Antique Firearms

[TDM]

Sorry, double post.

 

[TFoley]

Oh, and semi auto’s existed long before 1933 btw, in fact before 1900.

Yup. I know that, but here in UK centre-fire semi-autos are called 'prohibited firearms', so us plebs can't have them.

 

[Feltwad]

I have always maintained that 1860-65 is a safe cut off time for antique firearms in a muzzle loading forum, raising it to 1899 will surely cause problems it will open the door to breech loaders for which they are also classed has antique
Has the date at present is 1865 there were some breech loaders built prior to that date such has pinfire and underlever hammer guns, but they were not allowed in any forums so this rule should along with repros still stand
Feltwad

 

[earlwb]

I support the 1899 date too. That was basically the date that smokeless propellants started replacing black powder as a propellant. This was the date that they started mass producing guns that used smokeless propellants as we know it for today. Yes they had guns before then but 1899 tends to be the cutoff date.

I think that as long as they are muzzle loading and aren’t considered a modern inline then it is OK for this forum. But this winds up being a grey area of sorts though.

 

[TDM]

I have always maintained that 1860-65 is a safe cut off time for antique firearms in a muzzle loading forum, raising it to 1899 will surely cause problems it will open the door to breech loaders for which they are also classed has antique
Has the date at present is 1865 there were some breech loaders built prior to that date such has pinfire and underlever hammer guns, but they were not allowed in any forums so this rule should along with repros still stand
Feltwad

I agree.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I like the 1899 cut off date. Many antique Muzzleloaders were made after 1865. Especially shot guns. They often show up in identifying thread. As long as they use a cap or flint and aren’t a post Civil War in line or breechloaders there is a place for them.

 

[toot]

I agree with Kansas Jake, a lot of heavy false muzzled target muzzleloaders were made up to 1899, I believe. so I will go with what ever prevails. jmho.

 

[Relic shooter]

Now the question arises whether this gun is still in the topic


View attachment 174722View attachment 174723
View attachment 174725

Beautiful piece with unique technology & craftmanship, way ahead of the times !!!



















The British military also created a breech-loading flintlock rifle..
Early Browning percussion rifles featured 5-shot harmonica type magazines, similar to our Civil War revolvers & percussion Sharps rifles.
The term 'Antique Muzzleloaders' covers more types of firearms than those that load from the muzzle.
relic shooter
Kuna, Idaho

 

[Relic shooter]

Speaking as a competitor & former antique arms seller at muzleloading events over the past 60 years I also
support the 1899 date.
Many of us favor a particular era or type of black powder firearm that 'fit' into the Muzzleloading Category.
Do we really want to ban the following types of very early historical black powder firearms & include our Colt & Remington revolvers as well ??

During our American Revolution the British military created a breech-loading flintlock rifle &
early Browning percussion rifles featured 5-shot harmonica type magazines & similar technology was adopted to create our percussion
paper cartridge firing Civil War revolvers & Sharps rifles.
Please keep in mind that the term 'Original Antique Muzzleloaders' also covers the above types of flint & percussion era firearms..
relic shooter
Kuna, Idaho

 

[TFoley]

Speaking as a competitor & former antique arms seller at muzleloading events over the past 60 years I also
support the 1899 date.
Many of us favor a particular era or type of black powder firearm that 'fit' into the Muzzleloading Category.
Do we really want to ban the following types of very early historical black powder firearms & include our Colt & Remington revolvers as well ??

During our American Revolution the British military created a breech-loading flintlock rifle &
early Browning percussion rifles featured 5-shot harmonica type magazines & similar technology was adopted to create our percussion
paper cartridge firing Civil War revolvers & Sharps rifles.
Please keep in mind that the term 'Original Antique Muzzleloaders' also covers the above types of flint & percussion era firearms..
relic shooter
Kuna, Idaho

Sir, the British military did not 'create a breech-loading flintlock rifle', but Patrick Ferguson did, in spite of the opposition of the British military.

 

[Relic shooter]

Sir, the British military did not 'create a breech-loading flintlock rifle', but Patrick Ferguson did, in spite of the opposition of the British military.

Of course your absolutely correct , my bad for injecting military & omitting Mr. Ferguson's name.
I was just reinforcing the unique percussion pistol posting by forum member Bayer 1957.. Some forum members may not be aware of the different varieties of flint & percussion firearms & in my humble opinion should not be omitted from this proposed new Original Antique Firearms category.

 

[John Strong]

My vote would be for pre 1860. Anything later than that could muddy the waters in my opinion.

 

[Uncle Miltie]

Must be 1865 as per the forum rules as they exist now. “Original guns” will open too many doors as I have an original TC Renegade with a 4 digit s/n. That makes is like 50 years old! Oh, and semi auto’s existed long before 1933 btw, in fact before 1900.
You near sighted folks don’t want this subforum you have the opportunity to create here turning into an unintended mess I assume?
Walk

Of course your absolutely correct , my bad for injecting military & omitting Mr. Ferguson's name.
I was just reinforcing the unique percussion pistol posting by forum member Bayer 1957.. Some forum members may not be aware of the different varieties of flint & percussion firearms & in my humble opinion should not be omitted from this proposed new Original Antique Firearms category.

The first Hall rifles (Model 1819) were made with flintlock ignition and I think would qualify as well.

 

[Walkingeagle]

Honest opinion, the moment we accept non-muzzleloaders, even if it is an original and within the pre determined date, this entire forum need not exist. This is a muzzleloading forum, for muzzleloader enthusiasts.
Walk

 

[TDM]

Honest opinion, the moment we accept non-muzzleloaders, even if it is an original and within the pre determined date, this entire forum need not exist. This is a muzzleloading forum, for muzzleloader enthusiasts.
Walk

Yes, yes, and yes.

 

[Notchy Bob]

Honest opinion, the moment we accept non-muzzleloaders, even if it is an original and within the pre determined date, this entire forum need not exist. This is a muzzleloading forum, for muzzleloader enthusiasts.
Walk

Absolutely! Muzzleloaders only, on this forum.

Well said, @Walkingeagle .

Notchy Bob

 

[toot]

Sir, the British military did not 'create a breech-loading flintlock rifle', but Patrick Ferguson did, in spite of the opposition of the British military.

that name sounds a lot like a SCOTSCH ONE to me?

 

[Dave Fox]

Beautiful piece with unique technology & craftmanship, way ahead of the times !!!





Fiend Foley: Presuming you're speaking of the Revolutionary War Ferguson breechloading rifle, the British military had nothing to do with its development and all examples were manufactured by private contractors. The British Army adopted it on a very limited basis, equipped a small unit led by the inventor with it, and quickly withdrew the rifle from issue after the inventor was seriously wounded and out of action for some months..













The British military also created a breech-loading flintlock rifle..
Early Browning percussion rifles featured 5-shot harmonica type magazines, similar to our Civil War revolvers & percussion Sharps rifles.
The term 'Antique Muzzleloaders' covers more types of firearms than those that load from the muzzle.
relic shooter
Kuna, Idaho

 

[Feltwad]

There are patents of early breech loading weapons which go back to flintlock, and beyond which will be debatable enclosed is images of a military flintlock rifle which can be loaded from the breech or the muzzle
Feltwad

 

[Dakota459]

My vote goes for 1899 to include the muzzleloading target rifles.