Aqua Fortis and Potassium Permanganate

[GKChesterton]

Has anyone tried the Potassium after the Aqua Fortis (Gonna do the Nitric acid/water/nails mix)as recomended in some texts? Curious because in some posts on the forum seemed to be some negative comments about Potassium--but haven't seen anything commented on with it being used together. Thanks!

And P.S. How much do you mix for one rifle, so as not to waste any

 

[Nifeman]

Hi, mix 1 tsp of Potassium Permanganate in a pint of water.
If your mixing acid, the mix is 1 part Nitric acid to 2 parts water in a heavy glass jar ( I use an Apothocary type)and add the acid to the water(very Important). Put in 4 ought steel wool as much as it will dissolve. JUST REMEMBER TO BE SAFE.
When using the acid mix, heat the stock with a blow dryer after you wipe it. Whisker the stock with 320 grit paper and repeat. Once you have it desired darkness, give a fil LIGHT whiskering or rub down with a pad of the 4 ought and rub in boiled linseed oil.
I don't know how the potassium and wood works. I use it for ageing my knife handles (stag and bone) and it works great.
Hope this works for ya, just remember fooling with acid or any other chemicals is Dangerous and use all precautions...Bud

 

[MikeChapin]

I have not used permanganate after Aqua Fortis but have used it as a primary stain. There should be no problem with it after you neutralize the Aqua Fortis. It stains the wood brown with no red whatsoever. You do have to be careful with it because it will stain the wood black if too much is used. A dilute solution will give a nice brown tone on top of the red.

I would use a test piece to get the tone right before using it on the stock.

 

[Dave K]

I had used potassium permaganate once on the wood. Never again from my experience. It did not penetrate into the wood and looked horrible after a full week of hunting. Came home, stripped the gun and refinished it with Homer Danglers stain. That was several hunting seasons ago. Still looks good.

 

[rich pierce]

I've used potassium permanganate with good success. I use it after AQF without neutralizing until after both stains are on. It gives a wonderful deep reddish tone to walnut by itself. Works great to stain horns too.

On a block of curly maple:

I wish I could remember for sure which is which on all the panels but I know panels D and F had potassium permanganate added. D was nice and deep and really emphasized the curl but F was kind of purplish.

I use something between B and E for Bucks County guns, E for Lehigh, D for anything aged as it can be rubbed back to lighter easily. The color in C works for many styles. Every piece of wood reacts differently with chemical stains.

 

[rich pierce]

Here's AQF with iron, varying numbers of applications, etc.

 

[pathfinderifh]

I have a Tenn Mt. gun {50 cal. smooth} that I used potasium permaganate on,it was beautiful on the birds eye maple, but where ever your hand is used,the color fades terribly. It didn't go back to white,just a lot lighter. I only use it for horns and bones now. :m2c:

 

[dlemaster]

Dave K
I used Potassium Permanganate along with the nitric acid/iron filings mix for years and never had a problem. I put the nitric acid on and heat to get it to blush then put on the potassium permanganate till the stock is very dark, almost charred looking. I neutralize it with a strong solution of baking soda. I then rubbed it back with fine steel wool and boiled linseed oil to the desired color. It leaves the high spots of the curl that nice reddish brown of the nitric acid and the stripes are very dark almost black. The color reminds me of the color of some originals I've seen.
When you mix up the potassium permanganate the stain will be a very dark purple color and when you put it on the wood it will look purple to start with but will turn brown to black shortly.
I also don't understand how it would not penetrate the wood. I had to remove the stain a couple of times and found I had to sand the he!! out of it to get back to bare wood. It penetrated as well as any water based stain I have ever used.

Regards, Dave

 

[Dave K]

I had the same experience as pathfinder had. It just went real light in color where my hands were.Looked great before I put the gun to real use. Yes, it had finish on it! But it was also a BLO finish and I spent allot of time in damp weather that week, wearing wool gloves. After I refinished the stock, I used tung oil also. I have hunted now several years and no change in condition of color or finish and it was in one hunt that was a real RAIN! Just an experience for me I don't need to repeat. :results:

 

[GKChesterton]

Wow, great stuff and the pics are outstanding--want to get in there and mess something up!

The instructions I have are very similar to what Dave DVLMSTER is doing.

Just thinking out load here but: what if putting it on after the AQ till almost black then rubbing it back with the BLO will stop the fadding problems that people are noticing?

Also would an automotive plastic type funnel be ok to pore the Nitric acid?

Thanks,
Chris

 

[dlemaster]

On Saturday I talked with Tom Strofeldt, who was the master gunsmith I apprenticed with, Who said he had tried potassium permanganate and had had it fade on him. I then dug out an old rifle I made 35 years ago using the staining method I described above. If anything it looks to me like it may have darkened a little over the years except at the normal wear points.
Anyway I just wanted to point out that even though I didn't have any problems others have. I don't know how to explain that. I think it may be in the neutralizing process.

GKChesterson: You should be OK using A plastic automotive funnel. They are pretty inert.

Regards, Dave

 

[Zonie]

Just showing my ignorance, but was it potassium permanganate or Chromium Trioxide that sometimes turns a stock green after a while? ::

 

[bioprof]

I believe that it is chromium trioxide.

 

[Runner]

You had me wondering there. There is a local builder that claims to use Aqua Fortis because that is the way it should be. Many of his guns take on an ugly green tint that I can't stand. I was pretty much sure I never wanted to use that method. Then I see some of the stocks displayed here, and I see some real beauties. What is it that makes the green problem? I never want it anywhere near a gun I am working on!