Baker blog updated

[robinghewitt]

Another day blazing away with ol' smoky. Blog updated if anyone's still interested...

Baker blog link

It gets better, but there's still something very wrong that I'm not understanding.

best regards

Squire Robin

 

[davy]

Robin I am no expert ... but have you ...

1) Tried a tighter or different patch type/ball combo?

2) Also have you had some other accomplished shooter take for a spin to see if he can replicate that same pattern?

3) What size/type powder are you using anyway?

4) After all that mebee its time to give serious consideration to lapping the barrel.

Just more questions I guess! :hmm:

 

[Mike Brooks]

I still think a smaller ball and thicker patch is needed, especially after seeing October's blown patches. I'd lube with some sort of grease also.
This barrel moving back and forth thing has to cease too, you'll never hit anything with your barrel jumping about.

 

[robinghewitt]

have you had some other accomplished shooter take for a spin to see if he can replicate that same pattern?

What exactly are you trying to imply by that remark? :hmm:

:rotf: :blah: :rotf: :blah: :rotf:

I'm loading it according to Baker's instructions. Twenty balls to the pound, tightly patched, a hefty charge of powder and frequent wiping. Only thinkg I've been adding is a piece of felt wad because the rifling is so deep.

best regards

Robin

 

[robinghewitt]

This barrel moving back and forth thing has to cease too, you'll never hit anything with your barrel jumping about.

Tricky :hmm:

The movement comes from a looseness at the hooked breech. The wood has moved a bit over the last 178 years so the pin holding it at the front doesn't really hold it anymore. I am loathe to overtighten the bolt.

I put brown paper under the barrel so the wedges wiould hold it tight. I don't think a small movement at the hook can explain why two consecutive balls can fall nearly 3 feet apart vertically :hmm:

best regards

Robin

 

[Mike Brooks]

I don't think a small movement at the hook can explain why two consecutive balls can fall nearly 3 feet apart vertically

I do.... Clean the surfaces with alchohol and epoxy the hook and the breech together and see if that helps. It's worth a try.
I've never been fond of hook breeches and rifles. They never seem to shoot as well as a solid breech. Shotguns though are fine with a hooked brech, as the point of impact isn't as critical.

 

[Mike Brooks]

If the epoxy helps, you can tighten up the hooked breech with a little peaning.

 

[Leonredbeard]

Squire,
I enjoyed the silly movie. I watched it twice. Good work showing us the shooting. I can't help you with the results though.
volatpluvia

 

[Stumpkiller]

Do the shots walk progressively up or down or do they hop about? Stringing can be caused by heat distortion & bedding or the bore clogging up with fouling. Hopping about is harder to diagnose. Could be load, powder inconsistancy or * shudder * yanking or lifting your head.

Have you weighed your balls?

Checked your projectiles? :rotf:

 

[wszumera]

£6750 for that rifle? Not sure what the exchange rate is but I bet that is a heap of money.

I hope whatever you do you keep an eye towards not reducing its value or collectability.

Clutch

 

[faw3]

"if anyone's still interested..." Yours is one I wait for all month to see - so yes people are waiting even if they dont post here. Mike has the best idea's, and would know. You CANT keep all the balls hitting close with ANY movement in the barrel. END OF STORY. But on the bright side I havent read up on these like I should, I dont know if it should be hitting a head size target at 100 yds or what. Also loadig it the way it was new is all well and good but yours isnt new, so playing with ball and patch cant hurt, if you get some kind of grp then you can pick off the parts that got you to it one by one till you find the problem. KEEP at it I want it to shoot right maybe more than you do now :rotf: Im hooked. Fred :hatsoff:

 

[wszumera]

Can you give dimensional data for the target you are shooting at? Hard to figure out group size from picture.

Are you shooting black powder? What F are you using for the bore, what for the prime?

Weigh your balls.

What is sight radius of your rifle?

When stock is firmly held, can you move barrel up/down sideways in stock? If so how much?

Is your ignition instantaeous vs click boom?

Have you had a shooter who has demonstrated proficiency with a flint lock shoot your rifle as a control to eliminate you as one of the variables?

What is caliber?

What is powder charge?

Clutch

 

[Doc Arroyo]

70 and 80 grain charges. Baker was trying to punch holes in soldiers with brand new rifles. You are punching holes in paper with an antique.

I would cut the powder charge to 50 grains, and see if that tightened up the group.

Keep up the blog. I will never be able to afford one, so I am living a dream reading about your trials and tribulations! :bow:

 

[robinghewitt]

Can you give dimensional data for the target you are shooting at? Hard to figure out group size from picture.

Hi Clutch

What a lot of questions :grin:

It's a PL7 pistol target, paper just shy of 22 inches square, black is just under 8".

I'm shooting TPPH black powder, no idea about F, it's what everyone uses in their Enfields. Prime is Swiss #1

I weight all the balls and discard anything under 21.9 grams.

The sight radius is twenty two and one half inches.

The barrel doesn't move up down or sideways, doesn't move at all with my brown paper bedding.

Ignition is surprisingly fast for a plain touch, no appreciable delay.

The bore is 5/8"

It has quarter turn rifling designed for a heavy charge shooting out to 300 yards.

If the balls would just stay on the top line it would be worth asking someone else to try it. I have to fix that little problem first.

best regards

Squire Robin

 

[faw3]

That helps some. Ive only been shooting since 1971 and 12 yrs of that target out to 1000 yards, I was stuck in a wheelchair and it was all I could do, and can tell you ANY movement at the hooked breech is going to throw balls all over the place. From size of target and that your doing real good. I dont know how youd fix that with out messing up the rifles worth? :hmm: Do try some lower charges see if it gets better, at least you will have found a major part of it shooting all over (really does'nt look that bad with breech lose at all) let us know how the next one goes. Fred :hatsoff: ( any chance you can recover a fired ball ? )

 

[wszumera]

The quarter turn rifling is 1:120 if what I looked up on web is correct. Just mentioning for those on the forum that are wondering what that means.

Do you know what the bore diameter is to 3 decimal places? It likely isn't easy to measure since it is seven groove.

I noticed that both months postings show patches with holes blown through them. That isn't good for accuracy. That needs to be solved.

Ball size, bore diameter, patch thickness are variables that impact accuracy. We need to make sure that all three are within reason for a starting point.

That is is an interesting piece of history you have there.

Clutch

 

[TANSTAAFL]

Can you give dimensional data for the target you are shooting at? Hard to figure out group size from picture.

Hi Clutch

What a lot of questions :grin:

It's a PL7 pistol target, paper just shy of 22 inches square, black is just under 8".

I'm shooting TPPH black powder, no idea about F, it's what everyone uses in their Enfields. Prime is Swiss #1

I weight all the balls and discard anything under 21.9 grams.

The sight radius is twenty two and one half inches.

The barrel doesn't move up down or sideways, doesn't move at all with my brown paper bedding.

Ignition is surprisingly fast for a plain touch, no appreciable delay.

The bore is 5/8"

It has quarter turn rifling designed for a heavy charge shooting out to 300 yards.

If the balls would just stay on the top line it would be worth asking someone else to try it. I have to fix that little problem first.

best regards

Squire Robin

Coming in a bit late on the discussion and may have already been addressed. But, what was the standard service charge for the Baker? With the rifle's slow twist, (have read 1:120" or, 1:100") I would think the charge to obtain optimum velocity for accuracy would have to be quite heavy to stabilize the ball.

 

[robinghewitt]

But, what was the standard service charge for the Baker?

He is vague, "To ascertain what charge of powder and shot is right for all guns is not in my power, as there is so much variation... I have in general found two full drams, or two penny-weights and six grains of good powder, to be equal to two ounces of shot, and one third the weight of the ball for a rifle".

350 grain ball = 117 gns of TPPH :shocked2: I think not, perhaps his powder was less energetic :grin:

My twist is one turn in 10 feet.

I think the burning through patches stopped when I dropped to 70 grains. One of the patches I picked up had folded back on itself when it left the ball and made a neat parcel containing the wad :thumbsup:

best regards

Squire Robin

 

[davy]

Well Mr. Robin sir .. no disrespect intended there amigo about shootin ability! Good thing we ain't talkin about a certain cannon! :hmm: :hatsoff:

I think you need to throw all that standard loading data (ball size,patch data, charge size, etc) out, and start at ground zero on loading amts & materials, and work up from there.

I do like Mike's idear about epoxying the hooked breach .. easy to do and easily removed without marring the parts. Might be the way to go in that area. :grin:

Davy

 

[faw3]

Im with you about most everthing Davy but messing with hooked breach I wouldnt do that to a 8 to 10,000 buck hunk of history :shocked2: Hey lets go white wash the Alamo, about the same kind of thing, if it wasnt for that (like a few 100 buck rifle Id be putting screws like in the Hawken. The rest is like Mike said. Fred :hatsoff: :grin: