cooking fire set

[Sandhiler]

I would like to build a fire set that would be correct in about 1800 and pass in a juryied event. Any advice as to materials, useing an arc welder vs. blacksmithing, what not to use, etc. Any advice would be helpful and pictures would be really appreciated. I was thinking about the three legged fire set along with a square grid over the fire.

Thanks,

Sandhiler

 

[Desert Rat]

If you are going to be going to a really strict juried event then 3 green limbs from a tree with a piece of rope and maybe a S hook for the tripod and straight piece of stock or another green limb for a skewer. I haven't seen much if anything in first hand accounts of metal fire sets. The only one I can maybe think of is a picture Miller painted, I can't see the tripod close enough in my memory though.

 

[geologist]

Might I suggest you read:

Colonial Wrought Iron the Sorber Collection
By Don Plummer
Skipjack Press
1999
Library of Congress Number 99-070856
ISBN 1-879535-16-5 :wink:

 

[paulvallandigham]

If you are in a military unit, then they had wagons and draft animals to haul along an amazing collection of " conveniences". If you are in civilian long-hunter mode, things become far more spartan.

Fires were made between the roots of large trees, down in gulleys or ravines, so that both the flame, and the light could not be seen at any distance. The smoke would travel up the trunk of the tall tree and disperse among its branches before rising into the air. Night time fires were preferred to daytime fires, so as not to alert hostiles, or enemies to your presence. Care was taken in choosing whether to even have a fire if the wind was blowing towards your possible enemy location. It was common for scouts, for instance, then, as now, to cook their meals in one location, and then move off a mile or more for their night camp, so that enemies could not locate them by the smell of their fires in the night.

Always use a narrow trench for your fire. If narrow enough, you can used the sides of the trench to support your frying pan, or pot. Turn the sod over as you cut your trench. Then, when you finish with the camp, you can fill the hole up with the dirt removed, and then put the sod on top and water it a bit. The grass will fill in and the site will become invisible within a couple of months, tops. A trench dispenses with the need for a tripod- carried or made on site.

Most scouts carried only a small " boiler" ( narrow, tall pot), and maybe a skillet in their haversacks. If they had a mule or horse, the animal carried that weight.

The early settlers learned to identify all kinds of edible plants, barks, berries, etc. and had a post Graduate School knowledge of when and where to find edibles. They did not carry lots of foods with them, but rather scavenged every day for fresh foods. Kids old enough to walk began to learn where to find onions, and other edible roots, and to gather berries, or follow bees to their hives, so that smoke might be used to allow a retrieval of honey.

When you learned all these things even as a pre-schooler, you carried such knowledge with you all the rest of your life. That is what made "Scouts " so valuable to later settlers, that included a lot of immigrants who had grown up in towns and cities, and just didn't have these skills.

If you are trying to "fit in " at any rendezvous, talk to the Booshway, when you call to notify them you are planning to attend, to find out what, if any firewood will be provided, what water is available, privies, showers, etc. You can ask the booshway what kind of campfires are allowed. These can change from one region of the country to the next, and may be restricted by location, if the rendezvous is held on public park property.

For instance, my club had been setting up an encampment for years at a local forest preserve when one year, a ranger came out to tell us we could not pick up and use any twigs or sticks from the forest floor to use as "tinder" for our fires. ( I would not choose such wood to burn as tinder either, as its too damp!) The Greenies had taken over the park management, and wanted everything left where it fell! We waited until dark, when the rangers disappeared, and then found tinder in the form of hanging dead tree branches and standing grasses we could "trim" without being obvious. The Rangers never saw a thing!

 

[ameling]

I would like to build a fire set that would be correct in about 1800 and pass in a juryied event. Any advice as to materials, useing an arc welder vs. blacksmithing, what not to use, etc. Any advice would be helpful and pictures would be really appreciated. I was thinking about the three legged fire set along with a square grid over the fire.

Thanks,

Sandhiler

A tricky question. There is a lot of ... myth ... built up out there, with lots of "accepted" campfire iron work. "Accepted", even at juried events, but not really correct.

First, forget the arc-welding. That is late 1800's at the earliest. And gas welding is only a little earlier. If you need to connect parts, you need to forge-weld or rivet things together.

There is very little original "campfire" iron work that has survived - or originally existed. What has been found is iron work for use in cooking in a fireplace. The few firepit tripods and cross-bar cooking sets that show up in period artwork are generally too distant and/or spartan in their depiction for details. They could be iron, but they could just as easily have been green saplings. And the Grills used are far different than most you see at events. They tended to have FIXED legs and an attached long handle - for moving it about over the coals in your fireplace. Shapes were square, round, rectangular and "tapered" rectangular.

You can see some pictures of original iron work in the 2 books by Neumann - Collector's Illustrated Encyclopedia of the American Revolution, and Early American Antique Country Furnishings. But about all you are going to find in them are a few grills, toasters, and scotch broilers. And the common skewers - with or without a wall holder/rack. The rest would be classified as "utinsels" - roasting forks, ladles, and spatulas.

The Colonial Ironwork book has similar things in it. But most were for fireplace cooking.

The closest thing to documented campfire cooking irons would be the Spanish army skewers. Each soldier was issued one iron skewer about 2 foot long, with a loop on the end. Several soldiers in a "mess group" would then combined several to make a tripod, or cross-bar, or laid then across the firepit to work as a grill.

As I said, real documented iron work for use over a campfire is hard to find. The rest of modern campfire ironwork is ... historically inspired, or just fantasy.

Various MILITARY records do show some iron work, and some even have specifications for that iron work. But it is all very very simple/plain stuff. And "grilling" of meat was not considered healthy - especially by the British. Ditto frying meat.

Most campfire ironwork at events (even juried events) is in that ... accepted ... category. So progressing with this becomes a matter of personal choice, and the goal you wish to reach.

But that is just my humble opinion, and best used in conjunction with your own research.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

 

[blacksmithman64]

Mike, not to get off topic, but I have read that our "squirrel cooker" dates back to the mid 1700's.I can't remember where I read that. Do you have any documentation/proof of these handy little gadgets or are they also in the realm of fantasy? :hmm:

 

[geologist]

I found it very interesting that the British (I presume you mean English)did not consider grilled meat healthy and preferred to fry their meat. It is doubly surprising when you consider the preference the Tutor autocracy had to roasted meat (mutton, beef and game birds) hense the position "spit boy".

I know from family records that the Scots in New Hampshire used their fireplace for all cooking and with the exception of spider pans did not use frying until the coming of the stove.

 

[geologist]

I noticed that a lot of the people responding to this thread go into ranger, military or camping ware. I think we should not forget that the vast majority of colonists lived simple lives tending their farms.

My ancestors fought in the revolutionary war, but most of their militia service was in the winter or summer with the spring and the fall being reserved for farm work.

 

[Rancocas]

Fires were made between the roots of large trees, down in gulleys or ravines, so that both the flame, and the light could not be seen at any distance. The smoke would travel up the trunk of the tall tree and disperse among its branches before rising into the air. Night time fires were preferred to daytime fires, so as not to alert hostiles, or enemies to your presence. Care was taken in choosing whether to even have a fire if the wind was blowing towards your possible enemy location. It was common for scouts, for instance, then, as now, to cook their meals in one location, and then move off a mile or more for their night camp, so that enemies could not locate them by the smell of their fires in the night.

Off topic - but just a comment in response to Paul's post.
Yesterday I was out turkey hunting. I smelled smoke and followed it upwind, going up a little ravine. I came upon a small, two man camp of turkey hunters that was hidden in there.
Back in the 1980's when I was in the Border Patrol and working the night shift in the citrus groves I would quietly pass along the downwind side of a big grove, sniffing for smoke. When I detected it, I would follow the smoke scent upwind until I found the camp of a crew of illegal alien citrus fruit pickers.
The method still works today, just as it did for the scouts and hostiles of 200 years ago. :grin:

As for the ironwork kitchen utensils, I agree with others that it was mainly used in established settlements, or farms, or by the military. Ordinary backwoodsmen sure didn't want to carry that extra weight around.

 

[ameling]

Sorry if what I typed in was not clear enough. The British Military had rules/regulations against their soldiers grilling or frying their issued meat ration. Their officers were tasked with making sure that the soldiers boiled their meat rations properly. The British Military considered grilling/frying of meat unhealthy for their soldiers. But I think their real reason was to make sure that the soldiers fully cooked their meat ration, and when they boiled it they got more nutritional value from it AND THE BROTH than just quickly frying/grilling the meat and eating it. So I think it had more to do with making that meat ration go farther and feed more people. Plus it helped address the salt and spoilage problems.

Yes, roasting large chunks of meat over/beside a fire was a very common cooking method - with centuries of history behind it. Plus many times your only option was to roast some meat on some green sticks next to the fire.

The usage of iron to roast meat over a fire does quickly get limited to - cities, established homes/cabins, or large companies/parties - or to a family/group traveling out to the frontier to create a new cabin/settlement and bringing along their whole household furnishings. The weight involved required lots more planning than just expecting to cut a few green sticks/saplings when needed for cooking. Cut/use them, and then leave them behind instead of carrying the extra weight.

I hope this helps clear up the meaning of what I had typed.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

I found it very interesting that the British (I presume you mean English)did not consider grilled meat healthy and preferred to fry their meat. It is doubly surprising when you consider the preference the Tutor autocracy had to roasted meat (mutton, beef and game birds) hense the position "spit boy".

I know from family records that the Scots in New Hampshire used their fireplace for all cooking and with the exception of spider pans did not use frying until the coming of the stove.

 

[ameling]

Mike, not to get off topic, but I have read that our "squirrel cooker" dates back to the mid 1700's.I can't remember where I read that. Do you have any documentation/proof of these handy little gadgets or are they also in the realm of fantasy? :hmm:

I haven't heard nor seen any documentation for them - other than people saying they heard of some documentation. The best that I can come up with is that they are ... historically inspired -- so much closer to that "fantasy" than reality.

Yes, they are very handy. Yes they are hand forged. Yes they do look "old timey". And the are ... accepted ... by many fairly strict groups and juried sites. But I haven't seen any real documentation for them. Yes, I do have a pair I occasionally use - depending upon the event and group.

The closest thing I have seen are some meat roasting forks. A large two-tine fork with long handle and a pair of short legs attached. You put your chunks of meat on the tines, and then set it down next to your fire. Those two legs hold the end up, and the long handle balances out the weight of the meat and rests on the ground. They were originally designed for use with a fireplace - to roast and/or heat up chunks of meat.

So I haven't found or heard of any documentation for them - yet. But they have become ... accepted. So using one becomes a matter of Personal Choice.

Just my humble thoughts to share, and best used in conjunction with your own research.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

 

[geologist]

When I was young and working as a geologist (yes I am one) we used to get meat in the field that was shall we say past its due date. The Slavie Indians that were with us would boil everything while we would fry or BBQ steak even if it was rank, bacon was also fried while other meats were tossed. We preferred to take or chances with canned meat. Beef and caraboo steaks and roasts can be eaten even if rank, but it is best to toss ground meat of any kind which has an off smell.

 

[krecords]

For grilling meat, just lay the meat directly on the hot coals of your fire. Once the meat is seared the coals brush off and the meet cooks just like it was on a grill. I have done this several times with good success. Just make sure you have a clean set of coals, you never know how a previous camper put out his fire....

Kirby