Buck County Ramrod Thimble

[Zonie]

I am considering building a Buck County rifle similar to #65 in Rifles of Colonial America or #54 in Thoughts on the Kentucky Rifle in the Golden Age.

One of the charactistics of all of the Bucks Rifles shown is the very large finial on the lower ramrod thimble.
All of the commercial thimbles are straight in this area and do not provide enough material to make the elaborate finial.

Does anyone know of a source for something like this?
Am I stuck with either ignoring a rather obvious feature or soldering extra material on a commercial part?

As with all of my guns, I am not trying to recreate a exact replica of a existing gun so the part does not have to look exactly like the photos. It should reflect the general style we know existed though.

I usually build my version of a "school" using all of the major characteristics such as patch box, side plate, lock style, wrist, comb, buttplate, carving style, etc.

Any thoughts???

 

[Flintandsteel]

Zonie,
I've built a couple of A Vernor rifles. That is supposedly where that rather elaborate entry thimble came from.
I got mine from Golden Age arms. I'm not sure if they are still available.
I suppose you could solder on a small plate of brass and then cut it out your self.
OR....
I just might have one left.
Actually, I do have one that I'd be glad to send to you if you'd like.
It would require a bit of shaping to match the normal entry pipe, then be soldered on and inlet as normal.
It has kind of a fleur-de-lis pattern on it.
Real similar to the original.
Let me know off line your address and I'll send it to you. :v

 

[Birddog6]

To the best of my knowledge, you will have to make the entrypipe to have one like that particular Bucks rifle. Tip Curtis has the buttplate also in iron or brass & the rest of the hardware also. I have built several of these rifles, but not identical to the original. They are a really nice rifle & comfortable to shoot. Everytime I build one I lay that patchbox on there 49 times & end up without it, just don't like it pon the gun once I have it there........ :hmm:

 

[kettenburg]

A large percentage of the Bucks rifles w/ a long or decorative skirt made use of a two-piece soldered deal. The pipe was made as a standard pipe and the skirt soldered-on and filed-out. Some of this work was executed so well that you cannot determine that it was soldered without removing the thimble. Others make use of a standard pipe w/ integral skirt but the longer extension is inlet into the stock behind the skirt and tacked in place. There was no soldering involved here and you can see the joint. Many of these decorative extensions were not inlet but rather were made of very thin brass and were simply tacked to the stock sans inletting.

 

[rich pierce]

#65 has great lines, that's for sure. I'm guessing that Verner and Shuler didn't order those entry pipes from Log Cabin or wherever. (Zonie, I'm messing with ya). For me, part of the pleasure of making these guns is making the parts. I'd sure try to make a one-piece and expect to throw away the first attempt. If you have made forms for making entry pipes, you should have no problem other than the normal challenges. Make a paper pattern for the rear pipe and just leave the large finial oversize and cut to shape later.

If youre thinking 2-piece, there's some relatively low temp "silver solder" that is brass colored that could be used to join the parts. But I'd hate to inlet one that might come apart during the process. So if making a 2-piece, I'd think about inletting the entry pipe (thimble) then taking it out and inletting the finial, which would be a tad longer, overlapping the pipe skirt. Then go ahead and cut to fit and join 'em.

I admire you for tackling this. Looks tough.

 

[Roy]

Make it, here's a one piece made from sheet brass.

 

[Zonie]

Zonie,
I've built a couple of A Vernor rifles...
OR....
I just might have one left.
Actually, I do have one that I'd be glad to send to you if you'd like.
It would require a bit of shaping to match the normal entry pipe, then be soldered on and inlet as normal.
It has kind of a fleur-de-lis pattern on it.
Real similar to the original.
Let me know off line your address and I'll send it to you. :v

I thank you for the generous offer, but I think my gameplan right now is to order several entry pipes (so when I screw one up I won't be out of business) and cut some brass stock to solder on to them.

If you didn't know, Golden Arms has been out of business for several years. When they were in business their prices kept me from dealing with them so although it was no real loss to me, it's always sad to see a supplier go under.

As to forming an entry pipe out of a solid sheet, I don't have the tooling to do the job.
Oh, I could make one of them, but I know it would look like someone attacked the brass with a very big hammer and a very small amount of skill. :grin:

By the way, not only do I intend to use low melting temperature silver solder but the joint will be a "scarf cut joint" where the surfaces are cut at a shallow angle, rather than a "butt" joint where the pieces are just butted together.
This will greatly increase the surface area of the hoing and should make the joint almost as strong as the parent material.

Thanks again.

 

[rich pierce]

Zonie, try to order an entry pipe folded out of sheet brass so color may match with your finial. The wax cast ones look different.

 

[Roy]

Thats a good point, its disapointing to have made a thimble and it being made from yellow and a pink color brass.

 

[hawkeye1755]

Hi Zonie.
Here are 2 pics from my Bucks.

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:hatsoff:

 

[Zonie]

undertaker: Beautiful rifle.
Did you make the entry thimble from scratch or did you modify a commercial one?

 

[hawkeye1755]

Hey Zonie
Sorry i'm not the builder of my buck county.
His name is Siggi Mau.Today i ask him about the entry thimble.He told that he make it by himself.
He is one of best gun builder in Germany.That's my
opinion.
Here is his website:[url] http://www.s-mau.de/waffen/vorderla.htm[/url]
Please take alook and tell me what you think.
:hatsoff:

 

[user 922]

Zonie:

There's a guy who is at Dixon's every year demonstrating how to make thimbles. He had several extended entry thimbles on his bench and could probably supply you with one. I think I have the right card:

Ted Ciesinski
Stony Creek Longrifles
110 Old Spies Church Rd.
Reading, PA 19606
(610) 779 3466

 

[Slowpoke]

Z,
I'm building that rifle right now for my daughter. You haven't lived until you tried to inlet that thimble. It took me a better part of a day to make it and inlet it in to the stock. I'll take some pictures of it for ya.

SP