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Flintlock flash guards for competitive tournaments

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Rather disrespectful of the Patriots being honored. I participate at every ceremony that my SAR performs, along with the tri-state areas DARs of course I have been doing reenacting for 50 years where flash guards with TWO POINT attachments have been required for most of that time.
It must be a National SAR Rule regarding flash guards. KY has either dropped the rules or turn a blind eye towards it. Not sure, but since they welcome shooters without the flash guards, I'm in.
I participated in the Blue Licks SAR monument Remembrance back in August 2023.
They went from 7 shooters last year to 31 shooters in the volley.
Cant remember who took this pic, but, I was on the far right out of frame.

368688363_10218893059516413_2894370610984375181_n.jpg


I enjoy performing these, just not with flash guards.

368672134_10218893056436336_7369315897406172461_n.jpg


Due to that flash guard rule either being dropped or ignored, 31 shooters is the most they have had in years.
I'm on the far right above.
 
For those curious FF with a flashguard
Cannon.JPG
vs FFFF without
FFFF.JPG

I can see how the flash is the "same size" but when you are using the FF the flashguard actually redirects a burning charge toward the shooters face. With the FFFF you can see how there is almost no slow burning to travel in any direction. The flashguard was installed and removed for the purpose of taking the pictures to illustrate the difference. Eliminating the possible flaw of different weapons reacting differently. It is due to results like this that I posted my original comment regarding safety.
 
For those curious FF with a flashguard
View attachment 268572 vs FFFF without
View attachment 268573
I can see how the flash is the "same size" but when you are using the FF the flashguard actually redirects a burning charge toward the shooters face. With the FFFF you can see how there is almost no slow burning to travel in any direction. The flashguard was installed and removed for the purpose of taking the pictures to illustrate the difference. Eliminating the possible flaw of different weapons reacting differently. It is due to results like this that I posted my original comment regarding safety.
Those are huge flashes. I suspect too much powder in the pan in both cases.
 
Same amount of powder in the pan, pan was fully closed with no spillage. I like to tune locks so the spark very well and fire reliably. Here is an example of sparks without powder, note how they land and dance about in the pan.
IMG_7358.JPG
 
You're lucky these guys hang around for the abuse they take on every freaking subject that comes up.
Who wrote that?? I didn’t see it. They might be on that list 😜

EDIT: I did see after I looked. That guy’s been on the list for months since he first came in here bloviating about what an expert he is with what I seem to remember, an ugly gun. The other guy who couldn’t figure out how to build a Kibler gun. Yeah, he too. Yep, Ian H, you’re already there. lol.
 
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just a thought in flashguards, I see so many people putting WAY too much powder in the pan. Even guys who do videos (no, I am not busting on my friend @B P Maniac Shooter ). I’ve watched guys just fill the pan. The photos above… Lotsa powder 😯 perhaps, if one used less. Try that. Really. And then close the frizzen and tap the other side to move the powder away from the touch hole. Try that. Or don’t. What do I know?

At reenactments, you’re not going to get them to do away the rule about flash guards. Too many lawyers involved and the Aunt Mary pearl clutchers who worry and freak out at things. If they want to end direct combat or having native reenactors, do ya think they will stop on flash guards?
 
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Being on FlinterNick, FrenchColonial, Comfortably Numb, and Sturmkaze's ignore lists would make for a much more pleasant forum. "bloviations" indeed.

Back to MY thread, I just learned something from @Sooty Scot that I didn't know: The flash guards attached to the frizzen screw are intended to pivot down for cleaning and loading, which answers one of my original questions about how much do they get in the way when cleaning the pan on humid days. Thanks.
Actually they are not meant to swivel down for loading. There's no need to swivel them down and if you do, all you are doing is loosening the bolt or screw that holds it on, which causes it to fall down below the lock so that the flashguard is no longer functional. I had that happen one time when I neglected to check the tightness of it before a reenactment. It rotated down hanging from the bolt and I had the rifleman about 6-feet away from me point it out when some of the flash reached him...not a lot so he wasn't ******, but he sure noticed it. Riflemen typically fight in open order so it's not as bad as shoulder to shoulder, but it is still a problem. I, of course, pulled out my turn-screw and tightened my flashguard back up. Some reenactments have gone so far as to require that a flashguard be held in place with two screws or bolts, or at least 2 points of support to prevent that from happening.

Anyhow, it's simple to load regardless of whether you're loading direct from a powder horn (just don't do this!), from a powder measure, or from a pre-filled cartridge. It's also easy to clean as long as you clean it the day you use it. I can usually just wipe it clean with water or MAP and if I can't reach it easily, I have a bone-handled, boar-brushed toothbrush that I use for cleaning my lock, and it works for the flashguard too.
 
just a thought in flashguards, I see so many people putting WAY too much powder in the pan. Even guys who do videos (no, I am not busting on my friend @B P Maniac Shooter ). I’ve watched guys just fill the pan. The photos above… Lotsa powder 😯 perhaps, if one used less. Try that. Really. And then close the frizzen and tap the other side to move the powder away from the touch hole. Try that. Or don’t. What do I know?

At reenactments, you’re not going to get them to do away the rule about flash guards. Too many lawyers involved and the Aunt Mary pearl clutchers who worry and freak out at things. If they want to end direct combat or having native reenactors, do ya think they will stop on flash guards?
Speaking of using too much powder in a pan - try this:
• open you frizzen, lick your thumb, and on a clean pan wipe the pan with your moistened thumb
• power powder in the pan and close the pan. Give it a shake back and forth if you like.
• Now open the frizzen and turn the pan upside down to dump out the powder.
• look at the pan and you should see some granules of powder stuck to the pan.
• Close the pan; pull the cock back to full cock position; and fire it.

Went off didn't it?

Now do the same thing and turn it upside down to fire it.

Worked again didn't it.

I've forgotten who it was, but back in 2004 when I first came onboard here, I was having trouble getting my Traditions Pennsylvania Longrifle to fire. It has a very small lock and really does not like to cooperate if you fill it full. Not long after trying that myself I started only filling it half-full and it went off much more reliably. Down the road a piece, on another suggestion from a Forum member, after filling it half full, I'd close the pan and give a quick flick of my wrist to the right. When I opened the pan to look at that, I saw the powder was banked to the outside half of the pan leaving a blank space in between the powder and the touch hole. I gave it a try and it worked perfectly. The theory with banking the powder to the right was that it gives the flash immediate access and a clear path to the touch hole without having to burn a lot of powder to get to that opening. Using that technique with the small lock on my Traditions longrifle bore that out. In fact, after I learned that trick, I always used it and never again had a problem with a flash in the pan or a fuse effect from too much powder in the pan (pssssssst-BOOM). As long as I loaded it half-full and gave it that quick flick, that tiny pan on the Traditions longrifle worked great and reliably.

A few years later I bought an Early Lancaster rifle from a private builder here on the forum (screenname was "tg") and it uses an L&R Queen Anne lock. The pan on that is about 4 times the size of that pistol-sized lock that traditions uses on their longrifles. That lock doesn't care how much or how little powder I put in it, or whether I give the rifle that quick wrist-flip to position the powder to the far side of the pan. As long as I have a good flint, I just goes off every time. Doesn't care how much or how little powder I put in it, it just works (great lock)!

So, two points here:
1: It doesn't take nearly as much powder as you think it might to give you a good flash and consistent ignition of the main charge.

2: Different locks have different idiosyncrasies and you need to learn what your lock likes. Some are real picky and some just don't give a 💩 working fine with as little or as much as you want to feed it.
 
just a thought in flashguards, I see so many people putting WAY too much powder in the pan. Even guys who do videos (no, I am not busting on my friend @B P Maniac Shooter ). I’ve watched guys just fill the pan. The photos above… Lotsa powder 😯 perhaps, if one used less. Try that. Really. And then close the frizzen and tap the other side to move the powder away from the touch hole. Try that. Or don’t. What do I know?

At reenactments, you’re not going to get them to do away the rule about flash guards. Too many lawyers involved and the Aunt Mary pearl clutchers who worry and freak out at things. If they want to end direct combat or having native reenactors, do ya think they will stop on flash guards?

Flashguards were actually heavily used on German, Prussian and Austrian Muskets in the 18th and into the 19th centuries, definitely not a modern innovation.

The french had developed a very unique tube pan, which also acted as a pan cover and flash guard.

When the french designed the slanted brass pans on their 1777 models, they did so to direct the flash away and to also aid in priming by holding the musket vertical instead of parallel, this of course avoided them from hitting their neighbor in rank.
 
More prone to misfire and powder spillage reduce reliability. Typically a generic bolt on is not an improvement whether it's a musket or car. Other than that the NPS calls for FF powder in the pan with the flashguard installed. FF burns slower than FFFF and the pan will redirect sparks up and over a greater distance than FFFF with no flashguard installed increasing the safety distance required rather than decreasing as intended. Couple that with the added difficulty loading, increased possibility of dropped powder, and less reliability you can see why I disapprove.
I’ve never heard the National Park Service determining what granulation of powder to use!
I’ve been in Rev War reenacting about 35 years and this is news to me.
The SOLE purpose of a flash guard is to guard your file-mate on the right from getting splatted with burning powder. Period.
Installing one on a Bess or Charleville musket presents NO safety issues.
Frizzen covers are the second requirement.
As for loading, a flash guard presents no obstacle, at least for those with basic motor skills🤨
As for other shooting venues and public range rules, I can’t say.
 
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