Flint Pistol Opinions What Is It? Pics!

[Mulebrain]

What is it? And what is it worth? I have a line on this for 3 bills!

Let me know fellas!

 

[Mulebrain]

Am I being laughed out of the barn or what? Can anyone help?
The lock on this begs question??

 

[Zonie]

It's hard to say what it is by just looking at the pictures.

I've seen phony non working and real working guns which looked something like it.

Do you have anything you could add to the pictures to tell us something. Caliber? Markings? Smoothbore? Drilled vent hole or modern vent plug? ::

 

[Mulebrain]

Thanks for the first reply!!

From what I know, it is real!

Is that a screw cap on the butt for patches???

I figure it has got to be worh at least 300 based on what I have seen!

Heck the lock is gorgeous!

The guy told me others have looked at it, and they can't tell, if it is original or later model. So I assume it could be a diamond in the rough?

I would think the furniture is worth the asking price! This guy lives in the boonies!

Just look at the carvings on the stock! This does no appear to be an Avon cologne bottle :haha:

Zonie,

I got hi res photos if you want them?

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

It looks Spanish or Italian, but as Zonie says it could be a fake. There were gentlemen of dubious repute who made a very good living putting together guns using old parts that were laying around in barrels all over the world. The problem is that the parts are old and, after 60 years, so are the guns. These guys could fake a patina as well as they could fake sincerity, so even taking the gun apart may not gain you much. But I'd take apart if the seller will allow it. Three bills seems steep anyway, so I'd think it over well before I bought it. The more I look at it, the more the pan area looks off. I have a similar lock around here somewhere that is quite similar. It's 30 years old, though, not 250. Maybe you could show it to someone with a working knowledge of these pistols?

 

OK, what about proof marks, makers stamps on barrel or lock. The markings could help a lot! As well as some better photos.

At least pull the lock and see if it has Made in Tiwan stamped on it!

The photos do not show this as an exceptional piece, but what you are asking is imposible with photos alone.

If it is a relic it is worth what the seller can get for it. If it is a fake it is still worth what the seller can get for it. Wheather it is worth what you pay for it is an alltogather diferent matter.

I have a fowler downstairs that I built last winter. I aged the barrel, lock and wood to bonafied relic status. The wear, flash burning, pitting, tarnish and filth patterns have already fooled several people that should have known better!

:front:

 

[Mulebrain]

I have sent pics to Gunderson, John will know in a heartbeat! I am curious about the shiney furniture on this pistol. Were these parts lying around in barrels too? Were people re-casting these parts as well? I assume so? I am meeting the seller today. I will request side lock removal, and make him an offer to buy, or identify it for him.

This is fun as heck fake or not!

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

As we know, the muzzleloading era has never ended. But 150 or so years ago, some poor, misguided souls began loading from the breech or wrong end of their guns, using little brass cans they called cartridges. These suppository guns are still used to this very day by the descendants of these folks. Hard to believe, but I've actually seen it with my own eyes!
Anyway, as production of these new-fangled gizmos ramped up, fewer proper, muzzleloading firearms were made. Due to the mass conversion to breech loaders, especially by the various militaries of the world, a surplus of parts for the early guns came to exist. Locks, barrels and furniture. The gunsmiths of Belgium used these parts to build trade muskets for the African trade well into the 20th century. Turner Kirkland, for one, used to have some of these parts in his catalog. So it is quite possible for a faker to find the necessary brass furniture to build any number of guns, or to copy an old part and use the new castings to build his fakes. Add a little patina, and suddenly the new gun looks old.
If old barrels are reused, the proof marks don't have much use in indicating the age of a gun. I have an original Enfield barrel on one of my pistols, and it has real proofs on it. The barrel is 150 years old, but the pistol is only 25 or 30 years old. The maker was an honest man, but with a little work, this gun could be turned into a reasonably good fake. The old adage "caveat emptor" is of profound meaning in the purchasing of old guns. It is very difficult to determine authenticity from a photograph. Some might say it's impossible.

 

[robinghewitt]

Hi High Power

I've been turning up the brightness and zooming in on your pictures. There's cross hatching on the forearm, so I have to ask, does the decoration include anything recogniseably animal or vegetable?

best regards

Squire Robin

 

[Stumpkiller]

One thing to look for is that wood shrinks as it ages. The metal should be raised above it in the "flush" inlays.

There are fellers in Afganistan and India who turn out such beauties with a file and a cold chisel. Be very cautious when buying "antique" weapons. The metal could be light in color because it is pewter or "pot" metal.


This one sells for $59 new.

$62

$84

Be careful, and make sure there is an approval period.


The butt cap, if removable, most likely held a few spare balls.

When all is said and done, things are only worth the enjoyment you get out of them or what you can sell them for.

 

[Tahquamenon]

I think you should buy it if it proves to be authentic.

:thumbsup: