English scalper

[Bushfire]

Thank you, Bushfire. Yes, I did read the article BrokenNock listed, it had a lot of good information, I even looked up parts 1 and 2 of the article. That will probably be my next knife I make. I have one roughed out now, I’m thinking of doing it as a full tang just for something different…
View attachment 168915

If you ever go down the path of creating siamois folders I'd be very interested to see. Can't find anyone who makes one. It's either that or a laguiole for me next.

 

[Dan99]

If you ever go down the path of creating siamois folders I'd be very interested to see. Can't find anyone who makes one. It's either that or a laguiole for me next.

Send me details of what you want, I’ll see if it’s something I can do

 

[Brokennock]

View attachment 168902
Yeah, that looks A LOT better

Fantastic. A really great job.

 

[user 48679]

FWIW, sometimes ( if I don't want the knife to look spanky new) I cold blue the blade & do something about the handle finish/appearance.

 

[tenngun]

My thought was that the wood would be more likely to split, splinter or break then steel, but I personally haven’t done any testing or research.

I’m not trying to start an argument here for the sake if argument. And more then one knife has broke over the centuries.
But I’m thinking here of real high pressure on the blade. You have the handle firmly clamped in your hand. Your squeezing so tight your finger are white. You pushing hard on the blade with your thumb
Now you have real pressure on the pins and the front pin is heavier then the rear
I would not be surprised if we’re talking tons on this pin.
I’ve not tried this as I don’t own a half tang knife, so this is just musing while smoking a pipe, and as solid as my smoke.
But I have to think my thumb would fail before the wood fractures or the bearing pressure of the first pin would cause the wood to fail irregardless of full or half tang.
If you were abusing the blade by prying with it ( guilty too many times of this) or using a mallet to drive it like a fro splitting wood ( guilty as charged again) your snap line is in the blade not the tang.
Howsomever there was a time when full tangs replaced half, was it easier as machines took over blade making, or was it a real advantage? I’ve no answer for that question

 

[Red Owl]

Jed Smith, the mountain man, tried to fight off a grizzly bear with a scapler/butcher and broke the knife, so such happened. This brings up a point, I think what we want to do is try to re-create period correct gear and then get the experience of using it. Things can always be "improved" but recreating the original, that's the whole point.
On some of the original half tang scalpers, the photos always show the profile, seldom the top and bottom but on a few it looks like the handle is slightly splayed out in front from the half tang being driven in place. Not certain. I have tried to find out how the handles were attached- without much luck.
In England a huge order would be taken. This was usually by an actual maker but sometimes by a broker. The order was often so large that it could not be filled without hiring subcontractors to supply knives. All this Sheffield makers knew each other and each had stamps from all the firms. So A gets an order for 10,000 knives, He makes 5,000 and hires B, C, D, E, and F to make 1,000 each. B,C,D, and F all have stamps from each other and they stamp the blades "A". as if A made all of them. This explains why stamp makers of the same firm sometimes are slightly different, one area with a bur, etc.
There were blade makers, handle makers, and "cutlers", the cutlers being those who took the parts and assemble the knives. Of course endless exceptions existed, some firms did it all.
There are a few Sheffield firms that absolutely insist they supply the American trade but if you go by orders and stamp marks, nothing. The reality is they were likely one of these sub-contractors. If we could get records from Sheffield on sub-contracting out then part of the mystery could be solved but I haven't found any such sources.
QUESTION TO ALL. What would you prefer, a deep stamp on the blade that looks good but isn't really PC. Such as Joe Smith creates a stamp of a Maltese cross with the letters JS on either side. OR.......would you prefer a very light etch (Like Russell Green River where you can sand/emery paper off the mark if you wish?

 

[Rifleman1776]

FWIW, sometimes ( if I don't want the knife to look spanky new) I cold blue the blade & do something about the handle finish/appearance.

Similar to a Carrigan Bowie. Beautiful. The right wood, properly mounted, is a very durable material for knife handles.

 

[beardedhorse]

Most folks aren't aware that trade knives came from places other than Sheffield, England. The French boucherons, J.A. Henkels from Germany existed in fur trade times and markets. Forged blades on butchers and scalpers have tapered tangs - that is the tang getting thinner toward the butt end. File marks would have been left on backwoods knives - see Madison Grant's book on the Knife in Homespun America. I would not indiscriminately put markers stamps on a blade without first doing thorough research. James Hanson's Fur Trade Cutlery Sketchbook and Jim Gordon's Great Knifemakers of the West are good sources. There are books on maker's marks. I. Wilson stamps were covered in a Museum of the Fur Trade Quarterly article. Having access to originals is the best source. On both knife blades and fire steels, Native Americans would pass on roughly finished pieces. Some scalper handles with half tangs have diamond cross section on the handles. Certain species of woods were used, not just some convenient piece of hardwood in the shop. Some orders going out West were shipped without handles.

 

[Dan99]

FWIW, sometimes ( if I don't want the knife to look spanky new) I cold blue the blade & do something about the handle finish/appearance.

That’s a great idea. I did that on the knife I normally carry, but that was so it wasn’t so shiny and noticeable

 

[Dan99]

So after the 1/2 tang strength questions, I decided to do some research. This isn’t to change anyone mind, but I was surprised at what I’ve seen so far. I haven’t tried to pry any car doors open, yet . Here’s what I have done

Ps
This knife was put together quickly and left rough to not waste time if handle failed. Three iron pins no glue or epoxy was used

 

[Notchy Bob]

So after the 1/2 tang strength questions, I decided to do some research. This isn’t to change anyone mind, but I was surprised at what I’ve seen so far. I haven’t tried to pry any car doors open, yet . Here’s what I have done

Ps
This knife was put together quickly and left rough to not waste time if handle failed. Three iron pins no glue or epoxy was used

Epic post, Dan!

Those are tough knives!

Notchy Bob

 

[Dan99]

What would a fair price be for a knife like this?