Cap Jam Fix On Colt Pocket Models

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rodwha

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After watching Mr. Beliveau's video where he replaced the stock nipples on his '51 Navy with Slix Shot nipples I wondered if anyone has fixed their Colt Pocket model with only a swap with these nipples instead of the many other things I've read some do.
 
Usually between 15 and 22 grains of triple 7 using round ball, Kaido flat nose, or lee round nose bullets
 
I've read that many have changed their stock nipples out to TRESO's, but still had continual cap jams.

Those of you who have switched to TRESO's don't have a problem with cap jams? I don't mean never a jam, but I've seen Mr. Beliveau's video in which it would jam about 3 times each cylinder!
 
I think the only way to "Fix" the cap jamming with a Colt is to become very proficient at that "flip" of the wrist it takes,,
Or
Sell the Colt and buy a Remington.
 
If only someone made a repro of the Remington Police!

But I still like the looks of the Colt.

Some range officers would likely not care much for you tipping your pistol. Maybe if you rolled it sideways, but I'm not sure if there's room for that idea to work.
 
A lot of people don't consider up a safe direction to point a gun.

I have when I'm out in the middle of nowhere, though many might flame me for it. I wouldn't do it where I didn't feel I was far from others.
 
The simplest fix for cap jams is to fill in that safety notch on the hammer face. Brazing or welding would be best but I have used JB Weld on mine and I rarely get caps under the hammer any more. The split caps get jammed into that cutout and then the hammer pulls them off the nipple and they drop into the action. With a smooth hammer face the cap may get blown back a bit but it doesn't stick to the hammer and get pulled off. Any replacement nipple with a smaller flash hole will help too. If you fill the notch then you can't use the safety pins between the nipples on the back of the cylinder to hold the hammer. You'd best just load 5 chambers and rest the hammer on the empty one. I've seen ASM & Pietta Colt clones that don't even have the safety pins but still use a hammer with a notch for them.
 
I'm havin a mod done to one of mine to double ensure no jams. If I understand correctly Manhattan Arms version of the Colt had some type of shield or something to fix this problem on their revolvers
 
Your right. I've seen them too. A simple curved
piece if sheet metal that fits in front of the
hammer from the left. That guides the cap past the
curve in the hammer and off to the right side and
out...
Wulf
 
Ok, I realize this is quite some necroposting, but the issue still comes up, so here something for those who come to this post in search of answers.
I don't have all of them, I'm still testing, but I have some, and some information that perhaps my help others.

I've been fightinh this issue for quite some time, I've made dozens of tests, and I've found out several things, managing to fix the issue in my Navy and Walker, but not in my 1849 Pocket. So, here what I've found.

Cap jams happen
1) in the best case scenario when the cap prevents the cylinder to turn, then in the next worse
2) when it comes to be stuck between the frame shield back curve and the hammer, preventing the hammer to hit the primer in the next chamber, and then, worst scenario,
3) when a cap or piece of cap falls down in the mechanism and locks up everything for good.

Now, the quick fix for 1) is helping the cylinder back and forth until the cap fragments are expelled from bewteen cylinder and frame, for 2) removing the cap with the tip of a toothpick or something like that and for 3), well... you have to take down the whole damn thing.

But what everyone wants to know is how to prevent the damn caps to cause issues at all in the first place.
To this end, I've read a lot of things, some work, some not, like flicking the gun while cocking the hammer, filing or filling the safety notch on the hammer, or using different nipples and such. Some seem to work for some, but not others.
For example, I rounded up the corners of the safety notch in my Uberti 1851 Navy, and that solved the issue.
With "solved" I mean I've shot something like 36 cylinders without a single cap jam.
I did the same in my Uberti 1849 Pocket, and it didn't do any difference at all.
Why?

Well, for starters, let's remember original Colt revolvers worked. They were considered very reliable, and dependable. Cap jams existed but were rare. Yes, they were a flaw in the gun, as Remingtons apparently never had them, but they were not that common anyway, or nobody would have carried a Colt, if it jammed every other shot.
Therefore, it must be something in how the gun or the caps are made.

So, the next interesting question is "how the cap jam happens?"
After some tests I've found basically three ways they can happen.

A) Fragments of the cap badly blown gets stuck between cylinder face and recoil shield. This usually causes type 1) cap jams.
That's what the slot in the recoil shield it's meant for: to leave room for cap fragments to slip through and get out of the action. This can be quickly filled in crud, particularly if shooting dirty powder. Also, it depends upon how modern caps are made: they are far thicker than a few vintage caps I could observe, who looked like they were made more like copper foil than stamped copper sheet: being far thinner they almost disintegrated. I couldn't handle them and press them between fingers to ascertain how thick and hard they were, but they sure looked flimsier than our modern caps. Unfortunately we must live and shoot with what we have, but choosing softer, flimsier caps may help, as well as keeping the gun very well oiled with black powder suitable oils, and using nipples that leak as little blowback as possible.

B) The blown cap gets stuck in the safety notch in the hammer, pulled back and falls in the gap between receiver and hammer. You can detect this kind of cause by shooting a shot, then cocking the hammer while carefully looking in bright light at the hammer's face and nipple: you will see the cap being pulled back and falling. This causes type 2) and 3) jams. Smoothing the notch corners will cure this issue 100% or as close as 100% as you can get.

C) Blowback from the nipple will blow the cap against the hammer, and the hammer back enough to allow the cap to fall between hammer and frame. This causes typically a type 2) cap jam, very rarely type 3). You can detect this kind of cause by cocking the hammer while carefully looking at the nipple and hammer face, and you won't see a cap there, because it's already been blown back into the frame. You'l find it there, already sqashed by the hammer, pushed by the mainspring.
This is tricky, and is what is happening in my Colt 1849 Pocket.

The causes are deemed to be
- nipples with large flash hole causing undue blowback against the hammer
- weak hammer spring that lets the hammer easily be blown back, also considering the Pocket hammer is much lighter than the Navy's so, less inertia.

Only, mine is a late model, so yes, it already has nipples the same size as the Navy (they are interchangeable, not historically accurate but very practical) and yes, it already has nipples with a small flash hole. I don't know if it's as small as, say, the Slixshot nipples, as I don't have them.
And, finally, it should have the strongest mainspring.
But it does it all the same.
What to do? I tried to round the safety slot corners, to no avail.
I tried to cut a small notch in the nipple crown as suggested by some, as it was meant to help the cap blow upwards instead of back into the gun, to no avail.
Next steps are
- getting another mainspring to try the double mainspring trick that should make the hammer harder to blow back
- getting Slixshot nipples. This is not easy, as I will have to get them sent to Italy. Mumble mumble... As an alternative, I will try to drill a hole on the side of the nipples I have, like the one Slixshot have, that is supposed to help destroy the cap and help divert much of the blowback laterally.

PS: yes, I know of the cap rake (pin fitted into the frame to prevent the cap to come back) but I don't like it and the gun should work well without one.


I'll keep you posted.
 
Last edited:
Ok, I realize this is quite some necroposting, but the issue still comes up, so here something for those who come to this post in search of answers.
I don't have all of them, I'm still testing, but I have some, and some information that perhaps my help others.

I've been fightinh this issue for quite some time, I've made dozens of tests, and I've found out several things, managing to fix the issue in my Navy and Walker, but not in my 1849 Pocket. So, here what I've found.

Cap jams happen
1) in the best case scenario when the cap prevents the cylinder to turn, then in the next worse
2) when it comes to be stuck between the frame shield back curve and the hammer, preventing the hammer to hit the primer in the next chamber, and then, worst scenario,
3) when a cap or piece of cap falls down in the mechanism and locks up everything for good.

Now, the quick fix for 1) is helping the cylinder back and forth until the cap fragments are expelled from bewteen cylinder and frame, for 2) removing the cap with the tip of a toothpick or something like that and for 3), well... you have to take down the whole damn thing.

But what everyone wants to know is how to prevent the damn caps to cause issues at all in the first place.
To this end, I've read a lot of things, some work, some not, like flicking the gun while cocking the hammer, filing or filling the safety notch on the hammer, or using different nipples and such. Some seem to work for some, but not others.
For example, I rounded up the corners of the safety notch in my Uberti 1851 Navy, and that solved the issue.
With "solved" I mean I've shot something like 36 cylinders without a single cap jam.
I did the same in my Uberti 1849 Pocket, and it didn't do any difference at all.
Why?

Well, for starters, let's remember original Colt revolvers worked. They were considered very reliable, and dependable. Cap jams existed but were rare. Yes, they were a flaw in the gun, as Remingtons apparently never had them, but they were not that common anyway, or nobody would have carried a Colt, if it jammed every other shot.
Therefore, it must be something in how the gun or the caps are made.

So, the next interesting question is "how the cap jam happens?"
After some tests I've found basically three ways they can happen.

A) Fragments of the cap badly blown gets stuck between cylinder face and recoil shield. This usually causes type 1) cap jams.
That's what the slot in the recoil shield it's meant for: to leave room for cap fragments to slip through and get out of the action. This can be quickly filled in crud, particularly if shooting dirty powder. Also, it depends upon how modern caps are made: they are far thicker than a few vintage caps I could observe, who looked like they were made more like copper foil than stamped copper sheet: being far thinner they almost disintegrated. I couldn't handle them and press them between fingers to ascertain how thick and hard they were, but they sure looked flimsier than our modern caps. Unfortunately we must live and shoot with what we have, but choosing softer, flimsier caps may help, as well as keeping the gun very well oiled with black powder suitable oils, and using nipples that leak as little blowback as possible.

B) The blown cap gets stuck in the safety notch in the hammer, pulled back and falls in the gap between receiver and hammer. You can detect this kind of cause by shooting a shot, then cocking the hammer while carefully looking in bright light at the hammer's face and nipple: you will see the cap being pulled back and falling. This causes type 2) and 3) jams. Smoothing the notch corners will cure this issue 100% or as close as 100% as you can get.

C) Blowback from the nipple will blow the cap against the hammer, and the hammer back enough to allow the cap to fall between hammer and frame. This causes typically a type 2) cap jam, very rarely type 3). You can detect this kind of cause by cocking the hammer while carefully looking at the nipple and hammer face, and you won't see a cap there, because it's already been blown back into the frame. You'l find it there, already sqashed by the hammer, pushed by the mainspring.
This is tricky, and is what is happening in my Colt 1849 Pocket.

The causes are deemed to be
- nipples with large flash hole causing undue blowback against the hammer
- weak hammer spring that lets the hammer easily be blown back, also considering the Pocket hammer is much lighter than the Navy's so, less inertia.

Only, mine is a late model, so yes, it already has nipples the same size as the Navy (they are interchangeable, not historically accurate but very practical) and yes, it already has nipples with a small flash hole. I don't know if it's as small as, say, the Slixshot nipples, as I don't have them.
And, finally, it should have the strongest mainspring.
But it does it all the same.
What to do? I tried to round the safety slot corners, to no avail.
I tried to cut a small notch in the nipple crown as suggested by some, as it was meant to help the cap blow upwards instead of back into the gun, to no avail.
Next steps are
- getting another mainspring to try the double mainspring trick that should make the hammer harder to blow back
- getting Slixshot nipples. This is not easy, as I will have to get them sent to Italy. Mumble mumble... As an alternative, I will try to drill a hole on the side of the nipples I have, like the one Slixshot have, that is supposed to help destroy the cap and help divert much of the blowback laterally.

PS: yes, I know of the cap rake (pin fitted into the frame to prevent the cap to come back) but I don't like it and the gun should work well without one.


I'll keep you posted.
I have the same problem with my Uberti 1851 Navy in .36. I tried Silxshot nipples to no avail, I only tested 3 different caps as that is all I could source. I tried RWS 1075 plus, CCI#11 magnum with the standard mainspring and Lee mainspring. I have regular RWS1075 that I tested with the Lee spring with no luck next is to test it with the stock mainspring but it will have to warm up for the next test. This is frustrating and my revolver I would call extremely unreliable and getting to be not fun to shoot.
 
PS: yes, I know of the cap rake (pin fitted into the frame to prevent the cap to come back) but I don't like it and the gun should work well without one.


I'll keep you posted.
well bless your little heart!!! You just keep searching and let us all know what needs to be done to keep these pesky cap jams from happening!!!

As for now, the competition bunch has pretty much been able to rectify (fix) the problem with what you don't like and put up some rather impressive numbers but if you can do bettah, jus let us know by all means!!!
I doubt they could shoot theyah way out of ah wet papah bag but if you could enlighten us as to the best way of avoiding this modern day problem we would all be blessed !!
Thank you sur fawah all your hep!!!

Y'all stay alert!! Ya he'ah ? 😁

Myke
 
well bless your little heart!!! You just keep searching and let us all know what needs to be done to keep these pesky cap jams from happening!!!

As for now, the competition bunch has pretty much been able to rectify (fix) the problem with what you don't like and put up some rather impressive numbers but if you can do bettah, jus let us know by all means!!!
I doubt they could shoot theyah way out of ah wet papah bag but if you could enlighten us as to the best way of avoiding this modern day problem we would all be blessed !!
Thank you sur fawah all your hep!!!

Y'all stay alert!! Ya he'ah ? 😁

Myke
So that's it, the cap rake is really the only fix? Just curious why the originals seem to run fine back in the day but the modern repros have issues. Is it the caps or the gun?
 
So that's it, the cap rake is really the only fix? Just curious why the originals seem to run fine back in the day but the modern repros have issues. Is it the caps or the gun?
I reckon so . . .

If we had CORRECT revolvers with the caps THEY had and "cartridges" THEY had it might be different but we have what we have so deal with it or let our grand kids know what we shouldah, couldah done different. It's never been a "perfect" world but I can help ya with what's available today that will run like a fool whether you like it or not, that's your call.
It's amazing how folks will argue what we have today CAN'T be better than the "ANEMIC" revolvers of the past but if you prove otherwise, your a liar, can't be ! "You just don't understand . . . but with the cap makers of today, the reproductions of today what in the world do you really expect?
Keep searching or enjoy what's available . . . there's something for everybody . . .

Mike
 
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