Davis Double Set Trigger

[bads1buell]

I recently bought a Poor Boy with a Davis Double Set Trigger. Appears to be the Small Double Set Double Knife 0004 model. My question is the rear must be set in order to fire the rifle. If you don't set the rear the front has no contact with the sear at all. Is this normal for this trigger or is there something not correct? I know Davis makes a trigger that must be set before firing but like I said it looks identical to the 0004 listed on their site. Forgot to mention once rear is set it fires it fires just fine.

 

[CrossXstix]

I have a rifle that was like that when I first got it. I took the trigger to a machine shop and had them tig weld an extension on the front trigger lifter, then I stoned it to fit under the seer so it could be fired by either trigger.

X
David

 

[Zonie]

Most people can't tell if the set triggers are "double lever" or "single lever" double set triggers.

As the name indicates, "double lever" triggers can fire the lock using the front trigger unset or set.
Single lever triggers can only fire the gun if the rear trigger is first "set".

Double lever triggers can act like single lever triggers if they are not installed right so the first thing you need to do is to figure out which kind of set trigger you have.

This can be done without removing the triggers if you remove the lock.

After the lock is removed, look down the hole in the wood that clears the locks sear arm.
A flashlight helps to see down the hole.

While looking in the sear arm hole pull the front trigger fully to the rear.

If you see a steel blade (the lever) rise up into the hole you have a double lever trigger that should work without setting the rear trigger.

If you don't see any blade rise up into the sear arm hole either it is hanging up on some wood or you have a "single lever" trigger that always must be set before you can cock or fire the gun.

While your looking into the hole, release the front trigger and push the rear trigger forward. You should see the rear triggers steel blade (lever) rise into the hole.
When you release the rear trigger and let it return to its normal unset position, its steel blade (lever) should fall completely below the sear arm hole.

If the rear triggers blade doesn't fall below the hole it is either a single lever trigger or it is a double lever trigger that was installed too deeply by the builder.

 

[bads1buell]

Zonie,
The front trigger definately has a trigger bar that rises when you squeeze the trigger. What would cause it to engage by setting the rear? One would think that the front would trip the sear also. The sear arm on the lock has a downward bend to it also. Also noticed that if you release the lock by hand I have to keep setting the rear trigger in order to get the lock to fall completely. However, if you fire the rifle in full lock position set the rear it falls like it is supposed to. Sparks nice... Has a Durs Egg lock on it.

 

I am fairly sure it has to be set to the rear before the lock may be fired. Otherwise you will have to disengage the spring that the rear uses and use the front as a plain hunting trigger. I will be using the same trigger type on a future build and I will also be copying the materials to make my own version. Needless to say this post has been helpful.

 

[nchawkeye]

It's almost easier to take the trigger off the gun and work it to see how it works then try to explain...

When you pull the rear trigger, it catches on the front trigger, they both move downward...When you pull the front trigger, the spring pressure that the rear one is locking down pops up on the sear...

 

[Leatherbark]

The trigger sear relationship is not correct when they built the rifle. I did the same thing on an Ohio rifle. The Davis triggers front bar would not rise high enough to trip the sear by itself. If the rear was set then the front would trip it just fine. I am thinking about soldering a piece of metal on the sear arm to effectively lower the sear bar slightly so the front trigger will make contact. Not that I want to shoot it with the front trigger, but it makes it easier to lower the Hammer to half cock. I could set the triggers deeper for the same effect, but it wouldn't look right unless I shaped the stock to match.

Bob

 

[bads1buell]

I just took the lock off and examined the trigger. When I set the rear trigger and pulled the front trigger, the rear trigger bar jumps up and trips the sear arm on the lock. Also noticed that when this occurred the front trigger bar barely moves and would never make contact with the sear arm.

 

[Zonie]

Because the front trigger has a trigger bar on it, it is a double lever trigger and several things are probably happening.

First, the unset rear trigger bar is sitting too high for the location of the locks sear arm.

In this high position it is keeping the sear from engaging the full cock notch. That is why you currently have to set the rear trigger in order to cock the lock.

The best way to fix this is to remove the trigger assembly. That probably will mean removing the small pins that hold the trigger guard in place.

Once removed, you have your choice of trying two different fixes.

One is to put a shim under the rear of the trigger assembly so it doesn't go as deeply into the wood as it currently does. This may make the trigger assembly stand 'proud' of the wrist of the stock and if it does, I wouldn't recommend it.

The second method is to file the top surface of the rear triggers blade so that when the trigger is installed the blade clears the sear arm.
Anywhere between 1/32 of an inch to 1/16 of an inch clearance will provide the needed clearance and still allow the rear set trigger to release the sear after it has been set.
It is best to remove some steel from the blade, reinsert the trigger to its original depth and try cocking the lock.
By doing this "file a little and try it" method a few times you will know how much needed to be removed.
Once enough material is removed, the lock should easily come to a full cock 100 percent of the time without setting the rear trigger.

As you can see the front trigger blade rise into the sear arm hole it may work just fine as it is once the problem with the rear trigger is fixed.

If you fix the rear trigger so you can cock the lock without first setting it and the front trigger does not release it, the blade for the front trigger blade is hitting some wood which is preventing it from traveling far enough to push up on the locks sear arm.
Find the interfering wood and cut it away with a sharp chisel or a hobby knife.

 

[bads1buell]

Zonie,
The lock will cock just fine. I don't have to set the trigger in order to cock it. Just to fire it.

 

[Zonie]

Then the front triggers blade is hanging up on some wood and it cannot travel far enough to press on the sear arm.

 

[bads1buell]

Zonie,
Thanks for all the help. I will pull the trigger and take a look at it.

 

[bads1buell]

The sear arm is bent downward so I am going to assume that the trigger was not inlet far enough to catch the sear arm.

 

[user 13289]

Sorry if this was already addressed, i may have missed it, but there seems to be some real confusion here.

The rear trigger never fires the rifle. It is always the "set" trigger. It sets the firing trigger or not. Nothing else for it to do.

The front trigger will trip the sear set OR unset if it is double-lever trigger. Set means it has been spring loaded and POPS against the sear. Unset means it functions as simple trigger and moves against the sear manually.

Cocking the lock has nothing to do with the trigger assembly. It involves the nose of the sear engaging the tumbler notches against the pressure of of the mainspring primarily and the sear spring minutely. The trigger only strikes the sear (set) or nudges it (unset or simple).

At least that's how mine works, a Davis and a Bob Roller triggers and numerous locks.

Maybe that helps somebuddy.

 

[bpd303]

Cocking the lock has nothing to do with the trigger assembly. It involves the nose of the sear engaging the tumbler notches against the pressure of of the mainspring primarily and the sear spring minutely. The trigger only strikes the sear (set) or nudges it (unset or simple).

True unless the trigger is binding or set too deep in the stock and it is contacting the sear preventing it from engaging the tumbler notches.

 

[bads1buell]

Just rechecked the front trigger bar and measured it with the lock in and then out. It is definitely hitting the sear arm with the front trigger however, the tension seems to high to release the sear. I even tried to release the lock while removed from the rifle in the half cock position and it still would not release by activating the sear. Once put in to full cock while out of the rifle it releases very easily. Stumped now... I'm thinking that's just the way it is.

 

[bpd303]

Your lock is working properly. You should not be able to release the cock from half cock with the sear, unless you pull the cock back a little to get the sear out of the half cock notch.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

The rear trigger never fires the rifle.

The front trigger will trip the sear set OR unset if it is double-lever trigger. Set means it has been spring loaded and POPS against the sear.

This is incorrect,

On a double lever trigger, in the unset position the front trigger will cause the rifle to fire by engaging the sear arm, however if the triggers are set a light touch on the front trigger will release the rear trigger and allows it to "pop" up into the sear which in turn fires the rifle.

In my experience.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

Just rechecked the front trigger bar and measured it with the lock in and then out. It is definitely hitting the sear arm with the front trigger however, the tension seems to high to release the sear. I even tried to release the lock while removed from the rifle in the half cock position and it still would not release by activating the sear. Once put in to full cock while out of the rifle it releases very easily. Stumped now... I'm thinking that's just the way it is.

I am curious, looking at the end of the sear bar does it look as though some of the material has been ground off, as in the sear bar has been shortened ? The front lever may rise high enough to reach the sear but the sear may be to short.
:hmm:

 

[user 13289]

The rear trigger never fires the rifle.

The front trigger will trip the sear set OR unset if it is double-lever trigger. Set means it has been spring loaded and POPS against the sear.

This is incorrect,

On a double lever trigger, in the unset position the front trigger will cause the rifle to fire by engaging the sear arm, however if the triggers are set a light touch on the front trigger will release the rear trigger and allows it to "pop" up into the sear which in turn fires the rifle.

In my experience.

that's what i said. some confusion in semantics i suppose...oh wait i finally see what you R saying.

Yes, but manipulation of the front trigger is what fires the rifle. The rear trigger movement INTO the sear is "triggered" by manipulation of the finger on the front trigger.

i learn alla times. thanks.