F and about 30grs by volume of #8 shot. I used news print for wadding and a stamped out milk carton over shot card. Fun to shoot and effective out to about 40 feet before the pattern opened up. I want one if I can find one or as stated above I will build one of sorts.
Old Shepherd

The 10mm was a fun little gun and had a decent pattern especially when I used a Skychief type load with a 1/4" olive oil soaked felt wad on top of the shot column.
I picked up an old parts gun last year that has an interesting barrel. 46" long .43-.44 caliber smoothbore tapered octagon to round. I'm thinking about building it into a full stock fowler but that is way down in the project pile.

Thanks
O.R.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I have one of their 28 gauge spainish made shotguns that I shoot both 530 patched roundball and shot out of. I shoot 3/4 ounce shot in a paper cartridge over 55 grain FFG . Shooting round ball it is an excellant gun for candle shoots, and shooting shot it has gotten many many rabbits and pigions. I had to remount the lock It was quite low quality assembly but safe to shoot. When I got it in the late sixties I could shoot it for 2&1/2 cents a shot while 12 gauge shells were 10 cents each.

 

[Grenadier1758]

The 10mm was a fun little gun and had a decent pattern especially when I used a Skychief type load with a 1/4" olive oil soaked felt wad on top of the shot column.
I picked up an old parts gun last year that has an interesting barrel. 46" long .43-.44 caliber smoothbore tapered octagon to round. I'm thinking about building it into a full stock fowler but that is way down in the project pile.

Thanks
O.R.

That parts gun barrel is indeed interesting. I would be inclined to make a full stock smooth rifle. Not much different from a fowling gun, but it would have the architecture of a rifle and sights. Maybe it could have set triggers.

 

[OldRust]

The barrel started out life in a full stock as the tenon slots for a full stock are present, and it has a rear sight. It is interesting enough that I'll start another thread with pictures. I don't want to hijack @Old Shepherd 's thread.

Thanks
O.R.

 

[Old Shepherd]

OldRust,
I look at this thread as a very pleasant visit with like minded friends. I have already learned a lot and have enjoyed the experience greatly. Anything you could share, particularly pictures would only be icing on the cake.
Old Shepherd

 

[earlwb]

I have a .40 cal smoothbore. I got it way back circa 1966 or thereabouts too. Mine was made in Brazil. I got it at the LGS at the time. I used it quite a bit at the time. But I stopped using it when I was in the military in the 1970s. After getting out I only used it sporatically. I do not know if DGW imported and or sold it though. I dug out some photos of mine.I still have it. It was my very first muzzleloader too. It looks like Firearms International imported it. I had very little sportsmanship when I hunted with it. I ambushed the doves or quail on the ground and rabbits when I could. I wanted the meat at the time. I got quite a few birds and rabbits with it too. it is a fun gun to shoot.

 

[poker]

I have one made in belgium that has a .50 bore. From what little I researched it, I think it was made for the brazilian trade. Its a nice piece only weighing a tad over 3 lbs.

 

[OldRust]

OldRust,
I look at this thread as a very pleasant visit with like minded friends. I have already learned a lot and have enjoyed the experience greatly. Anything you could share, particularly pictures would only be icing on the cake.
Old Shepherd

Old Shepherd,

I'll post some more pictures of the Spanish shotguns tomorrow. For now here are some photo's of the 10mm and a message I posted last July on the What did you do today thread.

Thanks
O.R.