Do you prefer Real Black Powder or a BP substitute?.........Why?

[Mulebrain]

Compared to real black, I noticed accuracy fell off when an equivalent substitute was used in my .40

 

[joesmoe3]

Compared to real black, I noticed accuracy fell off when an equivalent substitute was used in my .40

Plus 1 with an exclamation point !

I have a data point of one - YMMV.

I got into muzzleloading "late" as I had a budding interest in hunting and wanted to take advantage of our two week muzzleloading season.

I also have a passing interest in the War Between the States, and it's an emotional thing - raised in the south - wanting a tie, however tenuous - a "Richmond" rifle was it.

So out to the range some years ago, as others said, bought the hype - had 777 and Pyrodex in hand, and after several sessions - different loads, different projectiles, I simply could not get any (!!!) consistency in grouping. I was also having problems with ignition.

An experienced hand was also at the range, and time and again, I would see him come in with his assortment of muzzleloaders (NO inline), and he would shoot offhand always, and had impressive results. Afterward, he would go inside the range building, return with hot water that he poured down the barrel until the runout from the nipple was clear - was over and done quickly.

I approached him at one point, exasperated, saying I was about to give up if I couldn't get a handle on making BP work. How is it, I asked, with far less access to technology, our ancestors made this work ?

He looked at what I was doing, went back to his bench, and returned with GOEX.

I shot for an hour, different loads, different projectiles -- consistent ignition, consistent hits on target -- I was amazed ! I've never looked back.

Like others, I have some 777 and Pyrodex to use as fire starter.

I too am fortunate to be within driving range of the fellow in Winchester, and have had consistent access to supplies.

 

[jlatz]

I use 777 in the original shotguns. It works well. Before a trap match I do "foof" out the barrels with black powder. Using 777 in those old shotguns makes clean up with Ballistol easy.

 

[Carbon 6]

I bow hunt right up to Muzzleloader Season then back to bow. I however do not use Pyrodex Arrows......LOL

Both my arrows and ramrods are wooden.

 

[rheath]

I got a some 777 a while back because it was said by some to be less corrosive. I never will know for sure because I clean up after using it the same as I do after using the real stuff. I think it is pretty much agreed that Pyrodex is more corrosive so I never tried using it. Whether 777 is or is not as corrosive as the real thing has turned out to not matter in my case because of my habit of cleaning the bore just the same no matter what I am shooting. Since substitutes are harder to ignite I only use black powder in my flinter so I plan to only stock up with black powder in the future and not get any more 777 when I finally get the last of it used up.

 

[VADSLRAM]

Not a fan of caps so for me and my rock scratchers it's BP only. Right now I have stock piled enough to keep me puffing for at least a few years. If I can't get real BP then I'll have to start making it myself.
I tried it already and can make a pretty darn good powder. Buying is easier and I get a lot more consistent shots so as long as I can I buy.

 

[mushka]

I got some pyrodex many years ago, and I can't remember why. think it was given to me. Never used much of it and again can't remember why not. After 15 or 18 years I finally dumped it in the back yard. All it did was take up space in my storage area. I've never had a serious problem getting BP as I'm willing to mail order it.

 

[Howard Pippin]

Those that find fault with our different reasons for shooting subs, are looking down the wrong rabbit hole. Apparently our willingness to use the same process of loading and are willing to put up with the harder cleanup after shooting, don't mind the burden that it places upon us. The "true black" Folks, have little reason to find fault for what we do, except we make less smoke.

Do you drive a Chevy or Ford are one of them Foreign jobs? I really don't care, why my flintlock is even foreign. Those that outlaw substitutes at shoots perhaps are wearing blinders. Thank goodness the Montana shoots I attend are more open minded. Please don't let this pettiness destroy a decent website.
Squint

 

[Tanglefoot]

Well, I guess I must be an "elitist" then. Is that the same thing as "Traditionalist?" I've just always used real black powder. Started out with original hardware and Dupont was $1 a pound ... It never occurred to me to switch over when that other stuff was available.
For me, at least, it would be kind of like using a plastic powder horn. I loaded and fired one shot when a friend was trying P, and didn't like it. Took me a while to get my rifle scrubbed clean afterwards and I never tried it again. When you come right down to it, It's an individual decision, is all. If the real BP was completely unavailable, I'd probably use the other stuff but it wouldn't be the same somehow. O'course, that's just me.

 

[tenngun]

I do have some p and load it in my flinters on top of a 15 grain kicker. And in my six shooters.
I clean the same, and that’s to say the-sun don’t set on my dirty guns.

 

[Chief Ten Beers]

I use both, real black in my flintlocks, 777 in my cap and ball revolvers.

 

[TomV]

First of all: in my 50 + years of shooting muzzleloaders I have never used a black powder substitute.
I see numerous posts on this forum about BP substitutes and would like to ask why one would use a BP substitute? I am asking for reasons other than real BP is not available. I am not criticizing anyone who choose to use a sub, just trying to collect thoughts on why? Real black powder always fascinated me with its' characteristics and historical significance, so I never tried a sub.
Flintlocklar

Same here Larry, BP only it is the real thing that was used. Side locks too not modern rifles.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

Those that find fault with our different reasons for shooting subs, are looking down the wrong rabbit hole. Please don't let this pettiness destroy a decent website.
Squint

Howard,
Please let it be know that on my original post I indicated this subject was not to criticize anyone's choice, only to find out why? I have not read 100% of the replies. The general consensus I am seeing is most actually prefer real black. Simply put...... their choice! That is not a put down to anyone who choses to use a sub. Hope that helps if you thought otherwise.
Keep your powder dry my friend.
Flintlocklar

 

[Carbon 6]

I think many shooters today have never used real black powder, never known that subs didn't always exist. I think it's a terrible injustice to history that they may never know what it is truly like to shoot a muzzleloader.

 

[Crow-Feather]

Be careful, some people who use the substitutes are highly defensive and will call you an elitist if you say you prefer the real deal. Reminds me that other long thread we had in the rifle section...

elitist ................................. not really, just got the urge

 

[Bob McBride]

Speaking of elitist, I wonder, if a detailed poll was taken, a statistician would find any correlation between people who use black powder and those who use substitutes, as far the use of the terms, "Flinter", "Rock Slinger", "Smokepole", "Front Stuffer" vs. "Flintlock, "Fowling Piece", etc., and HC vs. "Who cares", and what that correlation might be. Age? Rural vs. Urban? People who like history vs. those who are 'meh' about it? Readers vs. Movie watchers? Flintlocks vs. Percussion? Dem vs. Repub? Hipster vs. 'I'll go to Walmart in my d@#m pajamas'? There's obviously a line right down the middle of our hobby, but darned if I can put a finger on it.....

 

[Rudyard]

Never having used other than black powders in MLs I cant comment on substitutes.
Rudyard

 

[charlesk]

My Lyman gph likes pyrodex it’s shots real fine triple 7 fff pyrodex ff and fff goex and others ff fff and Mz ilike it all except of course my 3 flinters i shoot goex fff I have a 1868 Remington rolling block 50 70 government I use goex ff to reload when it comes to cleaning I use gunzilla cleans everything and then oil put it to bed I have a couple other pistols and rifles I shot what ever for hunting with a cap lock I feel triple 7 fff is the way to go it’s hot it’s fast and cleaning is no deal

 

[Bassdog1]

I use Goex, Goex Olde Eynsford and Swiss Black Powder cause I can Get it within an hour drive of home. But all said and done if I couldnt get real black I would have no problem shooting a substitute. I have talked with a lot of folks on here who have no reasonable powder sources close by and I understand a lot of folks also dont want to order online and pay high shipping and hazmat fees. I say shoot what you can get and can afford but by all means keep shooting.

 

[firestick]

I shoot Black MZ because BP is nowhere to be found around here. Not sure what I will shoot when my hoard of Black MZ runs out. I always shot real BP when it was available locally. 777 is $30/# here. Pyrodex a bit less. Black MZ was $21/# until Sportsmans Warehouse put it on the shelf for $10/#. That is when I loaded up. I should have bought it all but felt that was being greedy. The last of it dribbled out so I guess not many were interested in it. Maybe I'll sell my S&W 638 and buy a case of GOEX FF for my .50 and .58. FFF may be a little quick for the .58 My preference would be to have lots of real BP available like the old days and just buy what I needed when I needed it.