CCI Caps - CCI reply regarding availability

[ETipp]

I emailed CCI yesterday asking if caps are being produced and why caps cannot be found anywhere. I don't buy the response but the following is the reply from CCI technical services.

"We are currently producing and shipping millions of primers and caps a day. With the current market we are in it is very difficult for distributors and dealers to keep them on the shelves. Our products are sent directly from the plant to distributors. Where it is then sold to retailers and then to you. We have no way of tracking who has it or when they will receive it in stock."

Millions a day kind of cracks me up, just don't see it.

Ethan at “ I Love Muzzleloaders “ has already gotten to the bottom of this. He spoke with representatives of the company and the information he obtained is entirely different. His video should still be available.

Personally, I do not believe the information you received is accurate.

Either way, it’s time folks start making their own caps. The cap situation has gotten beyond insane.

 

[Ditt44]

... and there is a war in Europe, and you can bet any and every US company is going to submit bids to produce materials for that conflict because there is far more money in contract work than supplying hunting and recreational shooting supplies to a niche of a niche market in the US.

 

[ETipp]

... and there is a war in Europe, and you can bet any and every US company is going to submit bids to produce materials for that conflict because there is far more money in contract work than supplying hunting and recreational shooting supplies to a niche of a niche market in the US.

Exactly. Thus making caps for us little guys means nothing to them. I do not foresee this situation getting any better. At least in the short term, if ever.

 

[Rebel bull]

as I have stated here before caps are only produced if and when there is a break in the need/orders chain for primers. as a retiree from a part of the Vista Outdoors group ( parent company of CCI and Remington Ammunition ) I know this is a fact! The cure for this is to order/buy more when they are available if there is a case (10 tins) on the shelf/hook buy em all, if there is 2 3 4 cases on the shelf buy em all. retailers stock their shelves with what has the fastest turnover, if it takes a year to sell 10 tins then they aren't going to order enough often enough to create a demand for greater production! this is the same for everything doesn't matter what it is. Don't believe me ask Kibler if he would produce a single kit if he wasn't in a constant state of back order !

 

[ernbar]

Don’t buy their response. I’m on several stock alert notices for #10 &11 caps, large pistol and rifle primers. So far small pistol and rifle primers are becoming available but not the large rifle primers. Large pistol primers has popped up now and then but nothing about caps. Powders are becoming available too but the prices on ALL components have doubled or tripled in pricing. Then you have the shops selling caps for $28 a tin while Academy had the caps for $9.99 a tin, common plain greed by some shops. Midway charges a hazmat fee on powders and primers plus an additional handling fee for black powder. I for one refuse to pay these unfair prices and while other bend and pay up the abuse will continue.

 

[ernbar]

... and there is a war in Europe, and you can bet any and every US company is going to submit bids to produce materials for that conflict because there is far more money in contract work than supplying hunting and recreational shooting supplies to a niche of a niche market in the US.

True that but why shortages and price increases before the current conflict?

 

[manbat]

I don't think we will ever see availability for caps change, or at best, it will be many years before it does. In the past, most folks had loads of them, stores were well stocked, and the minimal manufacturing required to restock could keep up. Now, lots of folks are on the hunt, few stores have them, they sell out immediately, and the minimal manufacturing that worked in the past can't keep up. No company will invest new capital for additional manufacturing capabilities to fill a temporary niche product need with a shrinking customer base or reallocate manufacturing time away from products widely in demand, probably tied to contract delivery and time requirements, and likely more profitable. It's easy for those of us sitting on thousands of caps to suggest controlled buying so others can get them, but it really is an unfortunate situation that calls for buying whatever is available when you can - and paying the price to get them when they are available.

 

[Terrier]

as I have stated here before caps are only produced if and when there is a break in the need/orders chain for primers. as a retiree from a part of the Vista Outdoors group ( parent company of CCI and Remington Ammunition ) I know this is a fact! The cure for this is to order/buy more when they are available if there is a case (10 tins) on the shelf/hook buy em all, if there is 2 3 4 cases on the shelf buy em all. retailers stock their shelves with what has the fastest turnover, if it takes a year to sell 10 tins then they aren't going to order enough often enough to create a demand for greater production! this is the same for everything doesn't matter what it is. Don't believe me ask Kibler if he would produce a single kit if he wasn't in a constant state of back order !

Your response makes the most sense about this issue I’ve heard in a long while.

 

[ETipp]

True that but why shortages and price increases before the current conflict?

Because the government has been letting out contracts for ammo for a few years.. This increased big time when Obama was in office and it hasn’t really slowed much.

 

[ETipp]

as I have stated here before caps are only produced if and when there is a break in the need/orders chain for primers. as a retiree from a part of the Vista Outdoors group ( parent company of CCI and Remington Ammunition ) I know this is a fact! The cure for this is to order/buy more when they are available if there is a case (10 tins) on the shelf/hook buy em all, if there is 2 3 4 cases on the shelf buy em all. retailers stock their shelves with what has the fastest turnover, if it takes a year to sell 10 tins then they aren't going to order enough often enough to create a demand for greater production! this is the same for everything doesn't matter what it is. Don't believe me ask Kibler if he would produce a single kit if he wasn't in a constant state of back order !

I don’t necessarily buy that either. Primers and caps are different animals.

For those that will not spend the time to look up Ethan’s video on this, he spoke with representatives of the company. They contend that they have to change over the machines to produce caps. It is a costly ordeal and they only change over and run caps for a very limited time once per year.

Primers and caps are not the same nor are they produced the same.

You all can fight over caps all you want. There is an alternative and I don’t mean flintlocks.

 

[B P Maniac Shooter]

Looking at this from the company's point of view.....

Why would CCI or Remington care about making #11 caps when they have lots of modern day shooters begging for primers to reload modern shells. Those manufacturers can ( and probably are already ) keeping their assembly lines running 24/7 and still cannot catch up with making modern shell primers.

I'm surprised they take the time stopping production to retool for making #11 percussion caps at all.

 

[RB POWELL]

I emailed CCI yesterday asking if caps are being produced and why caps cannot be found anywhere. I don't buy the response but the following is the reply from CCI technical services.

"We are currently producing and shipping millions of primers and caps a day. With the current market we are in it is very difficult for distributors and dealers to keep them on the shelves. Our products are sent directly from the plant to distributors. Where it is then sold to retailers and then to you. We have no way of tracking who has it or when they will receive it in stock."

Millions a day kind of cracks me up, just don't see it.

It would be nice to get an informative, accurate answer from a cap maker. Everything now is double-speak.

 

[RB POWELL]

No "factory made" caps will spell the eventual demise of Pietta, Uberti. etc. I doubt that there are many first time buyers who will have the where-with-al to make their own caps. That goes for casual cap and ball users also. Just a thought.

 

[snakebit]

Don’t buy their response. I’m on several stock alert notices for #10 &11 caps, large pistol and rifle primers. So far small pistol and rifle primers are becoming available but not the large rifle primers. Large pistol primers has popped up now and then but nothing about caps. Powders are becoming available too but the prices on ALL components have doubled or tripled in pricing. Then you have the shops selling caps for $28 a tin while Academy had the caps for $9.99 a tin, common plain greed by some shops. Midway charges a hazmat fee on powders and primers plus an additional handling fee for black powder. I for one refuse to pay these unfair prices and while other bend and pay up the abuse will continue.

Unmentionable powder has gone up 30% on average since January 1. The pound I bought last year for 45 bucks, cost me 65 yesterday. And this is from a shop that has realistic prices on their items. I guess wherever you turn, inflation is going to take a swing at us.

 

[springfield art]

Well dang! Good thing we are taking a trip to the UK in May, I can bring/send a bunch of flint back if you know someone that can turn the stones into gun flints. There is a lot of flint to be found over there, alot of of old building and churches exteriors are done in flint stones. At least in East Anglia where I am familiar I have seen a bunch.

This may sound stupid, but some countries have laws against taking natural items from their shores. Let us know, it's a cool idea.

 

[springfield art]

Ethan at “ I Love Muzzleloaders “ has already gotten to the bottom of this. He spoke with representatives of the company and the information he obtained is entirely different. His video should still be available.

Personally, I do not believe the information you received is accurate.

Either way, it’s time folks start making their own caps. The cap situation has gotten beyond insane.

Thank you, you are correct.

 

[springfield art]

I don't think we will ever see availability for caps change, or at best, it will be many years before it does. In the past, most folks had loads of them, stores were well stocked, and the minimal manufacturing required to restock could keep up. Now, lots of folks are on the hunt, few stores have them, they sell out immediately, and the minimal manufacturing that worked in the past can't keep up. No company will invest new capital for additional manufacturing capabilities to fill a temporary niche product need with a shrinking customer base or reallocate manufacturing time away from products widely in demand, probably tied to contract delivery and time requirements, and likely more profitable. It's easy for those of us sitting on thousands of caps to suggest controlled buying so others can get them, but it really is an unfortunate situation that calls for buying whatever is available when you can - and paying the price to get them when they are available.

Yes, but I naively believe the company when they say they're making and shipping millions of primers and caps daily. Just wonder where the heck they are.

 

[springfield art]

I don’t necessarily buy that either. Primers and caps are different animals.

For those that will not spend the time to look up Ethan’s video on this, he spoke with representatives of the company. They contend that they have to change over the machines to produce caps. It is a costly ordeal and they only change over and run caps for a very limited time once per year.

Primers and caps are not the same nor are they produced the same.

You all can fight over caps all you want. There is an alternative and I don’t mean flintlocks.

Yes, different animals but essentially the same thing.

 

[snakebit]

Looking at this from the company's point of view.....

Why would CCI or Remington care about making #11 caps when they have lots of modern day shooters begging for primers to reload modern shells. Those manufacturers can ( and probably are already ) keeping their assembly lines running 24/7 and still cannot catch up with making modern shell primers.

I'm surprised they take the time stopping production to retool for making #11 percussion caps at all.

A lot of things are that way Mark sad to say. Back in my trad archery days, I really liked shooting Alaskan Red Cedar shafts. They were just better all around. There wasn't enough market for loggers to make a profit, so they just dried up. I wish there were more competitors making caps, but I guess most companies have stock holders to answer to.

 

[Rhacknc]

I have not shot BP for years and have wanted to get back into it. I appreciate all of the replies that help with understanding the shortage. Also Etipp thanks for the I Love Muzzleloading video explaining as well.

I have a TC Hawken where I left it in a state that was unshootable. With help of forum member SDSmlf, he guided me through getting an obstruction out of the barrel, and Flint62smoothie offered assistance and also sold me a really nice barrel at a great price to get me back in service. (Sent my original barrel off to Bobby Hoyt this morning for work).

I really appreciate these guys for being so helpful, and all forum members in general. Even got to meet PathfinderNC and he extended an offer to shoot with him and his club.

So... itching to get some shooting in.