Complete noob to muzzleloading.

[fort fireman]

Hopefully the moderators won't mind me posting this website, but it may prevent a bad accident. If you really want to try your hand a building a rifle try this kit.
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/...arentType=index&parentId=cat601141&id=0006378

It is not super pricey and I started out with this rifle only not the kit. It isn't a matchlock but it is leagal to hunt with 100%.
As for a matchlock you my want to contct NCwildlife. org to see if it would be legal to hunt with.
Please don't try to use any type of tubing as a barrel. I would hate to be watching the Charlotte nightly news and here abut a NC man blowing his face off with a homemade BP gun. Saving alittle money on homemade parts is not worth hurting yurself or worse yet someone near you that has no idea whats going on.

 

[larry wv]

Skinny I built one of those in flint years ago. It is one of my best shooting guns. Maybe my favorite. Best of luck. Larry Wv

 

[Hulbert]

Ok, uh, I thought it was clear to everyone, I'm NOT MAKING THE GUN FROM PIPE! I gave that idea up when I read the first set of replies. I actually asked if anyone could recommend a good book for me to get that will show me what I need to do, and answer a lot of my questions. I'd really like to do as much as possible by hand, and I get it that the barrel needs to be a barrel, not a pipe. So, again, anyone know a good book I can get? Forums are nice and all, but I can't take my computer to my workbench for the step by step. If I wasn't open to suggestions, I wouldn't have posted in this forum in the first place. That's why I posted here, I figured you guys would know more than me. Once again, to clarify, I am not using a pipe for the barrel, I'm using a barrel. As far as minimums for duck, I was talking about using a recycled 12 ga barrel (which someone here actually said was possible). That's greater than the 20 ga limit. Also I've never seen this specified in my state's game book, but I just recently moved out here, and have been caught up in hunting what's in season, I'm just trying to plan ahead and thought it would be fun to hunt duck old school. What's the fun of using 12 ga 3 1/2? None. I like to keep things a little challenging. Hence why I hunt no sight recurve. If I thought for a minute I could get an ethical kill with one, I'd probably make a handgonne and use it to hunt with, but I have my doubts about that (though maybe for target shooting). So to recap- I'm not using anything for the barrel except a barrel, it's a bad idea, I got it. Second, any good books that will get me started?

 

[Hulbert]

If only it was a smoothbore... IDK about the rifle, I'm not saying it isn't good, but it's a rifle. I'm more looking for a shotgun. I think the lock of the flintlock would be easy enough to modify to take match, I wouldn't really have to do anything else. But still, it's like buying an Ikea table, or pulling out the saws and varnish and making your own. That's a main point of the project. I still might make one from pipe as a WALL-HANGING NON FIRING REPLICA just to see if I can. Make the lock work, but don't drill a flash hole or anything that would make it even remotely fireable. Mostly to see if I can make a stock and lock, then proceed from there. Fine tune my skill before diving in above my head.

 

[fort fireman]

"Gunsmith of grenville county" by Peter alexander. Great book. Also " the art of building a pennsylvania longrifle". I have never read this one but have heard good things about it.

 

[Hulbert]

Thank you. I'll look for these. Just a question, do these cover match, wheel, flint, and percussion locks.

 

[Hulbert]

And Amazon don't have them. Darn me and my offbeat hobbies, likes and wants!

 

[Zonie]

Have you looked at Mike Brooks tutorial that shows up second from the top in the Gun Builder's Bench Index?

MIKES GUNBUILDING TUTORIAL

That will add a great deal to your understanding about what is needed to build your own gun.

Most of the information you can get in books that tell you how to build a gun are aimed at using commercially available barrels, locks, triggers etc. and in my opinion that is the best way to go.

I noticed that you mentioned Matchlocks and I suspect that the idea of using one would help you avoid buying a ready made flintlock or percussion lock.

The problem with a Matchlock is sometimes a legal issue because some States don't allow hunters to use them.
You mentioned using your new gun to hunt birds so I think you will be interested in the fact that when the Matchlock was used they never tried to shoot a bird on the wing.
Their method of shooting fowl with these things was to sneak up on the bird while it was on the ground. Again, the law might take a dim view of these tactics today.

Anyway, view Mikes Tutorial several times all the way thru. I'm sure it will give you some good ideas.

 

[Hulbert]

As far as I can tell from my states laws, Matchlocks are OK. I did see the tutorial, but haven't been able to look at it all the way through, maybe printing it out to read as I have the opportunity would be a good idea? I'm definitely going with a barrel and not a pipe, probably a commercial one designed for flintlocks, or take one off an old ratty flintlock, whatever I can find. It wouldn't take much modifying for the flashpan and the lock. Just the actual cock would need a slight modification, and one that I could make removable, like a piece of metal secured in the flintlock jaws. Then I'd have a flintlock too. I'm really concerned with making my own stock, I want it to be a perfect fit is why. I'm fairly handy with a saw, so I have no worries there. The metal work is more of a concern now, and I think I'll go with a proper barrel of sorts. I'll dig into that tutorial when I get the chance, but I get distracted a lot lately. This is why I'm planning my build so far out, give me time to chip away at it. I didn't know that about the birds. Maybe the matchlock for duck is not such a good idea. I could use it for most other birds, but not waterfowl. Skipping shot over the water is bad, even if it's not illegal (which it probably is, never looked it up, wouldn't do it).

 

[Hulbert]

BTW, anyone here in NC? Around the Charlotte or Monroe area? Or nearby in SC?

 

[paulvallandigham]

Water fowl regulations are Federal, NOT STATE laws and regulations. Waterfowl are considered migratory birds, and you need a federal "Duck" stanp on your license to legally hunt them. There are also states that require you to obtain their STATE Duck stamp to legally hunt waterfowl within their borders.

But, the rules concerning Shot kind, size, barrel diameters or minimum gauge size, opening and closing dates, bag limits, both daily and totals are all set by the Federal Fish and Wildlife Agency of the Dept. of the Interior. The Feds also regulate how many cartridges your gun can legally hold in a magazine- altho this obviously doesn't apply to Mlers.

You can buy a nicely made, 12 or 10 gauge DB, mling shotgun, with adjustable, screw in choke tubes, from Pedersoli, that will get you in the game and let you shoot all the game you want, provided you use the right kind of shot.

All waterfowl required Non-toxic shot be used. Upland game is regulated by State laws, and game codes. Most states( outside of parts of California) still allow hunters to use lead shot to kill upland game. Always know the bag limits, and the opening and closing dates for the seasons. Buy the State Hunting license, and whatever stamps are required for the kind of hunting you want to do. You get the Federal Duck stamps at your local post office, BTW.

 

[widget350]

Concerning the option of Pedersoli doubles, since you're interested in building a gun, Dixie has both a 10 and a 12-guage kit available (and on sale): http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_162_192&products_id=977

There are also a number of smoothbore kits you can find in various places.

Have you ever handled a muzzleloader? I'd recommend doing so before building one, and especially before deciding what style to build.

Since your primary purpose for this particular gun is duck, a matchlock is not a good idea, and like I said before, you'd really want to contact an official in your state to confirm the ability to use a matchlock. I looked at the NC handbook and couldn't find anything specific, but it would be a shame to build one then not be able to use it.

Another option to consider, since you're on a budget - buy used. While you won't have the satisfaction of building one, you can get the satisfaction of getting a great deal and of using one, and can get quite a nice gun for a great price if you're patient. I've seen factory doubles (Pedersoli, CVA, etc.) get picked up for less than $200 by very lucky people and they can be found by less lucky people for around $400. These would be ideal for fowling, and could help get you into the ML world safely, cheaply, and allow you to still accomplish your end purpose of extending your time hunting.

All that said, welcome to our world. Some of us may come off a little harsh to a newcomer (like Paul), but we really want everyone to enjoy this hobby safely. Keep asking questions, reading other posts, and there's no limit to how much you can learn from this forum.
:thumbsup:

 

[Tinker2]

Look for some of the books by PRYOR MT. BILL NEWTON
Books like “Selected Muzzle Loading Gun Lock Patterns”
It shows a simple matchlock action you could make.

Try Track of the wolf for barrels. Buy it breached.

This is why I'm planning my build so far out

Plan on making it safe for any grand kid you may some day have.



Lots of luck to you.
Tinker2

 

[Hulbert]

Thanks for the lead, but a bit out of my range, I think I'll go with the option of continuous searching for a good used one. The one you showed is nearly perfect, and despite that it might not be 100% traditional (chrome barrel!) I think I'd actually prefer that feature for no other reason than it's easier to clean. I might try the flintlock first as those seem more common. I've handled score of weapons, but not a muzzleloader. The more the helpful people on here talk, rather than those who just flame noobs, I think a premade one is probably my best bet. It would let me get a feel for loads and charges and whatnot. The gun isn't ONLY for waterfowl, to let me be clear, I just want a shotgun that I can use for all around game. A 12 ga is pretty versatile in the modern gun world, and I'm very familiar with them so it only made sense to me to start with it rather than a rifle. Since I'm on the subject of giving up on the build an buying, if I'm going to invest in this, is there a "magnum" muzzleloading shotty? I've seen the "magnum" rifles for sale, but am just beginning on my "magnum" shotgun quest. I'd even settle on a percussion for this feature.

 

[Hulbert]

Thanks for the leads, I'm looking into them now. Even if I were to buy a kit, I can always fit the stock around it eh?

 

[Hulbert]

And they just added an English Fowler barrel! Don't even have a pic of it yet!

 

[Hulbert]

And of course, Amazon is once again a bust...must keep up the hunt I guess!

 

[widget350]

A few sources of books. There are many more.
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(S(odn3yo45ga4pneevd0my4045))/categories/catList.aspx?catID=4
http://www.dixiegunworks.com/default.php?cPath=22_112

 

[Hulbert]

Thanks again. I finally got my Googlefu working for me and found those sites earlier. That specialty stuff can be hard to come by! I am trying to take up falconry, but my current life situation won't allow it, and that kind of stuff is fairly hard to come by (and expensive!). I'm sticking to guns (muzzleloaders included), and bows for now. It seems like Muzzleloading is a fairly cheap hobby to get into, so long as you stick to what everyone else buys, but that modern stuff is no fun. Shooting a deer with a scope from 150 yards is childs play, try being within 20 or so! It's all about the hunt, not the kill!

 

[Jason Lewis]

cheap? i think you'll find that you can get just as carried away with muzzleloading as with anyother shooting discipline, just like most of us here have :thumbsup:

i think you are on the right track with looking for a used gun, try and find a percussion shotgun first, they're easier to start with. the only "magnum" out there is the pedersoli 10ga double. the only reason it's a "magnum" is because it's a 10ga. but, because of it's bore size it's extremely utilitarian. load it up for turkey and waterfowl, load it down for pheasant and upland game, load down even more for trap and skeet. have fun.