.62 rifle range results

[pamtnman]

With all the posts/threads lately about big bore hunting rifles I am sorely tempted to ask Colerain to make me a .62 caliber barrel with the following attributes

1. 37" long** swamped** octagon-round rifle barrel** w/a double-tapered flared muzzle
2. Modified & shortened, Honaker, S.W. Virginia profile, Wythe & Pulaski Counties (Rice M-L)
3. 4140CM steel construction
4. Barrel Dimensions
1.500" A.t.F. octagon × 0" = Breech
1.356" A t.F. octagon × 6"
Transition from octagon to round × 14.8"
0.900" × 18" = Beginning/Waist
0.900" × 30" = Ending/Waist
0.960" × 35" = Start/Flared Muzzle
1.080" × 37" = Muzzle
5. 3/4"-16 × 0.500" deep threads for the breech plug
6. 60° crown, later modified to radius crown
7. 2:1 ratio, gain twist rifling
8. 1:168" rate of twist at the breech
9. 1:84" rate of twist at the muzzle
10. .62 caliber
11. 0.620" bore diameter
12. 0.632" groove diameter
13. 0.006" deep square bottom grooves
14. 8-groove Forsyth rifling
15. 4:1 ratio, of groove width, to land width
16. Circumference equals Pi times Diameter
17. C = πd
18. C = 3.24 × 0.620" bore diameter
19. C = 1.9468"
20. 1.9468 ÷ 8 grooves/lands = 0.24335"
21. 0.24335" ÷ 5 (4:1 ratio, groove width, to land width) = 0.04867"
22. 0.04867" = the width of the 8 lands
23. 0.04867" × 4 = 0.19468"
23. 0.19468' = the width of the 8 grooves
24. Flint, 2-pc, fowler-style, hooked breech plug & tang set
25. 6" long beavertail tang w/an integral, 1.500", across the flats octagon × 5/16" thick, recoil shoulder face plate
26. Plate pierced, fitted, and tightly mated to the rear face of the barrel/breech plug & the hook
27. 0.500" long thread journal w/integral hook
28. Integral to the top flat of the rear 6" of the octagonal breech**Talley**scope ring**dovetail bases w/recoil shoulders**machined directly into the top flat of the barrel**by Dove's Custom Guns**325 Ingleside Rd.**Princeton, WV 24739** 1-304-425-2023 **www.doveguns.com ** [email protected]

This type of barrel would have all the attributes of a regular Forsyth barrel, but with Colerain's gain twist rifling. Which, if it works anything like it does with a patched ball with deep grooves, then it would possibly allow for a gentler transition after ignition from the very slow, 1:168" twist at the breech, to the slow, 1:84" twist at the muzzle.

RJ, Colerain does gain twist a lot. We have several guns with Colerain gain twist barrels, and they are accurate.
I did ask Colerain to make this .62 barrel out of 4140, and while I don’t recall the actual response, it had something to do with getting and using up especially hard cutting dies. So I went with their standard leaded steel.
The length of this .62’s barrel is 34”, after the Folsom rifle it copied. Good luck with your plan, I hope you do it. For most of us, these dream projects are far and few between, and time isn’t slowing down to wait for us. People here will cheer you on, especially when you take a critter with it.

 

[EC121]

Here is my Joe Schell .62 with a 42"Hoyt gain twist barrel. It shot well with 85gr. of 2F Goex at 50yds. A few years ago I accidentally shot through one small deer at 20yds. and also killed the one behind it. I used a .595 ball and heavy canvas patch. Sold it a while back.

 

[thompson50]

I have a .62 cal rifle built by Michael Roby and it has a 36” Colerain barrel. I have used from 90-125 grains of 2Fg Goex and Swiss. The Swiss did much better and it seems to like 110 grains. I got some 11/2 F Swiss that I plan on trying soon.

 

[pamtnman]

Nice guns, guys! Thanks for the loading info, Thompson. EC, Two deer at once is a golfer’s hole-in-one. Wtg.
The .62 is possibly the bp equivalent of a 427. Makes pretty much any car a hotrod. Sorry if the mixed metaphor is out of synch here

 

[pamtnman]

I have a .62 cal rifle built by Michael Roby and it has a 36” Colerain barrel. I have used from 90-125 grains of 2Fg Goex and Swiss. The Swiss did much better and it seems to like 110 grains. I got some 11/2 F Swiss that I plan on trying soon.

Thompson, at what distances are you shooting it? Does it need more powder to hit point of aim at 100 yards than at 50 yards?
And what is the rifling like, deep or shallow?

 

[thompson50]

Thompson, at what distances are you shooting it? Does it need more powder to hit point of aim at 100 yards than at 50 yards?
And what is the rifling like, deep or shallow?

The rifling on the barrel is .016 and I found with that amount of powder. I can hold dead on at 50 and just cover the bull at 100 a have the best results. My rifle is a 10 pound Hawken so recoil is not bad.
That was while using 100 and 110 grains of Swiss 2Fg. I want to try 11/2 Swiss, which I just got the other day. Range time this weekend and I’ll report back.

 

[hanshi]

I know of quite a few hunters who use and prefer heavier loads; I used to be one of them. In the .50 I liked 100 grains of Goex 3F and 80 grains in the .45 and they would really shoot! The .50 reached out and dropped deer at 100 yards and a little beyond that. Those loads were accurate as well. Another .45 rifle I had loved 60-65 grains of 3F and would drop deer at 75 yards. But in the last few years I've found 70-75 grains is very accurate in the .50, .54 and .45 and still performs with excellence in the field. I even killed deer with 110 grains of 3F in my .54; so I have no qualms about going heavier.

My .62 is a smoothbore and shoots ball almost exclusively. It does well with 60 to 100 grains of 3F and gives decent accuracy with most loads. I consider the smoothbore to be a 50 to 75 yard deer gun and the best load I've found is 75 grains for 1300 fps. Fifty yard groups have averaged about 2-1/2" for 3 shots and takes deer very well. Were I to hunt bigger stuff, elk, moose, you better believe I add more powder; and I'd likely use harder alloy ball.

With the velocities you're likely getting with heavy loads I'd suggest going to a harder ball for the really big stuff. A soft ball on elk, say, may not give the needed penetration or break large bones. Good luck with that very fine rifle.

 

[pamtnman]

I know of quite a few hunters who use and prefer heavier loads; I used to be one of them. In the .50 I liked 100 grains of Goex 3F and 80 grains in the .45 and they would really shoot! The .50 reached out and dropped deer at 100 yards and a little beyond that. Those loads were accurate as well. Another .45 rifle I had loved 60-65 grains of 3F and would drop deer at 75 yards. But in the last few years I've found 70-75 grains is very accurate in the .50, .54 and .45 and still performs with excellence in the field. I even killed deer with 110 grains of 3F in my .54; so I have no qualms about going heavier.

My .62 is a smoothbore and shoots ball almost exclusively. It does well with 60 to 100 grains of 3F and gives decent accuracy with most loads. I consider the smoothbore to be a 50 to 75 yard deer gun and the best load I've found is 75 grains for 1300 fps. Fifty yard groups have averaged about 2-1/2" for 3 shots and takes deer very well. Were I to hunt bigger stuff, elk, moose, you better believe I add more powder; and I'd likely use harder alloy ball.

With the velocities you're likely getting with heavy loads I'd suggest going to a harder ball for the really big stuff. A soft ball on elk, say, may not give the needed penetration or break large bones. Good luck with that very fine rifle.

Thank you for your nice post here

 

[pamtnman]

The rifling on the barrel is .016 and I found with that amount of powder. I can hold dead on at 50 and just cover the bull at 100 a have the best results. My rifle is a 10 pound Hawken so recoil is not bad.
That was while using 100 and 110 grains of Swiss 2Fg. I want to try 11/2 Swiss, which I just got the other day. Range time this weekend and I’ll report back.

I measured this Colerain barrel today. It is 0.615” across the grooves, and its grooves are .007” deep, which is shallow.
Also, this rifle weighs exactly nine pounds. In case I forgot to answer one of the questions.

 

[thompson50]

I measured this Colerain barrel today. It is 0.615” across the grooves, and its grooves are .007” deep, which is shallow.
Also, this rifle weighs exactly nine pounds. In case I forgot to answer one of the questions.

I didn’t measure mine with calipers, I looked on colerain’s website.

 

[LME]

Life showed up, and all my weapons were sold. No regrets.

I,m there as well friend. I sold off all my weapons except a few sentimental pieces I want my boy to have. I have had a great ride with few regrets!

 

[Notchy Bob]

It was mentioned that the butt plate was cast by Mr. Wheland, as there was no similar butt plate available commercially. How about the trigger guard? Was that a custom casting, also, or a standard type available from the vendors? I would also be interested in knowing what lock was used.

I looked at the photos of the original Folsom rifle owned by Little Bat Garnier, and you guys did an outstanding job replicating the original, including the adjustable rear sight. I might add that the original appears to be a fairly typical "Indian rifle" of the period, very similar to those produced by Henry Leman, except for that. I'll bet "Little Bat" had that rear sight put on as an aftermarket modification, as he was said to be a very skillful marksman, and I'm sure he recognized the benefits of the adjustable sight.

Thanks!

Notchy Bob

 

[pamtnman]

It was mentioned that the butt plate was cast by Mr. Wheland, as there was no similar butt plate available commercially. How about the trigger guard? Was that a custom casting, also, or a standard type available from the vendors? I would also be interested in knowing what lock was used.

I looked at the photos of the original Folsom rifle owned by Little Bat Garnier, and you guys did an outstanding job replicating the original, including the adjustable rear sight. I might add that the original appears to be a fairly typical "Indian rifle" of the period, very similar to those produced by Henry Leman, except for that. I'll bet "Little Bat" had that rear sight put on as an aftermarket modification, as he was said to be a very skillful marksman, and I'm sure he recognized the benefits of the adjustable sight.

Thanks!

Notchy Bob

Mark Wheland had someone who I can’t recall right now cast that butt plate. It’s a one-off. If someone wants to make another copy, we will have to use this gun’s butt plate as the mold. Mark probably spent more time getting this butt plate exactly right than he spent on any other component. We collaborated in person several times, using different wooden mock-ups and comparing them to the photos, measuring relative size to the full-length barrel photo we printed, and when it was cast and roughly shaped, we met again to get it fit exactly to my arm/ shoulder. That involved a lot of hammering, bending, and filing. We tried to match the arch of the original crescent, but we also had to make it work for me. That resulted in it being opened up a lot.
The trigger guard I think is from Track, but again, Mark had to do custom bending and filing to get it to fit me just right. Out of the box that finger curl was too tight, and Mark carefully bent it back. These modern trigger guards are apparently more bronze than brass, so they are harder and therefore harder to work with. Definitely not malleable like brass.
I think Mark made the trigger from scratch. The lock is I think RE Davis. I’m pretty sure it is.
You are undoubtedly right about Little Bat having that after-market rear sight added. It’s unusual for that time. It obviously worked well for him, and from the four shots I’ve put through the gun, it works perfectly for me.
Thank you for the compliments. This was a team effort: Colerain made the custom barrel exactly to spec; Davis makes a good percussion lock (I wanted Chambers but they didn’t have one at the 2019 Dixon fair); Earnest the former curator at the Fort Robinson Museum sent every possible real-time photo of the original rifle to me; the Hanson book on Plains rifles showed the Little Bat rifle that started me on this quest. And of course Mark Wheland tied it all together. To be honest, he was pretty skeptical when I originally proposed this to him. And he was still skeptical when I brought him the first piece of curly maple, and my butt plate mock-up. But he hung in there the whole way, to the bitter end of fine tuning the lock the way I wanted it, fitting the trigger guard and sights etc etc, and he gets the most credit.