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arbor
- Thread starter brubincam
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The part that the cylinder rotates around.
Just generally speaking the thing the cylinder rotates on is called a cylinder pin.
To me, this is a good description for the cylinder pin in a gun like the Remington New Army where it is a simple, removable part.
Although it is often called a cylinder pin in the open top Colts, I think the huge part that is firmly attached to the frame and holds the barrel in place as well as locating the cylinder deserves a more robust name so I call it the cylinder arbor.
To me, this is a good description for the cylinder pin in a gun like the Remington New Army where it is a simple, removable part.
Although it is often called a cylinder pin in the open top Colts, I think the huge part that is firmly attached to the frame and holds the barrel in place as well as locating the cylinder deserves a more robust name so I call it the cylinder arbor.
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Yeah, that's a good descriptive term for open frame guns. In solid frame guns the cylinder pin is often referred to as the base pin. Mike D.
Of course you're right about the cylinder pin. I should have clarified, that the arbor or cylinder arbor was used in the open top Colt revolvers. :bow:
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Actually I doubt a short arbor hurts anything in reality. It is nice to have a stop in the end of the arbor well for repeatable consistency in wedge protrusion/fit but when using a feeler gauge it is not necessary. What is important is that both sides of the rear of the wedge bear evenly on the corresponding barrel slots, which if not always true. The other (angled side) of the wedge (muzzle side) should fit the middle raised cam area of the arbor slot so that the barrel thrust foreword is on center line. I think that when the cam is off to one side of the arbor slot it contributes to windage issues.
Another opinion I have is that the cylinder gap should actually be a bit narrower at the top, when at battery, then at the bottom because when the ball or bullet hits the forcing cone and the arbor flexes it will in actuality be out of square in the opposite direction if it starts out square . If it starts at square I bet dollars to donuts it isn't when the ball hits the cone, in this case effecting elevation. The lower barrel contact butt with the two pins is what arrests this flex down movement but I feel it should be fit a bit proud so as to make the cylinder gap a bit tighter at the top at battery.
Another opinion I have is that the cylinder gap should actually be a bit narrower at the top, when at battery, then at the bottom because when the ball or bullet hits the forcing cone and the arbor flexes it will in actuality be out of square in the opposite direction if it starts out square . If it starts at square I bet dollars to donuts it isn't when the ball hits the cone, in this case effecting elevation. The lower barrel contact butt with the two pins is what arrests this flex down movement but I feel it should be fit a bit proud so as to make the cylinder gap a bit tighter at the top at battery.
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I don't want to start a fight here, but four very competent open top gunsmiths all agree that the barrel should bottom out on the arbor when the barrel just touches the frame.
Both Uberti and Pietta are fully assembled kits that need improvement for reliability. If you are satisfied with problems when shooting that is fine with me and blaze away.
But to paraphrase Hondo lane "Man ought to do what he thinks best".
Personally I am puzzled why Uberti, who makes a pretty good gun kit, will not reprogram either the arbor lathe or the barrel CNC machine and do what Pietta, a better made gun kit, already has done on arbor to barrel fit.
All of my open tops, which are very reliable, have such things as arbor length correction, forcing cone angle correction, cap rake, bolt timing and shaping, hammer stop, hand spring and plunger modification, lightened main spring, wire trigger and bolt spring, Slix Shot nipples, and barrel to cylinder gap corrected.
Perhaps I am just picky but I want a revolver that works every time I cock the hammer press the trigger.
Anything less is aggravation and frustrating.
YMMV
Bunk
Both Uberti and Pietta are fully assembled kits that need improvement for reliability. If you are satisfied with problems when shooting that is fine with me and blaze away.
But to paraphrase Hondo lane "Man ought to do what he thinks best".
Personally I am puzzled why Uberti, who makes a pretty good gun kit, will not reprogram either the arbor lathe or the barrel CNC machine and do what Pietta, a better made gun kit, already has done on arbor to barrel fit.
All of my open tops, which are very reliable, have such things as arbor length correction, forcing cone angle correction, cap rake, bolt timing and shaping, hammer stop, hand spring and plunger modification, lightened main spring, wire trigger and bolt spring, Slix Shot nipples, and barrel to cylinder gap corrected.
Perhaps I am just picky but I want a revolver that works every time I cock the hammer press the trigger.
Anything less is aggravation and frustrating.
YMMV
Bunk
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I'd like to learn more about the arbor length issue. Could you list the gunsmiths please?
sourdough
40 Cal
This primarily concerns replica Colt 1851 Navy revolvers, but it can be adapted to all Colt style open top revolvers. Larsen E. Pettifogger published these files about 12 years ago. For a time they were lost online, but I found a source for them. If you download them, use the .pdf files as that will be the best for most machines. There is a series of two files for the Pietta and four files for the Uberti.
https://archive.org/download/PettiFogger_Files/TOR Posts pdf/
I have used them very much and Pettifogger's files are pretty much a standard with me.
Regards,
Jim
https://archive.org/download/PettiFogger_Files/TOR Posts pdf/
I have used them very much and Pettifogger's files are pretty much a standard with me.
Regards,
Jim
.45 Dragoon ( Mike Bracket) goons gun works. com using the regular package not the coil springs conversion makes a very reliable hand gun. Caveat he is not the fastest smith in town but specializes in cap guns and does do good work. I have a pair each of 1861 and 1860 guns and they are reliable as a cartridge gun. I did however, put in a set of slix-shot nipples and a Lee's spring set just because my retired smith recommended it. I do too it is worth the money.
Gary Barnes at Cartridge conversions.com, if I am not mistaken, does Cap and ball work so call him. He is in Texas central time zone.
Long Hunters longhunt.com in Amarillo Texas does do cap gun work. They have a good reparation however i have never done business with them.
The fourth smith is retired and does not do work for the public any more. I do, however value his advise and knowledge.
Pettyfogger's files are pure gold but are not kitchen table work. Unless you have a good shop or access to one and a good machinist a lot of his corrections would be difficult.
Gary Barnes at Cartridge conversions.com, if I am not mistaken, does Cap and ball work so call him. He is in Texas central time zone.
Long Hunters longhunt.com in Amarillo Texas does do cap gun work. They have a good reparation however i have never done business with them.
The fourth smith is retired and does not do work for the public any more. I do, however value his advise and knowledge.
Pettyfogger's files are pure gold but are not kitchen table work. Unless you have a good shop or access to one and a good machinist a lot of his corrections would be difficult.
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Thanks for the info wb. I don't have any arbor length issues but hope to find out what Colt originally required in their fitting. Page 62 in "A History of the Colt Revolver" has a section drawing of a 3rd model Dragoon with a slight gap between arbor and barrel but a tight wedge...
Dashing Leper
36 Cl.
My Uberti 1860 came in with the loosest wedge imaginable. With the retaining screw removed, it slid all the way up to the shoulder with no resistance.
I used JB Weld to affix a brass nut to the front of the arbor and filed away until the barrel just seats onto the frame. Now the wedge tightens up against the gun just as the pawl clears the slot.
Here's how much brass I had to leave stuck to the arbor in order to bottom out the gap:
I used JB Weld to affix a brass nut to the front of the arbor and filed away until the barrel just seats onto the frame. Now the wedge tightens up against the gun just as the pawl clears the slot.
Here's how much brass I had to leave stuck to the arbor in order to bottom out the gap:
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jan_buchwald
32 Cal.
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Have seen someone installing a screw from the end of the axel
Just one reason I won't buy an open top Uberti.
Dashing Leper
36 Cl.
My previous purchase was an Uberti Dragoon that doesn't have this problem. The wedge on the 1848 locks against the gun perfectly fine and a thin washer dropped in the well proved the arbor bottomed out on its own.
I didn't know what anyone was talking about when speaking of short arbors until I got the 1860. The only thing keeping the forcing cone off the cylinder face was the lower barrel-frame engagement and I loathe to imagine what would have happened if I fired rounds through and let it flex under the play of an extremely loose wedge.
I didn't know what anyone was talking about when speaking of short arbors until I got the 1860. The only thing keeping the forcing cone off the cylinder face was the lower barrel-frame engagement and I loathe to imagine what would have happened if I fired rounds through and let it flex under the play of an extremely loose wedge.
