This may be a simple question for most of you, but i've been wondering this for the past year, since got my first muzzleloader. why is blackpowder considered an explosive and not the stuff like pyrodex. i hope that question makes sense. it just don't seem right to me since the BP substitutes go boom to. thanks
Black Powder
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well, I suspect there is some politics behind it, but it has to do with ignition temperature and burn rate.
I seem to recall that Pyrodex, etc. were designed to meet specific criteria established by DOT, ATF, fire codes, and similar organizations. Evidently the substitutes didn't have to be kept under special storage conditions and locations that are required for black powder.... Maybe i read that in an older Hogdon reloading manual i have
most dealers I've questioned say they either don't don't carry regular black or only keep a small quantity on hand because of the "special storage" requirements.. whether that is fact or excuse i can't say..
rayb
most dealers I've questioned say they either don't don't carry regular black or only keep a small quantity on hand because of the "special storage" requirements.. whether that is fact or excuse i can't say..
rayb
It is mainly the burn rate that gives it its "explosive" class.
Pyrodex and the other substitutes need pressure to develop the quick burn rates needed in a gun.
Black Powder burns at the same rate or speed in or out of the gun.
I'm not saying Pyrodex burns real slow, but if someone puts a little pile of it on a flat surface and lights it with a match, it will rapidly burn.
If the same is done with Black Powder, it will go POOF!
(This should be done in a special labratory, not at home!) ::
Pyrodex and the other substitutes need pressure to develop the quick burn rates needed in a gun.
Black Powder burns at the same rate or speed in or out of the gun.
I'm not saying Pyrodex burns real slow, but if someone puts a little pile of it on a flat surface and lights it with a match, it will rapidly burn.
If the same is done with Black Powder, it will go POOF!
(This should be done in a special labratory, not at home!) ::
flashpanner
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Then what is an "explosive propellant"? ::
I would say a explosive propellent is exactly what it says.
It is an explosive like Black Powder and it's burn rate is suitable for accelerating (propelling) an object like a bullet or round ball from one velocity to a faster velocity.
There are a number of explosives which have a burn rate totally unsuitable for this task. They produce too much pressure, to fast, to be usable (unless the idea of propelling something is to break it into small pieces and send them in various directions at a high rate of speed.)
Pure Nitroglycerin, dynamite, C4, to name a few are all explosives but they all have burn rates that would, if used in a gun for instance, just blow it up. :shocking: :shocking:
It is an explosive like Black Powder and it's burn rate is suitable for accelerating (propelling) an object like a bullet or round ball from one velocity to a faster velocity.
There are a number of explosives which have a burn rate totally unsuitable for this task. They produce too much pressure, to fast, to be usable (unless the idea of propelling something is to break it into small pieces and send them in various directions at a high rate of speed.)
Pure Nitroglycerin, dynamite, C4, to name a few are all explosives but they all have burn rates that would, if used in a gun for instance, just blow it up. :shocking: :shocking:
robinghewitt
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I think there may be lots of regulations on BP because historically gun powders mills had a bad habit of going pop and killing people. It's all that grinding and pressing, dangerous business :thumbsup:
The burn rate and ignition tempeture is the determineing factor in classing the different explosive/propellens.I think BP goes off atabout 480degrees F" and Pyrodex at alittle over 700 degrees F"Pyrodex can be shipped and stored under the same rules covering smokeless powders.
He's lucky it didn't burn.
More than one person has had their hand in line with the touch hole when a flintlock fired and it created some of the worst burns you can imagine. Not only did it cook the meat to a 'well done" condition, it left embedded powder fragments in the wound.
More than one person has had their hand in line with the touch hole when a flintlock fired and it created some of the worst burns you can imagine. Not only did it cook the meat to a 'well done" condition, it left embedded powder fragments in the wound.
And that jet of hot gas hitting a plastic butane lighter held tightly in one's hand probably wouldn't help matters very much.
IMHO This was not a wise thing to do. I have tiny particles of BP imbedded in the back of my hand from a relative who swung the gun in front of my face to take a shot at a deer that was on my side of the trail. I managed to get my hands in front of my face between the time the priming charge went poof and the main charge went bang. My companion heard a few words from me that I had always been careful about using in the presence of my elders.
That happened 22 or 23 years ago and there are still visible gray dots on the first knuckle of my pinky. I guess I was lucky that it was my hand or I wouldn't be so good looking now. :crackup:
IMHO This was not a wise thing to do. I have tiny particles of BP imbedded in the back of my hand from a relative who swung the gun in front of my face to take a shot at a deer that was on my side of the trail. I managed to get my hands in front of my face between the time the priming charge went poof and the main charge went bang. My companion heard a few words from me that I had always been careful about using in the presence of my elders.
That happened 22 or 23 years ago and there are still visible gray dots on the first knuckle of my pinky. I guess I was lucky that it was my hand or I wouldn't be so good looking now. :crackup:
I no longer have my "Properties of Explosives" book - gave it to an EOD detachment as I no longer needed it. However, black powder is a class B explosive, Pyrodex & most smokeless powders are class C. C4 is a class A. All this is based on "rate of detonation", which means for powder how fast it burns. There are all sorts of restrictions for all classes of explosives, including class C, but the restrictions increase as the power of the substance increases. Having shipped military explosives all over the world, it takes a lawyer to figure out how to store, handle, & ship the stuff. Protection for class B explosives doesn't take much, but w/ the fear of many municipal "leaders" about anything explosive, we have suffered a series of unreasonable restrictions in the past 15 years. But you can still buy up to 50 pounds & have it delivered by UPS.
