Boiled vs. unboiled linseed oil

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barebackjack

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Many of you talk about boiled linseed oil. I have heard this helps it to absorb better into the wood, and dry faster. Is it really that better than unboiled? What is the reason and how do you go about it?.....just put it in a pot and bring it to a nice rolling boil?

Also, what kind of finish does tung oil produce?

Im wanting a finish on my GPR that is NOT shiny, or to terribly satiny. I want a nice........natural look to it I guess you could say.

Thanks
Boone

ps, any other products that fit the bill?
 
Birchwood Casey Tru-Oil, any sporting goods.
Apply one tip finger dip at a time and wipe it as thin as you possibly can.Stop just before it becomes tacky while rubbing(you'll know what I mean after the first dip)
Apply one coat, let dry over night.
Use #0000 steel wool(LIGHTLY or you'll remove the last coat) between each coat.
The first 10 or so coats will fill the grain to flush, and the rest is up to your liking.
After the last coat is dry, the #0000 will leave a beautiful sattin finish. :thumbsup:

p.s. Did you get that press?
 
Boiled linseed is much more usable because it has chemical dryers in it. (It's not really boiled.) When I use it I thin the first coat with turpentine so it penetrates deeper. Next coat is thinned less, and so forth. After a few coats (I'm letting the wood tell me how many) I switch to an oil varnish I make from turps, resin (basically hardened pine pitch) and linseed. The resin seals the pores and I'm usually satisfied after two or three coats, but I'm not trying to build a finish on top of the wood.
I use this finish on knife handles, walking sticks and gunstocks. :yakyak:
 
I use boiled linseed oil made by Klean strip that I bought from Walmart for $3-4 a quart. It dries overnight and doesn't build up a shiny surface. It works great for me.
 
Boiled linseed oil USED to be boiled, and it did allow it to be used and dry in a couple of days, vs using unboiled linseed oil which could take as long as 6 months to dry for each coat! Today's products, like Birchwood Casey stock finish has chemical dryers added that allow you to have a dry surface in hours. The army used to have all new recruits rub raw linseed oil into the stocks of their rifles because they had hours to hand rub the stocks, and get them warm enough for the finish to soak in, and nothing much else for the men to do. It was part of the " care and maintenance" of the service rifle. Unfortunately, it also took tons of dirt into the finishes too, so that after 30 years of use, the stocks were almost black. If you ever find a surplus rifle from WWII or before that you can buy for cheap, strip the finish off the stock and see what a difference it makes. It always comes as a shock to gun owners to see what pretty wood they had under all that grime and oil. :hmm:
 
paulvallandigham said:
If you ever find a surplus rifle from WWII or before that you can buy for cheap, strip the finish off the stock and see what a difference it makes. It always comes as a shock to gun owners to see what pretty wood they had under all that grime and oil. :hmm:




:youcrazy: And it will amaze you how much you have devalued you aquisition by stripping the original finish... :rotf:
 
I last bought a surplus gun for $85.00. Just how much devaluation am I to worry about? Obviously, I am not suggesting you do this on a rare, expensive Military surplus gun like an M-1, or one of the few 1903A3 rifles still to be found. The ones you find today from large commercial sources come out of warehouses, and rarely spent any time in the fied. What i am talking about are the kind of things you find in the used gun racks around the country, with stocks that look like they were used to support trucks on the Burma Road! BTW, That $85.00 Swedish M96 rile in 6.5 x 55 Mauser is one of the most accurate rifles I own. I took a lot of surface grim off it with just some solvent, but decided to leave the gun "as is ". I have added a Scout scope which is attached to the rear sight, and nothing more. My 3 shot groups run 1 1/4 inch and less, in a gun made in 1900. How about that?
 
Paul, gotta love them cheap military surplus rifles. I collect them myself. I have done countless "no-nos" to my stocks, including inlays of hardwood and pvc pipe, of all things.And they are amazing once you see the wood, as you say. I have a Mauser that has a walnut stock, underneath years of grime, cosmoline, and who knows what, it turned out to be an eyecatcher.Boiled linseed oil from Wal-mart is great stuff. I use it on many things. Hammer and axe handles among other wooden implements. Great on tools to prevent rust also.
 
Thanks guys. So if I go to the hardware store and pick up linseed oil, it will already be "boiled" and ready to use?

And no R.E.M., didnt get the press, apparently my idea of "can you hold it for me for a few hours"? and his idea of that are different. Oh well.

Boone
 
I love to collect M1's after my first obsession.
Flint lock weapons and I had an awful argument with someone on the CMP website.
BLO is not a good finish. The army found that it didn't protect the wood from the elements and was looking for a better finish, even while they using the BLO. IT WAS ALL THEY HAD AND THERE WAS A WAR GOING ON.
The old time BLO was... But it was actually boiled until it was almost a varnish like consististy.
However, It is very flamblable and they must have taken great care in boiling it.
The modern stuff is just too thin and filled with dryers that leave a weak and porus finish, that is not water proof.
I hand rubbed it many times into flintlock rifles, but when I when to clean them and some water dripped onto the stocks. I could clearly see the lines.
BLO is great to "feed" the wood and keep it from drying out too much, but IMHO it is not a good finish.
You would be better off with the LMF finish or Truoil..
Use the BLO to keep the wood from drying too much. It make the wood glow and who doens't love rubbing down their prized wooden stocked rifles with a damp rag of BLO???
 
Here's the poop on linseed oil that I have been able to glean over a period of time searching for historical finishes.

Linseed oil (flaxseed oil) is a drying oil. It absolutely REQUIRES UV light from the sun to dry.

Raw linseed oil (unmodified) will dry, but it takes a LONG time to do so.

"Boiled" linseed oil, as bought today, is not boiled at all, but simply has a drying agent added (I think it is manganese based...)

Historical boiled linseed oil is actually boiled (generally with white lead, red lead, "roche alum" or some other drier added). This is often referred to as "black oil", as the boiling of the oil will turn it from the familiar yellow to a dark orange-brown. Boiling decreases the drying time, as, of course, does the addition of the dryers. I do NOT know if the "durability" of the oil is increased any with boiling. I don't really think it is much, if at all.

Traditional varnish was made by adding resins to the boiling oil, which gives it gloss and hardness.

Now, linseed oil, boiled or otherwise, is NOT waterproof. It is only somewhat water resistant. Water WILL pass through all types of linseed oil (and varnishes made with the oil), however, the water will also pass right back out again. The oil does seem to slow the water transferrence to a level which the wood can tolerate.

When fully dry, linseed oil seems to be almost indestructible. Water may pass through it, but it doesn't really seem to affect the oil at all. If you get a white water spot on your historically-correct-linseed oil-varnish, not to worry, as it will simply dry out and go away soon enough.

With any linseed oil finish, the key is to put it on Thin. Did I say "thin"? I mean THIN. If it is glopped on heavily, the outside may dry, but it will remain goo on the inside for a LONG time.

On drying time. First off, the purer and cleaner the oil is, the faster it will dry. Raw linseed oil, in THIN coats, could take MANY days to dry in the sun. Store bought "boiled" linseed oil can take several days in the sun to fully dry (take note of the word "fully"...). Historical real boiled linseed oil with driers added CAN dry in several hours to a few days in the sun. Again, Thin, thin, thin. The heavier the coat, the longer it will take.

I have been making my own varnish of linseed oil with rosin and mastic added along with lead carbonate (white lead/flake white). I only boiled it for about an hour and a half, and it dries fully in about 3 FULL days in good sun per coat. I kind of think, but have no empirical evidence for, that the oil alone would dry a bit quicker, and the resins slow down drying a bit...

For those who do not wish to boil oil, or make their own varnishes, "black oil" can be purchased from Kremer Pigmente, as can several different natural varnishes (none of which I have yet tried). Another option is to get Tried-and-True Varnish Oil. This is a raw, pure linseed oil that has been "pre-polymerized" by making it into "stand oil". As I understand it, stand oil is created by putting the oil in copper trays with glass lids in the sun. This "pre-polymerizes" the oil, while not allowing it to actually dry. This cuts down on the drying time without adding any heavy metal-based dryers. The "Varnish Oil" has rosin added, though I'm not sure how they do it... This is what makes it into a "varnish", and suitable for a top-coat. These are the only two ingredients, and it is utterly non toxic and food safe. I have tried it out on some scrap wood, and it dries fine in a few days of sun. I have had several people who use it on their guns tell me they just love it. It is available from Woodcraft, though they, for whatever reason, do not show it in their printed catalogs.

I used to be of the opinion that wood should be sealed up tight, and totally waterproof (something that is impossible anyway!). Recently, I have changed my position. It's kind of amazing how so many of these old guns have survived to this day with some of these "sub-standard" and "ineffective" finishes...or even with no finish left on them at all! :winking:
 
Thanks for the very imformative lesson on the BLO..
I agree that wood shouldn't and can't be sealed "waterproof".
I use it to wipe down my wooden guns, but will never use it as a finish, JMHO
 
The first LR I made {1980}was "finished" w/ BLO and was dry to the touch and had that nice, soft sheen that only BLO can produce. That same year I sat on my deer stand all day in the rain and ruined my only two red handkerchiefs wiping the "gunk" off my pride and joy. Every bit of BLO that I had so carefully rubbed into the stock and spent days waiting for it to dry, was now on my red rags. Henceforth I now use LMF sealer and have since hunted in the rain numerous times w/ these LRs w/o incident......Fred
 
barebackjack said:
Thanks guys. So if I go to the hardware store and pick up linseed oil, it will already be "boiled" and ready to use?

Yes -- it is sold that way. Check the label... it should say "boiled" right on it. You don't have to boil it or add dryers. It is ready to use as is, though some people thin it with mineral spirits.
 
For years I have been using artist quality linseed oil as a wood finish. Get it at any art supply store. Probably more expensive than the WallMart stuff, but a small bottle lasts a long time. I don't know how this compares to the other stuff, but artists have been using it for centuries in "oil paints" and it dries fine on canvas as well as on wood. The key is patience and like has been said, thin coats at a time...some noted builders shy away from linseed oil, but it has worked OK for me...
 
You have GOT to let it DRY. I can't emphasize that enough. Slopping on linseed oil and sitting the gun in the corner of the room will NOT dry it. No matter how warm it is. It MAY get a very thin fairly dry film on the outside, but will not dry inside. It can sit inside for years before it will dry (if it ever does). It absolutely, positively, MUST be put in the sun. When people say that they had their linseed oil turn to goo and wash out when they got caught in the rain, they simply did not let the oil dry (and probably put it on too heavily to boot). You can sort-of "slop" on the first several coats, BUT, they need to be more turpentine than oil. They need to be quite thin, with days (several, if necessary) of sunlight in between applications to ensure that the oil is fully dry.

When linseed oil is fully dry, I don't think dynamite could break it down.

I had a test stick sitting outside with some of my linseed oil varnish on it. The grain was filled, and there were 2 or 3 or 4 thin hand-rubbed coats on the surface. It was allowed to dry several days in the sun for each application. (for the varnish, it must be kept in the sun until there is no more tack felt with the "thumbpress" test). I then simply left the stick outside overnight a couple of nights. The third night it rained. The next day it was sunny, and the day after, it rained again. I brought the stick inside the next day. It was soaking wet. It has dried out nicely in the house and the varnish is absolutely none the worse for wear! :winking:
 
Understand that Ultra Violet Light will tend to darken Linseed Oil finishes, and they tend to first begin to have an " orange" tint to them. As long as you are prepared for this color change, use Linseed oil. However, if you don't want that color change, or for the finish to darken and hide that expensive grained stock wood you paid so dearly for, then consider using another finish.

I absolutely agree that each THIN coat rubbed into wood of linseed oil has to be sun dried to dry at all. Even boiled linseed oil benefits from being dried in sunlight. By THIN, I am trying to stress that you only need a few drops of linseed oil to cover the entire stock each coat. Even the word " slop " give me chills remembering all the mistakes I made finishing stocks, and all the time and sweat it cost me taking the finish off with steel wool and sand paper, to start over again. :hmm:
 
paulvallandigham said:
I last bought a surplus gun for $85.00. Just how much devaluation am I to worry about? Obviously, I am not suggesting you do this on a rare, expensive Military surplus gun like an M-1, or one of the few 1903A3 rifles still to be found. The ones you find today from large commercial sources come out of warehouses, and rarely spent any time in the fied. What i am talking about are the kind of things you find in the used gun racks around the country, with stocks that look like they were used to support trucks on the Burma Road! BTW, That $85.00 Swedish M96 rile in 6.5 x 55 Mauser is one of the most accurate rifles I own. I took a lot of surface grim off it with just some solvent, but decided to leave the gun "as is ". I have added a Scout scope which is attached to the rear sight, and nothing more. My 3 shot groups run 1 1/4 inch and less, in a gun made in 1900. How about that?





This is, of course, completely off topic but it may surprise you to learn that a nice, matching Swede M96 is selling for around $350 on today's market and I have never seen one in the condition you describe ("support trucks on the Burma Road"). Well worn maybe but the Swedes took better care of their equipment than some. That means that you have a $75 - $85 rifle - not bad for you since you have lost no money but left alone the rifle (if matching and in complete solid condition) would have been worth much more. Short-sighted but okay as long as you are happy. At least you didn't add any PVC inlays. :rotf:
 
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