Flintlock vs. Caplock accuracy

[Raider2000]

When I get the $$$ together to buy my first Flinter, it's going to be a Lyman GPR in Kit so that I can customize it as I go.

I've never owned a Flintlock but fired a few friends & like was mentioned, once you get past the FLASH of the priming powder, you're good to go.

 

[Trapper]

Be very careful..... Flinters are very habit forming!!!!!

 

[Many Klatch]

Moloch, Flinters are fun to shoot. I find that it takes me about a year of regular shooting to find what each gun likes. So don't be disappointed if you can't match the accuracy of your cap gun with the flinter right off. My flinters will all shoot better than I can hold them.

Make sure you start off wearing shooting glasses, that will help with the flinch a bit. Also practice with a "wooden flint" at home. Carve a piece of wood to the size of a flint and put it in the ****. Dry fire that way so that you get used to the idea that the gun won't hurt you. That should ease the problems of getting used to the flash. I don't even notice the flash anymore, but I did when I started.

Many Klatch

 

[mark/wi]

I have a cap and a flint GPR and like them both. Great rifles. Mark

 

[paulvallandigham]

Much of the " tuning " problems that flintlocks have are corrected JUST ONCE, and after that, you can forget about them, until you meet another new flintlock shooter having trouble with his lock! :rotf: I pick my powder charge before priming the pan, but then, I also check the nipple on my percussion gun for any crud clogging it, before I cap it. I therefore don't see much difference in loading procedures for the two kinds of guns. And I don't see any huge time delay between loading a flintlock or a percussion gun. I do know that surprises a lot of percussion rifle shooters- who have some idea that it takes two hours to load a flintlock, or some other such nonsense. I usually find several percussion shooters standing around the bench watching me load my rifle, and some ask questions about what I am doing, but I get more questions about " why I am not doing something they think I should be doing?" Its amazing the misinformation out there about flintlocks. :shocked2: :rotf: :hmm: :hatsoff:

 

[Raider2000]

Much of the " tuning " problems that flintlocks have are corrected JUST ONCE, and after that, you can forget about them, until you meet another new flintlock shooter having trouble with his lock! :rotf: I pick my powder charge before priming the pan, but then, I also check the nipple on my percussion gun for any crud clogging it, before I cap it. I therefore don't see much difference in loading procedures for the two kinds of guns. And I don't see any huge time delay between loading a flintlock or a percussion gun. I do know that surprises a lot of percussion rifle shooters- who have some idea that it takes two hours to load a flintlock, or some other such nonsense. I usually find several percussion shooters standing around the bench watching me load my rifle, and some ask questions about what I am doing, but I get more questions about " why I am not doing something they think I should be doing?" Its amazing the misinformation out there about flintlocks. :shocked2: :rotf: :hmm: :hatsoff:

Just this weekend I had a guy watch every move I made with my Lyman Trade Rifle "Percussion" as though I was doing something foreign but after the third shot he said "looks like you've done this before because it takes you no time to load that thing!"

So us side lock Muzzle loaders get a lot of that too from those who never used one including on occasion some who have only used those modern inlines with the mouse pelets.

 

[stumpmaker]

this is my first reply cause i just joined. and i might sound harsh i don`t mean to be.. but trying to shoot a prodution flintlock can be a real exersise in frusteration . But if you do get a prod. flinter get a good lock to put on it . A siler kit don`t cost much.

 

[PreglerD]

Hi moloch,

I would recommend a cap GPR, but I think the flintlocks of Investarm are a bit slow compared to others or even poor boy flinters from a kit. I made this expirience with my Investarm Hawken. The hammer went down pretty slowly.

Regards

Kirrmeister

 

[redwing]

You are so right on that one. I have seen many failures with the Lyman Flinters. The GPRs and Trade Guns in the Cap Locks can be and are often slow. The addition of a good lock will help these production rifles. :thumbsup:

 

[Tom Compton]

Basically there is no difference in accuracy with either ignition system.

That said, the flinters have a slight edge based on consistancy of muzzle velocity (see semisane's chrono numbers on pg 1). I do not see this a s a practical advantage but it is measurable.

As for priming charge making a difference, if the charge is over the touch hole, it will slow ignition.

Tho there are some crappy locks available, most can be reliable given proper attention to detail . . flint size and bevel orientation affect where in the arc and on the frizzen the strike occurs. DO NOT use fake powder. Prime with FFFFg. Wipe the face of the frizzen before each shot. Touch hole minimum of 1/16", etc.

Enjoy
TC

 

[Mike Brooks]

If I were looking for accuracy in a flintlock I wouldn't choose either of those rifles. If you want a truly accurate rifle you'll have to find somebody to build you one. I'd also recommend the builder is highly experienced with flintlocks, preferably someone who has built rifles for people that shoot in competition and win.

 

[Old Charlie]

Drill the flash hole out to 1/16 inch and use real black powder and you will have no problems.
The other stuff just will not work in a flintlock.You must have real black powder.
Old Charlie

 

[2172]

In our club's Western Carolina Offhand Championships, we finally stopped having separate classes for flint vs percussion...the flint shooters frequently outscored the perc. Hank

 

[musketman]

I've heard that the priming powder causes rather big differences in velocity because its not as consistent as the priming in a cap.

Most black powder, unless wet or damp will burn at a consistant rate per its granulation, so there should be no noticable difference between the velocity of the two systems. At least not enough to detect without a coronagraph.

Now if the flash hole is too large, then yes, more gas will escape and muzzle velocity will suffer. Not to mention that the jet of hot gas will be greater to the side.

 

[Moloch]

Hmm, the lyman locks are on the slow side?

I carefully read every opinion and seems that a caplock seems to be a better fit for me.
One reason is that many said that it takes a lot of time to tune and get used to a flintlock. I can only shoot my rifles twice a month so I think it would take me pretty long to get used to a new ignition system. Especially a picky one. I took me a year and a half to get used to muzzleloading, I dont think I can spend another year to get used to flints.

If you dont mind I have another small question:

The Lyman GPR has a (sorry, I am a metric guy) 4.5 millimeter (.170?)nipple, is it just me or would it be better to have a musket cap for igniting powder charges in the 80-grain area?
I have only rifles which use musket caps and never had a single hangfire with them, I love the extra power musket caps have-. If the barrel is dirty and burned powder is blocking the channel the musket caps blows through the dirt no matter how much of it blocks the channel. :grin:

I also have rather big hands and I have troubles getting small caps on the nipple.
Is there a nipple for musket caps with a Lyman GPR-thread?
Would the hammer of the GPR iginite them?

Big thanks to all of you! :bow:

 

[musketman]

If you dont mind I have another small question:

The Lyman GPR has a (sorry, I am a metric guy) 4.5 millimeter (.170?)nipple, is it just me or would it be better to have a musket cap for igniting powder charges in the 80-grain area?

Not sure if they make a musket cap nipple for a GPR, but any machinist could do the job on a lathe. If you go that route, check the face of the hammer on the percussion GPR to make sure a musket cap will fit into it's recessed area, it not the hammer's face will need reamed to accommodate the larger diameter cap.

 

[Raider2000]

If the GPR's hammer is the same as the TR's then a Musket cap will fit under the hammer & TOTW has cones for Musket Caps for the Lyman Investarms rifles.

My friends Flinter GPR fired perfectly when he had it out at the range a few weeks ago & I'm sure that he hasn't modified it any.

 

[Freedom]

IMO you will never find another gun that is more fun or rewarding to shoot than a flinter!...Here's your 1288th..SO mouch more FUN than a cap gun :thumbsup: !!

I have a Pedersoli Jeager 54 and out of the 100 or so guns I have this is the rifle I shoot most, it just fits, I use and abuse it and it has held up fine. It shoots REAL's, Maxi's and PRB all real well. It's a little slow when dirty(it's always dirty) but it has done more for my shooting than ANY other gun I've ever shot. :hatsoff:

 

[Moloch]

@ Freedom,

I would really love to have a flinter in .54, but some people here said that the Lyman GPR is a bit slow in flint and it takes a lot of practice to get a good ignition with a flintlock. I cannot practice much with it (twice a MONTH), I think I would get frustrated pretty fast, bad ignition and no time to fix it dont mix very well.

With a percussion ignition it may not be the traditional challenge I desire but I wont get frustrated as I am used to caplocks. Flintlocks seem to need time, and I have none.

I am young and have to work like a slave for my money 6 days a week, 45 years and I'll get my retirement pay. Still a long long way... :barf:

 

[bajabuc]

Here we go again. I'm really attached to the Uberti SantaFe Hawken...but they haven't made it in 20 years...but....just maybe...you can find one where you're at. Sometimes gunsmiths have on tucked away or maybe you can find a boxed kit. Otherwise...I have a .54 GPR...if it just had an angled patent breech it would be perfect. I shoot 70 grains 3f with a .535 round ball and 100 % cotton pillow ticking. Mine's a flinter...all my guns are flinters. Flint gives the game a sporting chance.