First... maybe only flintlock

[Dphar]

OK... I know it a personal preference... what do you plan on hunting(doing) with it kinda question... but I'll ask anyway.
I've been saving up for my first flinter kit, still a bit to go, and am torn between a smooth bore and a rifle. I like the longer range/ accuracy of the rifle but the multipurpose functionality of the smooth bore. As there's no way I can afford both, I have to choose one.
Looking to possibly use it for reenacting, turkey, squirrel and definitely deer.
My primary concern is effective range on the smooth bore. I hunt in Wisconsin, so most shots are well under 100 yards. If I do my part, can I get a smooth bore to hit a pie plate consistently out to 100 yards? The dilemma is range and accuracy for deer(possibly limiting shots to 25-40 yards) vs. hunt turkeys and squirrels.
I've been looking at kits at Sitting Fox, specifically the Early Pennsylvania Transitional Rifle, French Tulle or Penn Smooth Rifle.
Thanks for your help all.

If you are going to shoot solid shot the smoothbore is a waste of time.
At 40 yards a smooth rifle will kill deer every shot. But at 40 yards a rifle will do head shots on deer and save following them.
The smoothbore is useless for small game unless bird shot is used then the lack of choke restricts effectiveness on Squirrels and such. It also costs more to shoot if of a bore size that is really useful with shot.
The usefulness/versatility of the smoothbore is grossly over blown. To me they are LESS versatile than a rifle. This is based on actual experience.
I have killed grouse with a FL pistol at shotgun ranges (they can fly?)
Its a shotgun. If its a smooth rifle its not even a good shotgun being stocked as a rifle. I don't know what the French trade guns are stocked as for the most part. A friend of mine you started making MLs in the 1950s told me he hated making fowlers since getting the fit right so they were usable as a shotgun was a PITA so he only made 3 at the most out of the 350-400 rifles he made.

The trade guns (French or English) were designed to arm the enemy. Would you give YOUR potential enemy a really good firearm?
We also have to remember that back in the day the rifle match was the primary form of sport in many communities well into the 1870s. Smooth rifles and trade guns do not fair well in live turkey matches or in closest to center matches as were carried on in TENN and KY right to modern times.

My experience is that SBs ALWAYS throw random fliers. In the field shooting at deer at 100 yards with typical ML sights a 3" sighting error is not unusual (the critters lack distinct aiming points). If the SB decided that this shot will be one of the 2-3 out of 5 shots that will be "out" this and the aiming error could put the shot 8-10" from the aiming point.
Yeah its happened to me. A season of trying to hunt with a smoothbore convinced me that a rifle was a far better bet.
I am reminded of a story a poster on another sight quoted from a journal of a French expedition in eastern NA circa 1720-30. They were hungry. They find turkey in a tree. Several members shot several shots each and NEVER KILLED A BIRD. They gave up in disgust and drifted away still without food. So they wasted powder and lead, made a LOT of noise in a potentially dangerous area (all of NA qualified at the time) and gained NOTHING. Given they were French the chances of their using rifles is virtually nil. So I see it as a classic smoothbore hunting experience. Apparently they had no "swan shot" along or the guns would not pattern well enough with it to kill a bird (choke boring was 100+ years in the future).

Finally one must ask himself what advantage is there to shooting a solid ball from a smoothbore?
There is none. Other than being able to say "heh I got this really cool (insert Tulle, NW gun, smooth rifle)" and having people think its cool.
IMO hunting game with an inaccurate firearm is immoral.
If you want a smoothbore by all means go for it. But its not as good as a rifle with a solid ball and its not really a shotgun either unless a properly stocked fowler.
But some people, especially "re-enactors", think its really cool.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

If I am properly reading the website, you can get the smooth-rifle "in-the-white" either PA or VA style for $500? I'd JUMP on that, and I'd get it in 15/16 24 gauge (.58) or in 20 gauge as those would probably be the lightest versions.

Based on your personal hunting concerns, and that you already have a rifle, I would say the smoothbore is your best all-around choice.

In fact, because of your thread, now I am considering such a purchase for myself. :haha:

LD

Its simply not possible to get a quality ML in the white or otherwise for 500 bucks. Its going to be a slapped together gun with poor shaping and no attention to detail I would love to pull the breech plug and see how its fit.
A Jim Chambers KIT costs more than this un-assembled.
So we have to ask, what did they not do right in order to sell it this cheap? Probably darned near everything.

Dan

 

[jdkerstetter]

Smoothbore with ball is fine if you know and stick to your limits! To me it's no different than archery. You are challenging yourself by limiting your effective range.

Dan is right that if you want to kill more game at varying distances then a rifle is the better choice. But for some it isn't just about the killing.

If I depended on the meat to feed my family I would use a rifle. If it's more about the challenge then use a smoothbore, bow or whatever is legal and satisfies you.

My luck? I see the buck of a lifetime at 80 yards with a 75 yard smoothy. :shake: So, until I get that buck of a lifetime I'm using a rifle when legal!

Enjoy, J.D.

 

[jdkerstetter]

That's $500 in addition to the kit cost not $500 for an in-the-white assembled gun. Finished gun is $600 in addition to the kit cost on the link provided.

The FDC kit on their site $559 (in Maple) and is $400 additional in-the-white and $550 extra for the finished gun.

Enjoy, J.D.

 

[cynthialee]

I have rifles, a pistol and a modern(ish) .410
Whenever I spot a predator eyeing my birds or I hear a kerfuffle out in the yard with the animals my first thought is go get a gun and the gun I invariably grab is the .410
Why?
The smooth bore.
I can shoot a slug or shot through it. It gives me more options than my pistol or rifles.

I really want a BP smoothbore. Just been keeping my eye out for it. One will pop up for sale locally, eventualy. Then I can ditch the .410

 

[asbrown]

:surrender: Wow Dan, why don't you tell us how you really feel. I guess all the HC/PC guys out there toting smoothbores are immoral. The french voyageurs and courier de bois didn't seem to have a problem feeding themselves and surviving for months on end with only a smoothbore. Never mind the indians who seemed to do a pretty good job of denuding the eastern seabord of game for trade with the white settlers. But then this is an unneccesary arguement because we dont live in the 1700's and it all comes down to personal choice,now doesn't it. :v

 

[asbrown]

Between 1900 and 1920 unnamed members of my fathers family hunted deer in the far northern reaches of Wisconsin with .22 rifles. 50yds. and headshots were the norm. This was both a challenge, and a way to put meat on the table for the least amount of money. No ruined meat, ever. Today we have the luxury of going to the store for our meat so that we can afford to hunt with whatever we choose. Those who choose to hunt with a smoothbore also choose to limit their range to insure a clean kill. If Dan knew some of the guys I have hunted with over the years he would be surprised to find that even with a modern scoped rifle some of them can't make a clean kill at 100yds. Your right that choosing to hunt with a smoothbore provides maximum versatility to hunt all types of game in all types of situations. It may not be perfect for any particular situation, but used correctly can get the job done in most. :v

 

[jdkerstetter]

No argument here. It's all about choices. Enjoy, J.D.

 

[hanshi]

I feel a bit more kindly toward the smoothbore than you do, though I acknowledge the range and accuracy limitation. Being a rifleman first, it took me a long, long time to finally try out a flint smoothbore. I found that I like it a lot. At 50 yards it's easily inside a deer's vital area; and in fact I killed (running shot) a doe this past season with it (it has a rear sight).

Where I hunt a 50 yard shot is a fairly long one and my average kill range is about 30 yards. Lack of a choke does limit shot to 25 or 30 yards. But again most shots are within that range. Yep, I normally reach for my rifle when the season starts but I don't hesitate to pick up the slick barrel when the time comes. ff Sorry about that.

 

[Big Ol Gobbler]

Thank you all for the feedback.

 

[Drago]

I think they are charging a extra 500.00 to complete the kit " in the white" and a little more to finish it.