bore/ball tolerances on brown bess

[ill Mendham]

here comes the newbie with another stupid question (I did search for it though - I didn't find conclusive evidence)

I ordered a bunch of patches/ball/accoutrements for my .75 cal Middlesex Village Brown Bess from track of the wolf from their "Suggestions by caliber list". I am afraid to try the loads for two reasons. 1. The largest patches they had (which were in the .75 caliber list) say they were fro .60 - .69 are these OK to use? THey are .10 If not I also bought a sheet of patch material; how big should I cut it for .75? 2. The balls I bought (again a part of their list) were .715 The question I have is is it safe to shoot these size balls with these patches? I know I cannot expect much accuracy but is it OK as I get to know my new gun?

As always all your help is appreciated. I'll even be the Brit! ::

 

[rschissler]

I get patches for my bess at October Country and they are described as .69-.75 and .015 thickness. On the package it says .70, but they are big enough for the .715 balls I shoot with.

I measured one and it is 1 and 13/16" diameter.

 

[Twisted_1in66]

here comes the newbie with another stupid question (I did search for it though - I didn't find conclusive evidence)

I ordered a bunch of patches/ball/accoutrements for my .75 cal Middlesex Village Brown Bess from track of the wolf from their "Suggestions by caliber list". I am afraid to try the loads for two reasons. 1. The largest patches they had (which were in the .75 caliber list) say they were fro .60 - .69 are these OK to use? THey are .10 If not I also bought a sheet of patch material; how big should I cut it for .75? 2. The balls I bought (again a part of their list) were .715 The question I have is is it safe to shoot these size balls with these patches? I know I cannot expect much accuracy but is it OK as I get to know my new gun?

As always all your help is appreciated. I'll even be the Brit! ::

Hi Ill Mendham,

Easiest thing to do is go by some blue and white pillow ticking (it's about .018" thick) from Walmart. It's tightly woven cotton (stops feathers) and makes a good seal between the powder and the ball. Don't ever use any synthetic as a patch....they melt.

Cut the pillow ticking into about 1

 

[weirdjack]

Yep, go to Walmart and buy a yard of cotton pillow ticking. I use the red stripes myself, but blue will do. I cut mine into squares, shoots the same as round. I don't cut them at the muzzle from strips...just more convenient for me.
I shoot .69 and .70 bore smoothies. for measurement of patching, I count five stripes on the ticking and cut a strip that wide. Then I cut the strips into squares.
Another option is to buy shotgun cards for your Bess. For my Charleville, I use one overpowder card on top of the powder, throw in the ball, then put half (sliced) an overpowder card on top.
Jack

 

[bnail]

myself, I've only used Cartridges with my bess. when I did patch, I used the 2 inch .45 government cleaning patches. anyone know the thickness for these patches? they made THE best char too.

And to you experts out there, how in the world do you know patch thickness? I can't imagine you could mic it very effectively.

Oh, and Mendham, Welcome aboard, Anyone who has the good sense to shoot a Bess is good'nuff to marry my daughter! :thumbsup:

 

[weirdjack]

And to you experts out there, how in the world do you know patch thickness? I can't imagine you could mic it very effectively.

I'm no expert, but it's not difficult to mic out tightly woven fabric using the flat portion of the jaws. The red stripe Walmart ticking I have mic's out to a pretty consistant .017" after two washings and drying. The tighter weave floral ticking I get at Log Cabin Shop now and then mic's out to around .018" fairly consistantly.
Does it really matter to me when using undersize balls in a smoothbore musket? No, not really. But at least I have a reference point to know that I'm loading pretty much the same every time.
I don't shoot paper cartridges much because I hate walking downrange to stomp out the little fires
Jack

 

[riarcher]

Not knowing what your actual bore size is, the .715 pretty small. I've a .751 bored Bess and use a heavily lubed cotton denum medium weight patch cut into 2" squares. I've found no real need for round or cut-at-the-muzzle patches.
Save yourself some grief, measure your actual bore diameter and figure from there allowing for some compression. I've always been "partial" to smaller balls and thicker patches for good sealing. :m2c:

 

[Slenk]

Not knowing what your actual bore size is, the .715 pretty small. I've a .751 bored Bess and use a heavily lubed cotton denum medium weight patch cut into 2" squares. I've found no real need for round or cut-at-the-muzzle patches.
Save yourself some grief, measure your actual bore diameter and figure from there allowing for some compression. I've always been "partial" to smaller balls and thicker patches for good sealing. :m2c:

You can double patch if needed with undersized roundballs :m2c:
Slenk

 

[ill Mendham]

:thanks: all

What is the worst case scenario of using an undersized ball? My fear is that I could create a dangerous situation. I have my first baby on the way so now I am even MORE serious about safty. My fear is that the smaller ball will turn in the barrel and the flat part will come in contact with the barrel and some how cause the barrel to blow. Am I just paranoid or can I shoot this balls safely (I know not acurately)?

 

[tg]

I have .530 balls in a .58 bore gun with a thin card to hold the ball in place, not real accurate but not dangerous as long as the ball stays firmly atop the charge.

 

[riarcher]

Worst that would happen is you'll get blown patches and probably poor accuacy.
You'll not hurt the gun or yourself,,,,,, well, maybe your mental frustration on grouping may get strained a bit.
You'll not hurt a thing,, really. You'll just probably not see the true potential on the target is all.
Unless you get terribly undersized and the ball lifts off the powder then I suppose bulging the barrel may result. Gotta be tight enough to remain seated on the powder. eace:

 

[musketman]

:thanks: all

What is the worst case scenario of using an undersized ball? My fear is that I could create a dangerous situation. I have my first baby on the way so now I am even MORE serious about safty. My fear is that the smaller ball will turn in the barrel and the flat part will come in contact with the barrel and some how cause the barrel to blow. Am I just paranoid or can I shoot this balls safely (I know not acurately)?

The spure (flat spot) on the ball is made of the same soft lead that rest of the ball is, so if it does turn it'll just round out the flat as the lead is displaced...

I really doubt that the patched ball will turn in a smoothbore anyway's, the pressure from the powder will push the same on the base of the patch and it's only 40 inches of barrel to travail to begin with, (the other 2 inches is the chamber area where the powder and ball were seated)

I use .715 roundball with a .015-.018 pillow tick patch, what size to make the patch?

Easy, take some bulk patching material and place it over the muzzle, now start a ball down the barrel until it's almost flush with the top... (DO NOT CUT THE MATERIAL)

With a pen or marker, draw a line around the patch where it meets the barrel...

Now, use the bulk patching material to pull the ball out of the muzzle and unfold the ticking and lay it flat, measure the circle that the pin mark makes and cut your patches to this width...

 

[Stumpkiller]

My fear is that the smaller ball will turn in the barrel and the flat part will come in contact with the barrel and some how cause the barrel to blow. Am I just paranoid or can I shoot this balls safely.

Fear not. That sprue will be sheared or smeared off without raising the pressure a smidgeon. If it's patched, it won't turn anyhow.

If you're really worried about it, load it sprue down.

 

[Hobie]

You can use shot, buck & ball, and ball so why be worried about slightly undersized ball. A flintlock is a reasoning person's gun. You have to be able to think through your problems and if you can you'll be successful. :thumbsup:

 

[Wes/Tex]

As long as the patch is large enough to cover the ball past it's center-of-side they will work. As mentioned above, using undersized balls is not dangerous. In fact, one guy reported using .63" unpatched balls to see how fast he could shoot and claimed 80% hits a 75 yards on a man-sized target, all this at 6 shots per minute. Great job if it's for real. Small diameter balls have tons of blow-by and velocity will be down considerably. Good luck and have fun.