Buck and ball

[NY Irish]

When you shoot buck and ball out of a smooth bore, what kind of mark do you get? Does the ball travel somewhat straight and the buckshot scatter, or do they all kinda group together?

 

[redwing]

This is the most worthless load I ever fired in a M/L. At some of the Rondys you will have to fire Buck&Ball at a full size deer target.
This is fired at 25 Yds. You never know where any of this mess is going to hit. Just Buck or just balls work fine, but mixed they are useless. They were used in war at very close range and not aimed it was mass fire. :shake:

 

[jbg]

I agree. I have fired buck and ball loads from both my 42 Springfield and a Tulle that I foolishly sold. I could get neither to "print" consistently, and at more than 20 yards or more considered myself fortunate to get even one buckshot on a mansized target. At 10-15 yards the spread was amazing. Straight buckshot wasn't much better.
As a last ditch, get em' as they are coming through the door, maybe. Anything else, stick with just a round ball.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Most people load the three buck shot on top of the Round ball. Its much easier to load your gun that way. However, that big ball loses velocity slower than those little balls, and the Round pushes the buch shot apart like a cue ball breaking the rack. Try loading the three balls first, with the Round ball on top. The three are still going to spread, and they will distort with any sizable load, because they will slammed into the bottom of the larger round ball on ignition, but at least they will group at 25 yards, with the RB going pretty much to POA. Don't hesitate to patch the round ball separate from the buck shot.

 

[rifleshooter2]

I'm thinking the load is pretty good when you have a couple of hundred guys shooting at each other about 50 yards apart :surrender:

Andy

 

[Many Klatch]

I find that the round ball prints where I aim and the buckshot are usually within 6 inches of the round ball at 25 yards.

I usually shoot 4 buck and one ball out of my .60 fowler or 6 buck and one ball out of my Bess.

Many Klatch

 

[Wes/Tex]

When you shoot buck and ball out of a smooth bore, what kind of mark do you get? Does the ball travel somewhat straight and the buckshot scatter, or do they all kinda group together?

Basically, buck & ball is a combat load for use with skirmishing tactics. I've always found the bore-sized ball will hit low compared with the normal use of single ball only. The U.S. soldiers used it from the AWI through the Civil War. The French developed a "musket canister" round that was 8 half-bore sized balls in 4 layers inside a wooden cylinder. This was loaded on top of the normal ball load and used specifically used for defending breeches or other close range situations.

Pure buckshot loads can be effective at short range for hunting...stress on short range! You need to get at least 3 shot within about a 10 inch diameter EVERY TIME! The effect is known as "foot printing" and basically means the crush cavities of close hits will be large enough to be thought of as one large one in flesh and muscle. Surprisingly, the English seem to be the only major military machine who didn't work out a multi projectile load!

 

[redwing]

There has been more than one smooth bore damaged doing that. The soft buck shot is hammered against the bottom of th ball. This can cause the buck to lump up and swage in the bore. More than one smoothie has ended up with a damaged bore doing this not wise.
The armies of the past used Buck&Ball, why do you think they loaded the ball under the shot? They knew from trial and error that it was not good to load shot on the bottom:shake:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Have you thought about putting a card wad between the buck and the ball? Like an overpowder wad? I am sure that things did happen with the thin barrels made or questional iron back in the days. However, today, the barrels are much thicker, and made of stronger allow steels. I don't think the steel is going to give into any lead projectile, assuming you use reasonable powder charges. I think the problem comes in when modern shooters want to make a cloth or paper cartridge for buck and ball just as they see pictured in certain books, and somehow improve their chance of hitting something beyond 50 yards. The opposite is true, but everyone thinks they can invent the wheel! Its been done, already, but that doesn't seem to stop every newbie with his first ML whatever from thinking he can shoot it faster, or with more power if only he loads it "better" than all of old dummies do! After all, what do we know about anything? Most of don't even own a Blackberry, and some of us think I am talking about the fruit!

 

[Wes/Tex]

Paul, I've tried that very thing some time ago. Even used up to a full sized fiber wad between ball and shot. None seemed to do any better than without but might if tried with other's gun. Always worth a fling!

 

[paulvallandigham]

Wes: I have never had any luck with Buck and Ball loads, either. I consider them a 50 foot load at best on a large target. Getting all three balls on the same target as the large RB hits gets very iffy beyond that distance. I have shot 00 Buckshot loads at 50 yds, and have always been amazed at how few pellets actually hit the target at that distance. Of course, if you are unlucky enough to be hit by one of them, you will certainly know it! And, No, I would not want some one shooting at me at 150 yds with buck and ball for that very reason. If I didn't have mostly bad luck, I wouldn't have any luck at all! :cursing: :thumbsup:

 

[Todd Rickard]

As military load, the purpose is to hit multiple targets, not to keep all the shot in a small group on one target.

 

[Wes/Tex]

As military load, the purpose is to hit multiple targets, not to keep all the shot in a small group on one target.

Exactly right! Buck & ball was strictly a military load for volume fire. All that buckshot flying around might just find somewhere useful to land. The French version was interesting and I have no idea if the wood helped hold the shot together more than just loading it plain, but it was still designed to be fired at masses of bodies in tight areas!

 

[tg]

My .62 does ok at about 10 yds max with the ball somewhat centered around the 6 shot in a kill zone area but it is a very range senitive load and I only consider its use in select situations when I want to dump a deer up close near heavy stickery cover.