I just got done reading Mike Nesbitts article about a second gun. I really liked it due to the fact I am looking to try and get a good turkey gun. I really like the size of the canoe gun because I do alot of running and gunning for turkey. I was going to use 65 grains of powder and number six shot. I was going with the 30" barrel. would this be ok to try and take a turkey out to thirty yards ethically with a clean kill with proper shot placement? I was also wondering if it would be ok to use as a good tree rat gun? I am new to all this canoe gun stuff and some say it is not "pc" is this true? any advice would be greatly appreciated.
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Canoe Gun
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Don't know where you are but "running and gunning for turkey" here is highly illegal.
I have a 32" 12ga Colerain that I wouldn't trust at 30 yards and patterns pretty much suck at 20 yards. You may want to look into jug choking for such a short barrel.
I have a 32" 12ga Colerain that I wouldn't trust at 30 yards and patterns pretty much suck at 20 yards. You may want to look into jug choking for such a short barrel.
There is no evidence that a "Canoe gun" was ever made as an original, brand new gun.
There is little doubt that there were guns which were shortened during their life but whether these were shortened to allow handy use while sitting in a canoe or more likely were shortened because the muzzle end of the barrel was damaged is unknown.
The word "Canoe Gun" seems to spark heated feelings among some people in the shooting community and as a general guide I would suggest that the term not be used.
As for using #6 shot IMO it is a little light for turkey. It should be about right for squirrels but I think I would lean towards #4 for turkey and bunnies.
There is little doubt that there were guns which were shortened during their life but whether these were shortened to allow handy use while sitting in a canoe or more likely were shortened because the muzzle end of the barrel was damaged is unknown.
The word "Canoe Gun" seems to spark heated feelings among some people in the shooting community and as a general guide I would suggest that the term not be used.
As for using #6 shot IMO it is a little light for turkey. It should be about right for squirrels but I think I would lean towards #4 for turkey and bunnies.
Bountyhunter
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You sayin that calling a Trade gun a Canoe gun is like calling a TC a Hawken?
Why is this topic under "Rifles"?
A cylinder bore short barreled gun is not a good choice for turkeys.
A cylinder bore short barreled gun is not a good choice for turkeys.
Thanks for the replies as for running and gunning you bet we do here in Tn. We have about 800 private acres in which to hunt these great birds and if we hear em a gobblin we go towards that wonderful sound then set up and try and get one to come in all love sick. If we dont sound sweet enough for him we move on to the next set up. As far as offending someone because of the use of a term, man are we getting just plain picky in some areas of the shooting community. If someone could not ask a honest question about a term canoe gun without offending a group then buddy I dont want that groups opinion no how, but thank you for your advice I might have to go with a better shot.
paulvallandigham
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Pellet energy is going to be pretty week at 30 yards, using That shot, and powder charge. I would recommend using #5 shot for better retained energy, and increase that load to 80 grains of FFFg powder, or 90 grains of FFg powder. To get better patterns, you will need to use some kind of shot cup, and it would help if your gun is choked to modified. Jug, or screw in.
I too don't know where you are going to be running after a Turkey with any hopes of catching it. If other hunters are around, it might be a dangerous thing to do, even wearing Blaze Orange.
I too don't know where you are going to be running after a Turkey with any hopes of catching it. If other hunters are around, it might be a dangerous thing to do, even wearing Blaze Orange.
Black Hand
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Forget the Canoe Gun and buy yourself a proper, full-sized smoothbore. If you are concerned about length, get a 36" barrel.
A canoe gun has a shortened buttstock (and barrel) which would make it more difficult to shoulder and aim properly. They are a "novelty" gun more than anything......
A canoe gun has a shortened buttstock (and barrel) which would make it more difficult to shoulder and aim properly. They are a "novelty" gun more than anything......
This was not suppose to be a question about how to hunt a turkey just if the gun and load would be ok. Forive the term "run and gun" I guess nobody but me will try and move ahead of a gobbler if he is not responding and walks off. To try and move and cut him off before he gets down one holler and back up the next must just be impossible. Where im from when we have 800 private acres posted we generally dont need to feel the need to wear blaze orange when turkey hunting. If I did feel the need i might as well have the gamewarden with me because the only other person besides me and the turkeys would be a poacher and I guess maybe he could let the poacher know I was going to try and get in front and cut off the turkey.
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chance said:
You must have missed this discussion?
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/223701
Last edited by a moderator:
Russ T Frizzen
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You'll want a longer barrel. This will give a velocity gain and the longer barrels tend to pattern better--a 42" or longer barrel is good. I use #5 shot for turkey and some people go even heavier.
The whole "canoe gun" thing is best forgotten for now. Later, if you get bored or lose your mind, you can join the rest of us in this scintillating and crucial debate. Enjoy the turkey hunting and good luck! :v
The whole "canoe gun" thing is best forgotten for now. Later, if you get bored or lose your mind, you can join the rest of us in this scintillating and crucial debate. Enjoy the turkey hunting and good luck! :v
paulvallandigham
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I am glad to hear of someone who has all that acreage to himself for hunting. Congratulations on your good fortune. But what might be a safe tactic for you on that 800 acre tract, will be very UNSAFE for the majority of the people who read this forum.
I was not intending to question your tactics, or skill. I just wanted to point out how difficult it is to do what you say you do. More power to you. Turkeys not only have good hearing, but they also " listen " with their feet, as do most wild animals. When a large animal, like a human goes running through the woods, the vibrations are picked up not only by the game animals you might be stalking, or trying to intersect, but all that fast movement alerts other birds and mammals in the forest, who send out alarm calls. Those alarm calls are then sent out like the ripples in a still pond when you drop a rock into the water, with widening circles of sound as other birds and mammals pick up the alarm and give out their own alarms.
" Running and Gunning " may not be what you exactly do, but I have to take new posters at their words- it would be very rude to assume otherwise-- and I responded accordingly. Lots of us have spent time in the field all our lives, and some of the things people write about I just have to see done for myself. I have tried these things, and failed. It took me years to learn WHY they failed.
I have tried to make you( and others) aware of the alarms that animals give off in the woods, of the fact that other animals listen to these alarms to alert them of danger, and tell them where the danger is located and how fast its coming in their direction if at all.
Finally, I have tried to tell you and others how the CONCENTRIC RINGS OF SOUND works, so you can spend some time listening to it in the woods and understand it when you hear it. Then use it to your advantage. You, like all of us, are going to have days when you just are NOT in the right place at the right time to have that deer, or turkey or other game come your way. It happens. More times than we care to admit. But you learn from that day's movement where to set up the next day or later the same day.
Its called "Hunting". If it were easy, it would be called " Getting ", and everyone would be doing it. :thumbsup: :hatsoff:
I was not intending to question your tactics, or skill. I just wanted to point out how difficult it is to do what you say you do. More power to you. Turkeys not only have good hearing, but they also " listen " with their feet, as do most wild animals. When a large animal, like a human goes running through the woods, the vibrations are picked up not only by the game animals you might be stalking, or trying to intersect, but all that fast movement alerts other birds and mammals in the forest, who send out alarm calls. Those alarm calls are then sent out like the ripples in a still pond when you drop a rock into the water, with widening circles of sound as other birds and mammals pick up the alarm and give out their own alarms.
" Running and Gunning " may not be what you exactly do, but I have to take new posters at their words- it would be very rude to assume otherwise-- and I responded accordingly. Lots of us have spent time in the field all our lives, and some of the things people write about I just have to see done for myself. I have tried these things, and failed. It took me years to learn WHY they failed.
I have tried to make you( and others) aware of the alarms that animals give off in the woods, of the fact that other animals listen to these alarms to alert them of danger, and tell them where the danger is located and how fast its coming in their direction if at all.
Finally, I have tried to tell you and others how the CONCENTRIC RINGS OF SOUND works, so you can spend some time listening to it in the woods and understand it when you hear it. Then use it to your advantage. You, like all of us, are going to have days when you just are NOT in the right place at the right time to have that deer, or turkey or other game come your way. It happens. More times than we care to admit. But you learn from that day's movement where to set up the next day or later the same day.
Its called "Hunting". If it were easy, it would be called " Getting ", and everyone would be doing it. :thumbsup: :hatsoff:
Well all I can say to you is that our turkeys down here must be DEAF and walked across to many hot rocks and lost felling in their feet. The way we hunt turkey down here must be totally different then the way you have hunted them during your extensive hunting years. You sure do got alot up against you when trying to get your game. I hope you have great success with your ripple technique but as for me and my hunting companions we better stay with what has for many a years put Deaf birds on our tables with great success but hey maybe when the ripples from the pond you are talking about reach our little hunting hole you can come teach us your way of doing things since we have not mastered your way of hunting. hope you have great success in your hunting season to come. :bow:
Capt. Jas.
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John Kerry also had some very unique master hunting techniques.
"I go out with my trusty 12-gauge double-barrel, crawl around on my stomach. I track and move and decoy and play games and try to outsmart them. You know, you kind of play the wind. That's hunting!"
:rotf:
"I go out with my trusty 12-gauge double-barrel, crawl around on my stomach. I track and move and decoy and play games and try to outsmart them. You know, you kind of play the wind. That's hunting!"
:rotf:
Is it just me, or are our postings lately getting more "testy"? I think a few years ago, when I found this forum rather by accident, and thought I had found the promised land, there was more of cordial exchange of enthusiasm and useful tips. Now there seems to be a bit more criticism and personal animosity. I ain't ready to quit, by a long shot, but---is this just my misperception? Good smoke, Ron in FL
paulvallandigham
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Lockjaw: For what its worth, That shooting that Dick Cheney was involved in is one of the very few "hunting accidents" that can be truly said to be the " victim's" fault. It was decent of the Vice Presicent to take the full blame for the accident, as " he pulled the trigger", but the accident was beyond his control because of the freak timing of events. Only the Victim controlled those timing factors. If you want to know why that is, PM me, and I will discuss the details. I am not interested in moving off the topic of this thread.
Chance has raised an interesting question about Turkey Hunting, with a light load and smoothbore. He deserves our answer. I am personally thrilled to know someone has such a huge area to hunt by himself, and that the terrain allows him to do the kind of hunting he describes. Its not the kind of terrain I am used to hunting.
I wish him only the best. :hatsoff:
Chance has raised an interesting question about Turkey Hunting, with a light load and smoothbore. He deserves our answer. I am personally thrilled to know someone has such a huge area to hunt by himself, and that the terrain allows him to do the kind of hunting he describes. Its not the kind of terrain I am used to hunting.
I wish him only the best. :hatsoff:
ronrryan said:
I think, to a certain extent, this happens when people become familiar with a place. When people first join, they are on their best behavior. After they've been around for a while, they tend to relax and their true personality comes though. Most of the time that's a good thing, as they open up and feel part of the "community".
Please don't let a few discourage you. The vast majority of the members are still as helpful and polite as they've always been.
