ffffg Revolver loads

[markdwhite15]

Bought a new Pietta 1860 Army from Taylor's. Steel frame built in 2022. I have shot it with Goex and Schuetzen fffg under a wonder wad and Speer round ball. Have loaded up to 27 grains. It fires ok but very dirty and a lot of the powder burns after it leaves the 8" barrel. After a lot of research, I want something more akin to the 1860s pistol grade black powder of the original load. I'm gonna try my Goex ffffg. Like to hear from folks who have shot it in their revolvers. I have Treso nipples, and have been burning black powder for 50 years. I understand about pressure issues.

 

[desi23]

I have used Goex 4f in my pocket model (31 cal.) and in a couple 36 cal. guns as well. No issues in operation, not much difference in fouling but seemed slightly less than Goex 3f. Would like to chronograph the loads some time as they seemed to be a bit snappier with more effect on my swinging plate targets. Using conicals and 18 grs in the 36 caliber guns, round ball and 15 grs in the 31. I was duplicating the 3f loads I normally used in these guns and they worked fine.

This subject always seems to start a real mud slinging fest with some posters. I decided to try it after reading up on the early combustible cartridges and what writers of the time classed as "pistol powder". I have also broken down examples of early metallic cartridges (didn't have any combustibles in my collection but have talked with people who did examine such rounds) loaded with black powder and examined the powder used in them for comparison. Handgun rounds clearly were using very fine grades of powder, much closer to 4f than 3f. Some of the smaller caliber rounds were loaded with powder that was even finer than modern 4f. I have no problem with using 4f in a revolver myself but many people seem to go nuts on the subject. In the end it comes down to what you are comfortable with and your willingness to experiment

 

[markdwhite15]

I have used Goex 4f in my pocket model (31 cal.) and in a couple 36 cal. guns as well. No issues in operation, not much difference in fouling but seemed slightly less than Goex 3f. Would like to chronograph the loads some time as they seemed to be a bit snappier with more effect on my swinging plate targets. Using conicals and 18 grs in the 36 caliber guns, round ball and 15 grs in the 31. I was duplicating the 3f loads I normally used in these guns and they worked fine.

This subject always seems to start a real mud slinging fest with some posters. I decided to try it after reading up on the early combustible cartridges and what writers of the time classed as "pistol powder". I have also broken down examples of early metallic cartridges (didn't have any combustibles in my collection but have talked with people who did examine such rounds) loaded with black powder and examined the powder used in them for comparison. Handgun rounds clearly were using very fine grades of powder, much closer to 4f than 3f. Some of the smaller caliber rounds were loaded with powder that was even finer than modern 4f. I have no problem with using 4f in a revolver myself but many people seem to go nuts on the subject. In the end it comes down to what you are comfortable with and your willingness to experiment

Thanks, I had similar results in my quest for information on the original powder and loads. Hopefully the nay sayers will do a little research too.

 

[Uncle Miltie]

The Lyman BP books used to include 4f loads for pistols and revolvers. I tried them years ago but accuracy for me with 4f was rather poor.

 

[markdwhite15]

The Lyman BP books used to include 4f loads for pistols and revolvers. I tried them years ago but accuracy for me with 4f was rather poor.

Yes, I had a copy many years ago. My uncle loaded his Ruger Old Army with 4f under a lead bullet topped with crisco back in 1973. I stopped to visit when I got back from my first tour and we went shooting in the swamp with it and his TC Hawken. My introduction to black powder.

 

[Pete453]

Hmm, I had one of those I bought in December. I ran a ball over 30 and 35gr goex 3f and a wad with homemade lube. That gun shot great at 25yds, I was the limiting factor. At 27 grs you may not getting good consistent pressure on the powder. Or maybe try adding a little more lube to the wads. My bores look dusty after several cylinders of full loads. These pics are 2 seperate range trips with my Uberti 60 army and full loads

 

[TDM]

I’ve never used 4F in my revolvers, but I see no harm in it. Try it and see how it does for you.

 

[Stantheman86]

I could never get enough 4f to even attempt to experiment with it

I went the other way and used 1f with good results, in a .44

 

[markdwhite15]

Found a pound of Swiss 4f yesterday at my local supplier, cost me $37 plus tax. Only had two, I bought one. Now I have Goex and Swiss for testing.

 

[Uncle Miltie]

Found a pound of Swiss 4f yesterday at my local supplier, cost me $37 plus tax. Only had two, I bought one. Now I have Goex and Swiss for testing.

The Swiss priming powder (Null B) is excellent. International shooters often make a 50-50 mix of GOEX and Null B because many feel the Swiss powder more readily absorbs moisture than the GOEX powder, and mixing them provides quicker ignition with some resistance to moisture. I bought a pound of Scheutzen (Wano) ffffg powder from the Log Cabin yesterday and I'll try it out this week.

 

[markdwhite15]

The Swiss priming powder (Null B) is excellent. International shooters often make a 50-50 mix of GOEX and Null B because many feel the Swiss powder more readily absorbs moisture than the GOEX powder, and mixing them provides quicker ignition with some resistance to moisture. I bought a pound of Scheutzen (Wano) ffffg powder from the Log Cabin yesterday and I'll try it out this week.

I bought a pound of Schuetzen 3f a couple weeks ago to try out. I normally use Goex, seemed a little less powerful than the Goex, with more fowling to me. Trying to get my supplier to get in more Swiss.

 

[Stantheman86]

I also thought about blending 3f and 4f.

People who have opened original nitrate cartridges found the powder to be in between 3 and 4f in grain size

 

[morehops52]

It's different brand but my ROA factory manual says it would handle full charges of ffffg

 

[Stantheman86]

I'd bet it will burn very clean

The little NAA cap and ballers are supposed to use 4f

 

[Grenadier1758]

It is worthwhile noting that the first edition of the "Lyman Black Powder Loading Manual" listed revolver loads with 4f powder with the pressure data. These were for the open top colt revolvers as the Remington revolvers could not be modified for pressure measurement. Note: there are no 4f loads listed in the Second edition.