Do You See Anything Suspicious About This Rifle?

[Cowboy]

Thanks for this extremely educational topic Phil! We’re all very fortunate to have your research, thought’s, and personal insight at our fingertips.

Anyone who is not aware? Phil has a web site dedicated to GRRW. He also covers extensive history on GRRW Hawken’s Competition at the time as well! The who’s who from the late 60’s , through the 70’s and on. If you think that this topic was educational then visit GRRW.org .

On a personal note, I’d like to personally thank Phil for all the many questions he’s answered and also all the reseach that he’s gladly shared with me. He has a wealth of information and knowledge when it comes to Plains type rifle’s, especially the Hawken Rifle!

Respectfully, Cowboy :hatsoff:

 

[Scota4570]

Awesome thread. I came back to it and had a thought.

Given the fact that we are talking about the most famous civilian ML rife, I am really surprised that nobody has ever properly documented an original.

I mean close up quality photos with a scale and a graph paper background. Professional quality measured drawings. Documentation for the rifle as a whole and for every part.

It would be a book. I'd pay a lot for such a book. A builder or historian can only get so far with low quality unmeasured side views and hearsay documentation.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I have a set of blue prints done sometime in the 1970s off of a half stock that is/was in the Nebraska State Historical Society Museum. I am not at home so can’t check but I think the person who made the prints name was Robideux. There are about 20 rolls of full size drawings.

 

[plmeek]

Jake, you're right. Those very detailed set of blue prints were drawn and published by Wayne Robidoux. He made them as part of a class project while in college, I believe.

Herb visited the museum in Lincoln and examined the Hawken that Robidoux made his drawings from a year or so ago. He has posted several pictures he took of the rifle on this and other forums. It's definitely the best documented Hawken rifle so far.

As recently as 2014, those blue prints were advertised in Muzzle Blasts from Robidoux Inc. for $99.95.

 

[Heelerau]

I have an iron mounted Missouri rifle that has been crowned like that, it does make it easier to load with a tight combination.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I saw that Hawken in the display case several times in the late sixties or early 70's, but haven't been to the museum for many years.

My set of prints came to me with an unfinished full stock Hawken kit that was probably bought by the first "builder" in the late 70s. I started to attempt to finish it, but the stock inletting that had been done will require a bunch of redoing and I have things more pressing at this point. I could buy a new stock and start over, but want to attempt to salvage the one I received. Most of the parts are good to excellent quality except the lock. I believe it is a Dixie Gun Works Hawken percussion lock and is okay, but not great. The hammer is not at the right angle and may require some adjusting.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Due to the wide breech of the Hawken, care must be taken to allow for the breech. You have to install the lock to angle out instead of following the taper of the breech. If the front of the lock angles towards the muzzle, the back of the lock forces a very large wrist. This adjustment is very subtle and only a couple of degrees. Even with the correct angle of the lock, the hammer may still need adjustment. Even Sam and Jake had to adjust the hammers.

 

[Kansas Jake]

The barrel for the gun is not swamped, but appears to be very good quality. It is 1X36 in 54 caliber. The breech plug is hooked and part of the snail is on the tang and part on the breech plug. The angle of the hammer is such that it will not hit the nipple square, but at an angle. Also, does not have good clearance on the snail. There are a number of issues to address including additional inletting of the barrel. I have set it aside for a time to let my brain percolate on how to attack it as I do some other projects.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Due to the wide breech of the Hawken, care must be taken to allow for the breech. You have to install the lock to angle out instead of following the taper of the breech. If the front of the lock angles towards the muzzle, the back of the lock forces a very large wrist. This adjustment is very subtle and only a couple of degrees. Even with the correct angle of the lock, the hammer may still need adjustment. Even Sam and Jake had to adjust the hammers.

You have stated reason #246 why I am not a builder. :redface: :wink: Really, not funny. It takes serious skill to adjust and do that right.

 

[2049runwer]

I miss wrote what I meant. It was back in the early 1970s. It was my first trying to build a muzzleloading rifle. Just trying to get a 7 land bore and 2 step coneing was above me. I could walk in 5 days a week pick up one to look at a collector had here. All of it was way above me. I'm guessing this is the same Herb from back in 2004 this is fw. Hi again.