Ballistol-based lube?

[TrailWalker]

If my rifle had to sit loaded for multiple days, I would use a wool wad between the powder and the patch to protect the powder and mink oil for the patch lube. IMHO, with any other lube you run the risk of it drying out.

With all due respect, what does it matter if the lube has dried out after it’s served its purpose in easing the loading of the firearm? I realize that the lube is likewise supposed to soften fouling, but in a hunting situation -where you’re likely to fire no more than one or two rounds at most- what does that matter?

Clark’s right. Ballistol will not dry out. I’ve taken out locks and sprayed them down with the stuff only to return several days later to find that the product is still moist, though it does appear to congeal ever so slightly. I think the suggestion of using a wad or extra patch over the powder would be a sure-fire way to ensure the powder doesn’t become contaminated.

I think SDSmlf’s advice is excellent. I’d definitely do a trial run with any of these recommendations before it’s go time.

 

[Clark Badgett]

It stinks ,,,but there are a lot of other odors I'd be more concerned with. I've used 4 parts water to 1 part Ballistol for hunting for years and it works great. I do use a 28 gauge (for .54 cal) card wad or wool felt between powder and bullet though not sure it is necessary.

I’ve know at least 2 very large bucks that were harvested when the guy that shot them was smoking. Both times the buck came in following the smell. Deer are wary of scents they associate with predators. Most other smells make them curious. I’ve known guys that have wiped their boots with diesel fuel as cover scent. I don’t think anise is going to spook deer.

 

[ETipp]

I mean no disrespect towards anyone here. However, I’m simply amazed at how, or why, some folks can complicate something so easy. Why, pray tell, would anyone even want to use Ballistol to begin with for a hunting lube? Why would anyone feel the need to unload a ML at the end of a day as long as one has not been out in the rain or subjected to very high humidity?

Unless a particular ML is more accurate with Ballistol, there’s other choices out there. Also, if using real black powder in drier country, and using a non-petroleum product for a patch lube, that rifle is going to fire days later. That is providing the ignition system type is kept dry. Why even subject oneself to using a patch lube that might cause issues or give one doubts? Or for that matter, in terms of a round ball, why would anyone want to use a card over the powder on a hunting load?

I am a big fan of Ballistol. I use it to clean and lube all of my ML. However, I’m not about to use it as a hunting patch lube, especially when there’s other, better options available that is not petroleum based.

For the record, I lived in and hunted several NW states. I elk hunted a lot. I packed my ML’s for days on end in some very rugged county. I never felt the need to discharge my ML at the end of the day when I arrived back at my camp. Yet they fired just fine when I finally did discharge them. Even now that I live in the SE, as humid as it is here, if I plan on going back out the next day, I still find no reason to fire my ML’s at the end of the day unless I had shot and reloaded earlier, or perhaps I’ve been out in some rain.

FWIW, years ago when I was young and dumb, at the end of the ML season in TN, as a test, I kept a .50 Renegade loaded with 80 grains of Black powder, and a maxi ball lubed with Bore Butter hanging over my fireplace until the the next year season. I did not block off the nipple nor the muzzle. A couple of days before season I took it down and capped it. It fired just fine. TN is a humid state.

This is not to push any particular product nor to be used as a plug for any company. However, I have squirrel hunted for up to 6 hours in light to medium intensity rain. It was also foggy and the humidity was very high. I was using TOTW Mink Oil as a patch lube. All of my ML’s likes the stuff. At the end of the day it fired just like it ought to. I did not have anything to cover the muzzle with, I also had nothing to cover the cap with other than the hammer and my hand.

This really is easy stuff here. Hunting is not repetitive competition shooting. The most one is going to shoot on one hunt is 2, maybe 3 shots. If fouling is a concern, that’s why God gave us moist cleaning patches. One or two followed up by a couple of fry patches, reload and be on your way.

Although I am satisfied with TOTW Mink Oil, I just received some real bear oil a good friend that was kind enough to send me. Together with real bees wax, I plan on mixing up some patch lube as well as conical lube. Might be an interesting option considering it’s not oil based.

I digress.

 

[ETipp]

Ballistol is mineral oil. Has the concept of not mixing black powder use with non plant base oil no longer advised?

All the expense to go on such a hunt a you won’t pull the ball clean and load up again the next day to increase your odds that your rifle will fire when needed.
You could use a CO2 discharge to keep the noise and door low.
Ballistol stinks, good thing Elk are nose blind otherwise they would sniff you out several hundred yards away that’s just 20 yds beyond your best PRB range.

Elk can and do smell things very well.

 

[JDBraddy]

Use Dutch Schultz's method and test what combo works best for you in your rifle.

Mix small samples of different concentrations of Ballistol/ water.

Soak a strip of patch material with each. You can label each with a Sharpy marker at each end to tell them apart and lay them on horizontal surface to dry overnight.

Roll them up and store in ziplock bags.

Then go to the range to test which works best for you in your rifle

As you can see, my rifle preferred 1:6 Ballistol/ water.

 

[AlexB]

For plinking at the range I use the dry ballistol patches and every 5 shots or so I use a wet patch with 1\1 dawn and water.
Keeps the rifle clean and loading smoothly.

 

[ETipp]

Use Dutch Schultz's method and test what combo works best for you in your rifle.

Mix small samples of different concentrations of Ballistol/ water.
View attachment 348926

Soak a strip of patch material with each. You can label each with a Sharpy marker at each end to tell them apart and lay them on horizontal surface to dry overnight.
View attachment 348927

Roll them up and store in ziplock bags.
View attachment 348934

Then go to the range to test which works best for you in your rifle
View attachment 348929

As you can see, my rifle preferred 1:6 Ballistol/ water.

Good for target shooting.

 

[JDBraddy]

Good for target shooting.

Why would it not be good for other applications? It's not wet, so won't contaminate powder, won't freeze up or melt at temperatures endurable by humans. Won't increase likelihood of rust if left loaded for a few days. Easy to store for long periods, and transport.

 

[Pete G]

Use Dutch Schultz's method and test what combo works best for you in your rifle.

Mix small samples of different concentrations of Ballistol/ water.
View attachment 348926

Soak a strip of patch material with each. You can label each with a Sharpy marker at each end to tell them apart and lay them on horizontal surface to dry overnight.
View attachment 348927

Roll them up and store in ziplock bags.
View attachment 348934

Then go to the range to test which works best for you in your rifle
View attachment 348929

As you can see, my rifle preferred 1:6 Ballistol/ water.

A single target is not a test. You MIGHT start to see a significant difference if you average the results of 10 targets, but that is just a start.

 

[ETipp]

Why would it not be good for other applications? It's not wet, so won't contaminate powder, won't freeze up or melt at temperatures endurable by humans. Won't increase likelihood of rust if left loaded for a few days. Easy to store for long periods, and transport.

Not trying to argue here at all. Also, I’m not condending that Ballistol is not a good patch lube for certain applications. You definitely have a good combination figured out and your targets proves it. Your setup is impressive. Nice and neat and orderly. Kudos to you.

However, for starters, in terms of a good hunting lube, how does that help lube the barrel on the way down? How will that prevent any rust in the length of the barrel during rainy or snowy conditions? It most likely will not seal or stop rain from getting to the powder under heavy rain/moist conditions.

Bear grease, Mink Oil, even the old Bore Butter leaves a definite amount of lube in the grooves of the barrel as the patch and ball is seated. It also seals the charge very well from moisture. Any hunting load should be able to withstand rain and moisture from rusting the barrel if and when the ML has been loaded for several days as well. There is no concern about those lubes causing a misfire from saturation of the powder. I heavily lube my patches and have left my squirrel rifle loaded for 3-4 days and it still fired like it should.

By using well lubricated patches of bear grease, mink oil, etc, it will leave a layer of lube all the way down then seal the load well. I have tested this and it flat works.

Just as spit patches, Ballistol used as a patch lube has its place in the ML world. Hunting is not one of those IMO. They are best suited for repetitive shooting to help reduce or eliminate the need for wiping the bore between shots. Seldom if ever is anyone going to shoot more than 2-3 times during each big game hunt. Squirrel hunting generally requires bore wiping after several shots but it is not an issue. It is easily done. My average is after 2-4 shots but it is not absolutely necessary.

Everyone to their own thing but this ole boy demands a heavier and more durable patch lube for hunting.

 

[Nobody85]

I leave my rifles loaded for long spells. I’ve found it doesn’t really matter as long as the barrel is clean. I left a barrel loaded for years one time. Shot just fine. Un-burned black powder doesn’t attract moisture like you might think. If your really concerned, you can take an ear plug and put the hammer down on it.

 

[JDBraddy]

Not trying to argue here at all. Also, I’m not condending that Ballistol is not a good patch lube for certain applications. You definitely have a good combination figured out and your targets proves it. Your setup is impressive. Nice and neat and orderly. Kudos to you.

However, for starters, in terms of a good hunting lube, how does that help lube the barrel on the way down? How will that prevent any rust in the length of the barrel during rainy or snowy conditions? It most likely will not seal or stop rain from getting to the powder under heavy rain/moist conditions.

Bear grease, Mink Oil, even the old Bore Butter leaves a definite amount of lube in the grooves of the barrel as the patch and ball is seated. It also seals the charge very well from moisture. Any hunting load should be able to withstand rain and moisture from rusting the barrel if and when the ML has been loaded for several days as well. There is no concern about those lubes causing a misfire from saturation of the powder. I heavily lube my patches and have left my squirrel rifle loaded for 3-4 days and it still fired like it should.

By using well lubricated patches of bear grease, mink oil, etc, it will leave a layer of lube all the way down then seal the load well. I have tested this and it flat works.

Just as spit patches, Ballistol used as a patch lube has its place in the ML world. Hunting is not one of those IMO. They are best suited for repetitive shooting to help reduce or eliminate the need for wiping the bore between shots. Seldom if ever is anyone going to shoot more than 2-3 times during each big game hunt. Squirrel hunting generally requires bore wiping after several shots but it is not an issue. It is easily done. My average is after 2-4 shots but it is not absolutely necessary.

Everyone to their own thing but this ole boy demands a heavier and more durable patch lube for hunting.

Ok, honestly was a sincere question. The last time I shot game was 40+ years ago and not with a muzzleloader. The last three deer I killed were taken with the fender of my mini-van. In the Army, during inclement weather we used to stretch cheap dollar store balloons (preferably black) over the muzzle to keep the rain and snow out. Whatever works best.

 

[UplandHunter]

Thanks for the advice, all.

I already have TOTW mink oil (and mixed up some moose juice last night as well to give it a try).

I do want to note that while I have a greenhorn status, I have muzzleloaded before, albeit a very long time ago and in the eastern woods instead of the western mountains.

I will use the TOTW mink oil as the lube of choice. I have been working up a load for my maxi ball out of my .50 barrel and will work up a load for a PRB next weekend out of my .54 barrel. I am a firm believer that you need to shoot at the range as closely as you will to shooting in the woods, hence the "perfect practice makes perfect" ethos in my hunting life.

I will look into get a discharger and then blowing the load out at the end of each evening. Unfortunately, I am camping, so having access to the right things to do a proper cleaning might prove difficult, especially if I am spike camping.

In the event I do a CO2 discharge at the end of the day, is it necessary to do a full cleaning or can I just reload the next morning?

Thanks again for all the help!

On my elk hunts recently, I would use my ball puller to pull the ball, go back in with it to pull the over-powder, wad, break up the packed charge with a .30 cal slotted tip on a cleaning rod since it packed in tight during the day and wouldn't just pour out the muzzle, removed nipple and sprayed brake cleaner through the flash hole making sure to kind of rinse the breech, then used the same slotted tip tool with a clean cotton patch to absorb any residue, finished it off with a CVA pre-saturated rust preventer patch using the jag on the ramrod, wipe the exterior with Ballistol, and called it a night. Sounds like a lot but its about 5 minutes of work if you have everything handy. Just my .02

 

[UplandHunter]

Odd how much the inexperienced shooter of muzzle loaders can find problems that some have never run into. My limited experience has not shown that this sport is that difficult. Start with a clean oil free barrel and breech, load your normal proven load then hunt. My midwestern hunts often lasted a month of December weather and my mountain states hunts at various altitudes never caused my rifle to fail to fire. I haven’t used leather, tape or gizmos to this point. These rifles can and have worked for generations of hunters.

On one of my last elk hunts I was up in the mountains of Idaho with two companions. We had a spot of rain roll through and one of my companions stopped to take precautions for the rain. He started taping the muzzle and "lock" of his unmentionable style muzzleloader. I just looked at him while holding my percussion sidelock and asked "Do you think Jim Bridger and Kit Carson stopped to put Super 33 Electrical tape on their rifles during a little storm?" The scowl I got from him was awesome

 

[Nwtradegunner]

Another consideration is that using any oil, natural, synthetic, stinky or sweet smelling is to keep or store your muzzleloader resting on it’s muzzle. That way everything doesn’t get gummed up with whatever you use. It fires 1st time, every time; caplock or flintlock. Also matchlocks and wheel locks for you brave souls

 

[William O.]

Greetings all!

I want to first of all say thank you to everyone in advance for sharing their knowledge! I am loving all that I am reading and seeing so far in the community!

I am looking for a recipe for a ballisol-based lube for a PRB in a GM barrel. I am going to be elk hunting, and spike camping, so discharging at the end of the day won't really be an option.

What would be a good recipe that could sit for one-four days in the barrel without fouling the powder or rusting things up?

Thanks!

As has been mentioned, anywhere between a 5-1 up to 7-1 Ballistol to water mix applied to your patch material then flat dried should work fine. You might also try beeswax and olive oil mix. Add more oil for cold temperatures, more wax for warmer temps. Use very low heat when melting and mixing.

 

[ETipp]

I leave my rifles loaded for long spells. I’ve found it doesn’t really matter as long as the barrel is clean. I left a barrel loaded for years one time. Shot just fine. Un-burned black powder doesn’t attract moisture like you might think. If your really concerned, you can take an ear plug and put the hammer down on it.

Out in the rain, snow, humidity and elements? We are not talking about climate controlled environments.

As previously stated, I kept one of my ML loaded from one years hunting season to the next and it fired just fine. It hung above my fireplace.

Not the same as a hunting scenario out in the elements.

 

[ETipp]

On my elk hunts recently, I would use my ball puller to pull the ball, go back in with it to pull the over-powder, wad, break up the packed charge with a .30 cal slotted tip on a cleaning rod since it packed in tight during the day and wouldn't just pour out the muzzle, removed nipple and sprayed brake cleaner through the flash hole making sure to kind of rinse the breech, then used the same slotted tip tool with a clean cotton patch to absorb any residue, finished it off with a CVA pre-saturated rust preventer patch using the jag on the ramrod, wipe the exterior with Ballistol, and called it a night. Sounds like a lot but it’s about 5 minutes of work if you have everything handy. Just my .02

Unless you had been out in the rain, It is a lot and totally unnecessary, but everyone to their own thing.

 

[westrayer]

Good ideas as I am down to my last 1/4 tube of T/C 1000+.

 

[ETipp]

Good ideas as I am down to my last 1/4 tube of T/C 1000+.

For a hunting load, It really doesn’t have to be complicated one bit. However, I reckon it’s human nature for some folks to complicate a bowl of Cheerios.

I used to use the hated Bore Butter for years. Never a problem and none of the many critters I’ve killed with it complained. That includes elk. Never saw the need for emptying the ML at the end of the day as long as I hadn’t fired it or hadn’t been out in a downpour.

This is not complicated, it’s easy stuff.

Good luck.

I digress.