Can you show me your wore out brass frame?

[bobthemotorcycle]

I have been studying and learning about 1851 Navy revolvers for a week or so now. All the reviews of the brass frame made revolvers are good and positive. In a few post and a few comments I have heard of people talking about how the brass frames are junk.

Can you please show me a picture of where you wore the revolver out or share a story where you personally wore or broke the revolver. As it stands now I plan on investing into a couple of more brass frame revolvers but if somebody has personally had a bad experience please show me so I will not waste money and I can invest into something better.

Thanks.

 

[Eljay]

If you search around you can definitely find pictures where there's been an impression made on the frame from the back of the cylinder. Clearly if you ever see this back off your loads!

As far as I can tell the brass thing is overblown in current production guns. You do need to watch your loads but if they're not abused you can get good value out of them. Everybody who seems to hate them had some incident, or heard of some incident back in the day. So if anybody does chime in with a story of damage, I'd be interested in knowing how long ago this happened and how old the gun was.

 

[t.l.a.r. eng]

My friend has an older 51 brass Navy built back in the 70's believe by A.S.M. and it is a horrible example of a brass Navy.

The arbor screws into the brass frame and the threads are worn out and there is no viseable means of locking the arbor to the frame. You can take the barrel off and unscrew the arbor one half or one full turn and re assemble with a horrendous gap between the barrel and frame.

Even with the arbor screwed into its intended position and the wedge locked, the gun is still wobbly, and in my opinion shouldn't be fired.

Keeping a steel arbor tight in a brass frame is hard to do without some form of mechanical locking, staking, pins, etc.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

Back in the 1960's and even the 1970's, there was some horrendous brass frame junk. Better manufacturing and better alloys have improved things immensely. I have seen brass framed colts in which the arbor had nearly a full millimeter of loose play in and out. On a brass framed Remmie, I saw one in which the cylinder slid back and forth enough that the hand would not reliably rotate the cylinder.

It is something that is typical from the notion that if a little powder is good a lot more must be a lot better. Full max loads, hammering the heck out of unknown brass alloys.

It is less likely with someone who cares about the gun they invested in. In the 1960's, brass colt repros could be had for about $25. while minimum wage was $1.60 About 15 hours of minimum wage work. Todays are better made with better metals and usually better cared for, and cost about 20 hours of minimum wage work.

 

[bobthemotorcycle]

Good stories, thanks.

I remember back in the 70's if somebody showed my dad a Uberti revolver he would laugh at them. To him Uberti was the biggest joke in the world. It was for guys who did not know anything about guns. Cowboys shot Colts and Rugers Blackhawks. Now days in the cowboy world Uberti is considered a reputable company with a well-made gun.

I must agree with what you guys say. At one time Italian brass frames were not great frames but I believe that since most are made on CNC machines now days and people know better then to max load them that they are a gun that is good enough to last a long time.

I know my Pietta made pistol has a nice finish where the parts match up great. No big overlaps in the mating areas. The fit is quality and the finish is very nice.

Would still like to hear some horror stories.

 

[IONBuckaroo]

I posted this in another forum a year or so ago, but it might be appropriate to re-post here.

Several years ago I was in a local gun shop and there were two brass frame cap and ball revolvers laying on the counter. I picked them up and they were so loose they rattled, and the barrels flopped back and forth. I commented to the clerk that they must have been shot an awful lot. He said they had not been shot at all. He had loaned them as props to a theatrical company a year or two before and they had just been returned. For this reason, I would never consider purchasing a brass frame revolver.

IONBuccaroo

 

[Don]

Heres the bottom line on brass framed revolvers. They are completely safe to shoot. Will they hold up as long as steel framed ones?, no. But, if you load them with no more than 25 grains of powder(for a .44 cal.) then you can shoot them for a long time before you have issues. The .36 cal revolvers you need to keep the loads less than 20 grains of powder. In both calibers stick with round ball they are lighter and put less stress on the gun. Also, load the cylinders off the frame with a loading device, this will extend the life of the frame. I still own a few brassers and I don't consider them junk.

Don

 

[Blizzard of '93]

I've owned 3 brass-frame '58 Remmys - never loaded more than 25gr 3f under balls and if there was any wear I did not notice it.

 

[PRM]

Back in the mid-70s I bought two brass frame Navies. Don't remember the brand, but they were cheap. Both went out of time very quickly and I didn't keep them long.

In the early 80s I bought a .31 CVA Pocket Remington. The Remington frame with a top strap was a plus on strength along with the 10 grain powder charge it used. I kept that little gun for about 15 years and had no issues with it.

I later went to a Uberti steel frame that is still a great gun. My son now owns and shoots it. When I could afford it - I upgraded to 2nd Generation Colts. Got two 1851 Navies, one Pocket Navy and one Pocket Police, A Walker and a Signature Series Paterson. I have never regretted any of the Colts. The Pocket Models are my favorites.

 

[Kentuckywindage]

dont have a picture of the one that came apart in my hand, nor do i have pictures of the other 2 replacements cabelas sent me that failed after 9 shots and the other one that didnt cock right out of the box

Brass is pretty but doesnt belong on a handgun. The only reason they were made was because the south was strapped for cash and did not have the funds or machining for steel.

 

[desi23]

My first two cap & ball revolvers were both brass frame guns. I put a lot of lead downrange over about 15 years with those two before they loosened up. The Hawes sheriffs model navy base pin came loose causing the barrel to wobble so I retired it. The full length navy was getting out of time, then it got the base pin wobble too so it got the same treatment. Ended up giving them to a friend as decoraters.

The steel frame navy that was my third purchase is still going strong after 40 years of use. I used to put at least a few hundred loads through each of them for several years so I think I got my moneys worth out of them.

 

[bobthemotorcycle]

Good stories, keep them coming please.

 

[pargent]

:thumbsup: It is my understanding that the brass frame will stretch, yes I do own and use a brass frame 44 navy but as you do with lighter loads .

 

[CaptainKirk]

Keep the loads light as mentioned (less than 25 for a .44, less than 20 for a .36) and they should hold up fine.

 

[rodwha]

I'm a little curious how long a brass framed 1858 .44 pistol would last were I using a 25 grn charge of 3F Triple 7.

 

[necchi]

I don't think there can ever be a determined number of shot's,
There isn't an answer like;
"Your Revolver will be fine for 1,338 shot's then it will be worn out."
Or;
"It'll last 14 months 2 weeks and 4 days."

There are simply too many variables with how the individual will care for his gun.

It's been repeated many times in many threads that brass frames will last a long time with low to moderate loads.

25grns of 3F T7,, is not a low or moderate load.

It boils down to what a guy is after, accuracy is key.

Let's cut to the chase, usually when guy's are seeking maximum loads they have in mind self defense or "hunting" and being able to use these cap and ball revolvers for such.
A .451 >.457 ball moving even at low charges is more than enough to cause severe damage to bodily parts.
I think study of how a wound channel and the location of a wound channel in game or otherworks,
is more important than how hard it's going to hit with 20grns vrs 40grns.

Accuracy is key.

 

[rodwha]

Hogdgon's states that 25 grns of 3F T7 in an 1858 would give 763 fps, which gives 182 ft/lbs. Seems that any less than this isn't much good for anything other than shooting paper/cans...

I want my guns to do more than just punch holes in paper/cans.

 

[rodwha]

One thing I find odd is the 12" barreled models of 1858 that only seem to come with a brass frame. These seem more ideal for hunting yet can't handle a hunting load.

I would want one. I've also been looking at a Walker and any number of side lock .50 cal pistols for hunting from a stand with.

As it stands I have my 7 1/2" Old Army for that so I'd want something with a longer barrel or larger caliber.

 

[Al Cummins]

Ive put many a round through my brasser and really 15 grains is a gods plenty for punching paper or killin cans, and if your hunting.....dont take the brasser! I do not have pics but I have seen them with imprints in the recoil shield that still shot just fine, long story short, they are worth every penny of the buck thirty they cost.

 

[nkbj]

My brothers first percussion revolver was a brass framed '51 frame .44. He hung it on the wall about ten years ago after it developed some slack. Took a lot of shooting to get it there.