First Shot Throwing Wild?

[N.Y. Yankee]

Is it "normal" for a rifle to throw the first shot from a clean barrel wild, as in, completely missing the target board? My situation: 22 yr old .54 Lyman GPR with about 250 rounds through it, 80gr Goex 3F, .530 ball and .015 pillow tick patch lubed w/ Bore Butter. Warm, clear summer day, gun rested on a rolled towel pad on the bench, 65 yd shot. I take my time, set the trigger, aim small and squeeze. I have an 18"x18" cardboard with a 8.5x11 inch target, orange dot marking center aiming point. For the 3rd time now, the first shot has not hit the cardboard from 65 yds. Shots 2,3, 4, and 5 will hit in about a palm sized group near the orange dot, or what I call "minute of deer" grouping. I'm baffled by this as this is my hunting rifle and I have been carrying it on the hunt loaded in a clean bore. I wipe the bore out well before the first loading so there is no oil in the bore. I've had this gun shoot a bulls-eye with the first shot in the past. What baffles me is that the following shots will hit close to point of aim. Any thoughts?

 

[eggwelder]

some like to have a fouling shot first. Dutch Shoultz covers this in his book

 

[mooman76]

First shot from a clean bore is usually a little off but it shouldn't be off by more than a few inches at most, not a foot or more. . Something about the first shot is causing this but I haven't a clue. When you wipe just before the first shot, are you wiping the bore after with a dry patch or two?

 

[Flinter 2]

I've had too many muzzle loaders over the years to keep track of them, I started out in the early '70's with T/C percussion guns and a few years later switched to Flintlocks and never looked back, I still own a few percussion M/L's but I've never experienced a first wild shot like you are explaining.
However, many muzzle loaders do shoot away from the point of aim from a clean bore, usually a fouling shot will put them back on target, but 18" out of the way is a bit excessive I'd say.
You could try loading with 2-F and see if that makes a difference, another suggestion I might make is for you to drop your 3-FG charge down from 80 gr. to 70 gr., ROT for .54 cal. for a hunting load is about 80gr. of 2-FG, 3-FG burns a bit faster and raises the pressure a bit, so it's recommended to cut back about 10% on the volume when using 3-FG over 2-FG.
I like the .54 cal. also and have four of them, I use 3-FG GOEX exclusively in all my muzzle loaders, even my .62 cal. fowlers, but I do cut back on the powder charges a bit.

 

[N.Y. Yankee]

First shot from a clean bore is usually a little off but it shouldn't be off by more than a few inches at most, not a foot or more. . Something about the first shot is causing this but I haven't a clue. When you wipe just before the first shot, are you wiping the bore after with a dry patch or two?

Yes I wipe with dry patches to remove oil etc. 2 patches, 2 strokes each.

 

[Phil Coffins]

From your rest I would consider 2” out a thrown shot. 80 grains of two or three F is a fine amount of powder for a 54 round ball. The one thing that I would do is a very good cleaning to remove all the bore butter then try again with out bore butter. You can read up here on why you can’t season a barrel and of all the things that I’ve been around bore butter comes in last.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I have an 18"x18" cardboard with a 8.5x11 inch target, orange dot marking center aiming point. For the 3rd time now, the first shot has not hit the cardboard from 65 yds. Shots 2,3, 4, and 5 will hit in about a palm sized group near the orange dot, or what I call "minute of deer" grouping.

SO..., does it always throw the first shot to the same spot, just way off point of aim? Like..., is the first shot always 12" right and at 2 o'clock high from the rest of the group?

When you pick up your fired patches..., what do they look like?

See IF your wild shot is all over the place, and the group appears from the second shot on..., then you may need a different patch/lube/ ball combo, as I was taught that such a situation means that gas from the main charge is destroying your patch or more likely simply escaping around the ball, but at different points, so it pushes the ball off the target, different directions each time you start with a fresh bore. The following shots seal the bore better, though maybe not as well as the seal might be, and you get your palm sized group. You can try different patching material, or you could put a felt wad or cornmeal filler in between the patched ball and the powder charge.

IF the barrel throws the first shot in a consistent place..., look at your patches. I think you will find the rifling is partially cutting a portion of the patch, and you get gas escaping through to push on the ball, but this is consistent because the hole is being cut in the same spot. The second shot with the bore butter is giving your patch enough lubrication to reduce or stop the cutting. Polishing the bore will remove the burr that may be cutting the patch. The wad and filler solution might work here also.

LD

 

[Sam squanch]

Is your barrel wedge too tight or too loose? How’s the barrel bedded in the stock? Enough room for the wedges to slide a little in their under lugs when the barrel gets hot?

 

[necchi]

Looking at your patch/lube/ball combo;
It might be a little loose and over-lubed,, too "slick" to be able to get a spin from the clean bore.
Try 535 ball, a thicker patch or a lot less lube, or even a different lube completely.
I learned very early in my ML shooting hobby that "Bore Butter" was a detriment to accuracy, I loath the stuff.
Others mileage may very,,

 

[dave951]

I'd look at barrel bedding and attachment especially if it does this after cleaning.

 

[ohio ramrod]

Many times a first shot will have a slight hang fire due to oil residue in the breech. Not enough to notice, but enough to affect accuracy.

 

[deermanok]

I have a couple of rifles that will throw the first shot left or right from a clean barrel but only a few inches.
I might be way off but is it possible that because your barrel is getting older and maybe worn some?
What if you used a thicker patch for the first shot? Maybe a .018"?

 

[BS]

Do yo pull the barrel to clean it?

The barrel may not be tightly seated. against the tang.

Use a different lube, try a dry and a different wet.

One of my guns at 100 yds shot 7"s left, first shot.

I did a test over a week, 1st and second shots. Two nice groups, 7"s apart................frustrating!!!!

I was using Wonder Lube at the time..........the fix!!!!!!

A heavy slathered lubed barrel after loading!

You could leave the gun loaded for a week, but before going out, you have to re-lube the bore!

This worked for me.

 

[yonderin]

Even swabbing after your first shot, still likely a wee bit of fouling which could contribute to better obturation. Might make a difference. Swabbing between subsequent shots should help maintain a consistent level of fouling.
Will suggest that maybe you're not cleaning out your barrel as well as you think before firing the first one. I usually swab my barrel with alcohol and run a couple of dry patches before I even left the house. Best I could figger to have absolutely dry bore before hitting the range.

As suggested, barrel seats under recoil of firing the first one which could affect POI. I'd suspect something like this, given your results. Does your wedge/pins fit snug? On one of my TCs, wedge one side up is snugger than the other.

Was taught of something called lay-by (?) effect. Essentially, firing changes stresses in barrel so don't be surprised if subsequent shots don't go where first does. In my former life, would fire "Two rounds warming into the butts" before proceeding to shoot for zero. Honestly, I never personally noticed it having a great effect.

Try from a lot closer and see where that first shot is going. Unless I missed it, you're not sure where it's going.

 

[GoodRabbitPilgrim]

Cold bore or clean bore, it's an issue that affects centrefires as well.

 

[Britsmoothy]

The simplest and first step is to add a firewall between the patched ball and powder. Then report back.
250 shots should have the barrel run in but as Dave suggests it may need polishing. Many barrels do, especially those that depend on a piece of cloth!

 

[LME]

Cold bore or clean bore, it's an issue that affects centrefires as well.

That is true ! When I shot tournaments years ago ,"""Modern rifles"""" I fired several rounds before going on the target it made the rifle consistant. Every muzzle loader rifle I have had would shoot high on the first shot that is after I found the load they liked. I also dialed in B.P. rifles for other people and found their rifle did the same?

 

[Erwan]

Can you just make a test :
Prior to all the shots, sweep the bore with a greasy patch and shot only with powder (without bullet) et sweep again with the same patch dirty of the beginning and greasy before to shoot the firs bullet. If all the impacts are at the right place, that can really means that your accord barrel/patch/grease/bullet is wrong for a part...
Other way, something I have never been able to explain is that frequently, with a very clean and good barrel, the first bullet often goes a bit higher than the others, not much but a bit...

 

[LME]

Can you just make a test :
Prior to all the shots, sweep the bore with a greasy patch and shot only with powder (without bullet) et sweep again with the same patch dirty of the beginning and greasy before to shoot the firs bullet. If all the impacts are at the right place, that can really means that your accord barrel/patch/grease/bullet is wrong...

I don't follow you? What I do is load the same as I alway do if hunting . I know how much my first shot will throw high and allow for it, I think the resistance being less on the first shot due to the barrel being clean is the culprit ? If I were shooting in a tournament I would foul the barrel before taking a shot at a target! I did this with modern rifles when shooting in tournaments.

 

[Billy Boy]

Is it "normal" for a rifle to throw the first shot from a clean barrel wild, as in, completely missing the target board? My situation: 22 yr old .54 Lyman GPR with about 250 rounds through it, 80gr Goex 3F, .530 ball and .015 pillow tick patch lubed w/ Bore Butter. Warm, clear summer day, gun rested on a rolled towel pad on the bench, 65 yd shot. I take my time, set the trigger, aim small and squeeze. I have an 18"x18" cardboard with a 8.5x11 inch target, orange dot marking center aiming point. For the 3rd time now, the first shot has not hit the cardboard from 65 yds. Shots 2,3, 4, and 5 will hit in about a palm sized group near the orange dot, or what I call "minute of deer" grouping. I'm baffled by this as this is my hunting rifle and I have been carrying it on the hunt loaded in a clean bore. I wipe the bore out well before the first loading so there is no oil in the bore. I've had this gun shoot a bulls-eye with the first shot in the past. What baffles me is that the following shots will hit close to point of aim. Any thoughts?

I would drop the bore butter for a patch lube. Try spit, windex, or veg oil/bees wax. We all have a flier on occasion, mostly on the first shot, but not like that. Never had any use for bore butter - for anything, our cats try to bury it….