double barrel flint shotguns

[paulvallandigham]

Cody: I have hunted for many years with my grandfather's now 100 years old 12 ga. double, with exposed hammers, and no safeties, except maybe the rebound springs. The gun is carried loaded, that is, there are cartridges in the gun, but the hammers are cocked as you mount the gun to your shoulder. I do the same, out of habit, with my ML double. Its not hard to do, or slow. In fact, I don't really even notice myself doing it, any more. If you have ever used a modern shotgun hunting, that has a tang safety, much the same motion is done in moving the safety to " fire" by hunters as they raise the gun.

In the 19th century, gum makers didn't have the work " Ergo-dynamic", but they knew how to build guns that put the controls easily within reach of your thumbs and fingers. I am sure they got that idea from earlier gun makers who were only building ML shotguns.

 

Paul, I understand where your coming from. However, double cartridge and double perc guns are one thing, double flints are another. The locks on cartridge and perc guns are mounted under the barrels in a a similar relationship and are quite close together. They are not difficult to reach the spur on the off side lock. SXS flints OTOH have the locks mounted beside the barrels putting them considerably farther apart making the off side hammer more difficult to reach comfortably or instictively. I measured the distance from center to center of the spurs and jaw screws on a few of my guns for comparison sake. This is what I found:
Cartridge 12g - 1 1/2"
cartridge 10g - 1 5/8"
Percussion 8g - 1 5/8"
flint 20g with tapered breeches (circa1790) 2 1/2"
flint 12g with recessed breeches 2 9/16"

I suspect even a 20g flint with recessed breeches would come in at about 2 - 2 1/8", still no where near as slim as a perc or suppository gun.

Cody

 

[berickson]

i had a pedersoli 12 ga precussion double once. actually the nipples were on TOP of the breech, diectly into the charge. very fast lock time. one of those guns you regret trading.
i measured my 12 ga flinter
from outside to outside of the flash cups 3 1/2".
outside to outside of hammers - 3".
the other thing with mine is the length of pull. whoever eric designed this shotgun for must have been fond of bananas. it has a 15" lop to the REAR hammer.
i only met eric once but i would have noticed if his knuckles were dragging on the ground.
but these things aren't for snap shooting anyway.
and the LOP is easy to adjust to.
cody asked weight .. 8lbs 2 oz. my pedersoli was 6+lbs. i think they called it the uplander.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Cody: With a flint double, I doubt they bothered to cock both barrels at once. I have large hands, so even spanning a 3 1/2 inch gap would cause me no trouble. I could easily cock both. However, considering the cloud of smoke, the cost of components to feed a shotgun in the 18th century, it is unlikely that anyone then thought it was likely that they could get two quick shots off out of those guns. That second barrel was there if a bird rose after the first shot fired at a prior bird, , or to allow them to keep a loaded gun in hand while they reloaded the other barrel. It would be easy, and safe, to reload one barrel of a double gun while the charged barrel has its hammer lowered to half cock, but leaving the prime in the pan during reloading. ABout the only source of information on the loading and shooting practices comes from a very few diaries, letters, and some published stories.

 

[WRussell]

Here's a flint side by side double that's probably unique. Not only easier to cock, but rainproof.

 

[berickson]

well isn't that the coolest rig. just when you thought you'd seen everything. those old time gunsmiths had lots of secrets.