Conical bullets in a cap and ball revolver

[mkpatrick]

When I bought it, the guy said 60 grains was max. I suppose 50 shouldn't be pushing it then. I asked on this forum because I don't know how much he knew. I thought if I got a consensus that would be better.
I was not expecting 25 though.

I have a brass framed Confederate Army and was told because of the brass frame, keep that one at 25.

 

[Wolfman0125]

Loading a Walker to the max 60 grains with a conical is equivalent to driving a car at 120 mph. Sure it can handle it but how dangerous is that and how much control do you have and is it necessary? No. I saw a video where the guy said he typically recommended around 40 grains he was getting good accuracy. Besides, over penetration is not necessarily good. Your heavier bullets have more knockdown power and typically travel at much slower velocities. I have a 1847 Walker on my bucket list as my next purchase. I’ve got the 1851, 1858, 1860, and 1873 so far.

 

[B P Arn]

I use 55 grains in my Uberti Walker with round ball. I'd use 60 grains, but it gets too hard to seat the ball.

Bear hunting? Hardly. Power is slightly less than a 357 Magnum. Hardly a wrist-breaker.

Load 'em up, fellersh. It won't hurt them.

 

[Ian Straus]

Wow 25 grains?
How much in a Uberti open topped Colt Navy then?

Dixie catalog recommends 18 grains FFF for the Uberti Colt Navy revolvers (36 caliber).

 

[mkpatrick]

Dixie catalog recommends 18 grains FFF for the Uberti Colt Navy revolvers (36 caliber).

Mine's a Pietta 44.

 

[mkpatrick]

I use 55 grains in my Uberti Walker with round ball. I'd use 60 grains, but it gets too hard to seat the ball.

Bear hunting? Hardly. Power is slightly less than a 357 Magnum. Hardly a wrist-breaker.

Load 'em up, fellersh. It won't hurt them.

After reading all I've read and learned on this thread, I'm going to stick with ball ammo in these pistols.
55 grains sounds good to me.
I'll still with the 454 ball.

 

[B P Arn]

Ball size depends on the individual gun, but most 44s will take a .454" ball.

 

[M. De Land]

How many water bottles where penetrated with a round ball in Mike B's ROA tests?

 

[rodwha]

Good points about hunting and holes for blood tracking, I was just thinking of keeping the energy and bullet all in the bad guy. Guess too much smokeless powder smoke and "Flying Ashtrays" from my .45 Auto affected my brain . That's some cap and ball load revolver load that goes clear thru nose to tail on a hog, What are you using a full 60 grain charge in a Walker with picket type bullets?

I’ve yet to do such and am working on modifications of my designs for my two revolvers. A fellow who goes by the name Kaido worked with Lee to modify their 255 grn .45 Colt bullet. He and his group of Florida hog hunting buddies typically use a NMA or ROA, though I recall someone using a Walker once as well. The repro version of that bullet weighs 240 grns and if I recall correctly they said they got 30 grns of powder (they use energetic powders as you need to to get those figures, about standard .45 ACP or roughly 400 ft/lbs of energy) with 3F Triple 7 being the only powder I recall reading about.

Here’s a pic of Kaido’s 240 grn and 255 grn bullets flanked by two of my designs, the first being the length of a ball .460” and weighing 195 grns, and the other is my Ruger bullet weighing 285 grns. The first i designed assuming my Pietta would have the slower 1:30” twist that I believe is the culprit of many conical woes we read about. It shoots well. The other I designed for bears thinking we were moving to VA giving me an opportunity to try bear meat.

There’s a fellow on another forum who dabbles with designs and he’s come up with a HP design along with a spare plunger he has with an epoxied bullet nose face so it doesn’t deform upon loading. It’s actually made me ponder this a bit and my mind went straight to the Flying Ashtray, the father to the Gold Dot. A premium bullet before there was as such a thing. So I figure a wide open cavity on a lead bullet might just do well for any time where over penetration or the desire for more destruction is desired.

 

[rodwha]

Well

Original Walkers were made of rather weak cast iron which is why they were so big and still could not reliably contain black powder pressure in full charge loads.. Modern steel will have no trouble at all of taking full power Walker loads if your wrist will take it.
Same deal in Civil war Parrot rifle cannons that had to have a reinforcing band in the chamber area to keep them from bursting. Actually bronze made far stronger/better cannon barrels than did wrought or cast iron.

Well, actually, I sent some cast bullets to an interested fellow who had been following my threads across various forums while designing my designs. He decided to load my Ruger bullet that I purposely created long driving bands on to generate a quicker higher pressure buildup since it would only have a roughly 25 grn 3F charge behind it in a Ruger. He used 52 grns of Pyrodex P and blew the chamber wide open.

 

[rodwha]

How many water bottles where penetrated with a round ball in Mike B's ROA tests?

 

[rodwha]

I use 55 grains in my Uberti Walker with round ball. I'd use 60 grains, but it gets too hard to seat the ball.

Bear hunting? Hardly. Power is slightly less than a 357 Magnum. Hardly a wrist-breaker.

Load 'em up, fellersh. It won't hurt them.

I designed a heavy 285 grn bullet for my ROA. It is estimated to be on the lower end having about 400-450 ft/lbs. Not a powerhouse but it should absolutely be a good penetrator and with that wide meplat make a big hole. I’d never consider it a primary weapon though, and really figured it would be nice to have a swappable barrel for my rifle in 28ga loaded with buck n ball and with a handy 18” barrel as what I’d want in my hands when I had to track one. The first shot would be with a .50 cal PRB or conical though. I was also planning on a ClassicBallistix cylinder which would add 5-10 grns of capacity making it more than adequate and on par with a Dragoon.

 

[B P Arn]

I have thought about getting a spare barrel for mine, having it bored out to a smooth bore, and then loading Speer shotshell plastic cups (I don't remember the correct name) in it. Hmmmmm...

 

[B P Arn]

I’ve yet to do such and am working on modifications of my designs for my two revolvers. A fellow who goes by the name Kaido worked with Lee to modify their 255 grn .45 Colt bullet. He and his group of Florida hog hunting buddies typically use a NMA or ROA, though I recall someone using a Walker once as well. The repro version of that bullet weighs 240 grns and if I recall correctly they said they got 30 grns of powder (they use energetic powders as you need to to get those figures, about standard .45 ACP or roughly 400 ft/lbs of energy) with 3F Triple 7 being the only powder I recall reading about.

Here’s a pic of Kaido’s 240 grn and 255 grn bullets flanked by two of my designs, the first being the length of a ball .460” and weighing 195 grns, and the other is my Ruger bullet weighing 285 grns. The first i designed assuming my Pietta would have the slower 1:30” twist that I believe is the culprit of many conical woes we read about. It shoots well. The other I designed for bears thinking we were moving to VA giving me an opportunity to try bear meat.

View attachment 69841

There’s a fellow on another forum who dabbles with designs and he’s come up with a HP design along with a spare plunger he has with an epoxied bullet nose face so it doesn’t deform upon loading. It’s actually made me ponder this a bit and my mind went straight to the Flying Ashtray, the father to the Gold Dot. A premium bullet before there was as such a thing. So I figure a wide open cavity on a lead bullet might just do well for any time where over penetration or the desire for more destruction is desired.

Triple 7 = good stuff when one is looking for maximum power.

 

[mkpatrick]

I was hoping to find out what these screws do or what they're for?

 

[B P Arn]

I was hoping to find out what these screws do or what they're for?

They are for attaching a shoulder stock.

 

[mkpatrick]

All 4 of them?
What about the one on the other side?

 

[Grenadier1758]

You have a bolt for the hammer, one for the trigger and one for the bolt. Then there is the bolt for the the shoulder stock. The shoulder stock bolt protrudes on both sides.

You can see the three bolts in the diagram from Deer Creek. The Deer Creek diagram doesn't show the bolt for the shoulder stock.

1860_army.pdf (deercreekproducts.net)

 

[mkpatrick]

Should all these screws be tight?
I had an experience once with a malfunction. I can't remember what the issue was but I took it to a gunsmith, he'd never worked on one of these before.
He tweaked one of those screws and it was fixed. But he didn't tighten it if I remember right, He just turned it a couple revolutions and it then worked.
I asked him what he did there, he said it was just a guess. A stab in the dark. He couldn't even tell me what the screws functions were.
After that, I'd avoided messing with those.
Folks on this site know way more than that gunsmith did so I thought I'd ask.

I'm not sure if I remember right but the problem might have been, that the hammer didn't lock back.
But not sure, been a long time.

Thanks,

M

 

[Grenadier1758]

Snug, yes. Tight, no. Use grease or anti seize lubricant on the threads