half cock after firing?

[bigstick6017555]

Sometimes discussing what is safe can get into the weeds as bad as how to clean a gun. Whenever handling a firearm I am always trying to keep safe handling in the back of my mind, and obey the range rules where ever shooting. I have always heard that a cap lock with out a cap is considered unloaded. Now that may be true but I know a lot of people who, in their eyes do not agree, as long as there is powder and lead in the tube they consider it loaded. Nothing wrong for questioning safety.

 

[Grenadier1758]

@dave951, There are those that do not wipe the bore before loading the next round. The wiping is done with the wet patched round ball, but they do believe that there should be some moisture applied to the barrel to soften fouling. There is also the belief that blowing down the barrel looks cool and it has been mentioned as a historical practice which is not one I care to follow.

 

[Barry Strickland]

I think Grenadier has given the various reasons for the different procedures.
There is some clarification needed for the different types of shooting between the NSSA & NMLRA competitions.
I am a member of both organizations.
Keep in mind that in the NSSA competitions you are loading and firing as fast as you can to break the targets. The mini ball has a windage clearance when loading and will load with the weight of the ramrod or a very slight push with the fingers on the rod. It is in the rules to leave the hammer down on the fired cap when loading.
In the NMLRA competitions you generally have a half hour to put in five shots and it is suggested you wipe the bore between shots. When using a patched round ball the hammer needs to be at half cock to resist the air pressure build up in the barrel when loading. There is nothing in the rules that states the hammer should be down on the fired cap.
In the shotgun competition you are required to remove the spent cap before leaving the shooting station.
I should note that it is against the NMLRA rules to blow down the barrel with your head exposed in front of the muzzle but you can use a blow tube for that function.
Barry

 

[TFoley]

Riddle me this. If you're doing wiping with a damp patch and get some smoke out the vent and hear a whoosh of air, then why pray tell are you putting your oral orifice on the muzzle to put positive atmospheric pressure inside the bore?

Well, for me it's that great taste it leaves on the lips. Can't be beat - my take only, of course.

 

[Griz44Mag]

When I am at the range just plinking or shooting percussions, I always half cock, remove the cap and then wipe the barrel.
I am in no hurry and if the cock is at half, running a damp patch will eject a stream of smoke from the barrel.
When I see this, I know for certain the nipple is and breech are clear and there is no need to prick to get a clear priming pathway.
When I will be loading without wiping - I cup my hand around the barrel leaving the palm side open - and blow into the barrel - watching the nipple for smoke exiting - for the same reason.
I have never had any issues.

 

[tenngun]

Thank you, @Grenadier1758, for taking the time to share your thorough response.

As I initially noted, I now own my first muzzleloading rifle, and I have not even fired it yet, as I want to do plenty of research beforehand so I eventually fire it correctly and safely. This is quite the learning process for me!

I sincerely apologize, hat in hand, if I have ruffled any feathers in my quest for knowledge here.

Only way you can learn. If you can find a club and get with them at least for your first few outings

 

[tenngun]

Riddle me this. If you're doing wiping with a damp patch and get some smoke out the vent and hear a whoosh of air, then why pray tell are you putting your oral orifice on the muzzle to put positive atmospheric pressure inside the bore?

I don’t want to start a blowing down the bore fight. I think that’s run on for a page or two in the past. The result was people that do do and them that don’t don’t and all have fun.
It is historic so I keep it up, but can give you no logical reason. I do it righ after the shot before I run a patch, and the patch would do the same
It’s how I learned near fifty years ago,
Like three cuts in a pie crust, one to let out steam and two cause mama did it that way.

 

[dave951]

Since you're shooting a minie gun, I'd recommend somebody with the N-SSA. PRB guys generally revert to PRB techniques

 

[hrt4me]

Since you're shooting a minie gun, I'd recommend somebody with the N-SSA. PRB guys generally revert to PRB techniques

I do not necessarily have to fire a minie, though, do I ?
And I have read (and maybe watched via a few YT videos) that minie are not necessarily that much more accurate than a PRB...?

 

[dave951]

I do not necessarily have to fire a minie, though, do I ?
And I have read (and maybe watched via a few YT videos) that minie are not necessarily that much more accurate than a PRB...?

Okey dokey. Both my competition musket and carbine are sub2moa guns. That is one ragged hole at 50yd and 2in at 100yd. Got pix to back it up.

 

[ord sgt]

Leave the spent cap ON with hammer DOWN

That is THE BEST advice that you can get. N-SSA has cleared many thousand firearms from the firing line in all of the years of holding National and regional shoots.

 

[TFoley]

I do not necessarily have to fire a minie, though, do I ? And I have read (and maybe watched via a few YT videos) that minie are not necessarily that much more accurate than a PRB...?

Tell you what, sir, you shoot your PRB alongside me with my Minie-shooting rifle at 600 yards and we'll see for certain. Back in 1845, at the Battle of Inkerman in the Crimea, a British lieutenant and a few of his fellow Rifle Brigade soldiers wiped a Russian artillery battery off the face of the earth at about a thousand yards - the survivors scarpered.

 

[NorthFork]

Riddle me this. If you're doing wiping with a damp patch and get some smoke out the vent and hear a whoosh of air, then why pray tell are you putting your oral orifice on the muzzle to put positive atmospheric pressure inside the bore?

I don't wipe between shots. I blow down the barrel after the shot to #1 ensure that any embers are burnt out by the influx of fresh air, #2 soften the fouling a bit, and #3 ensure that the nipple/touch hole is clear. I've just shot. There is nothing in the barrel but smoke. There is no danger.

 

[M. De Land]

I have never before owned a muzzle loading rifle, but now I have my first: a .58 caliber muzzleloading 1863 Remington (Miroku Zouave). I have not yet fired it, but I noticed on some YouTube videos that upon firing a rifle, some shooters immediately cock their hammer to half cock before doing anything else.

Is this necessary? And if so, then why? What is the rationale behind this specific step?

I think it is a hold over maneuver folks pick up from an actual necessary step when operating a cartridge Sharps rifle. If you drop the breech block on a Sharps before moving the hammer back to half cock it will eventually break the firing pin. It may have been true with percussion Sharps as well that had a gas ring on the breech block but I don't know for sure about that.

 

[NorthFork]

I should add that I always go to half cock after the shot irregardless of flint vs percussion. It's how I was taught as a small lad and this ensures that the nipple can pass smoke when I blow down the barrel. It's also a bit of a bear to shove down a tight fitting ball/patch with the hammer down on the nipple. A bit of pressure can build.

Edit- I should add with all this talk of blowing down barrels, only do so if you have just shot AND the gun recoils normally. This way there can no danger of sticking your ugly mug in front of a live charge.

 

[Rickf1985]

Well, I have to say that as another new cap and ball shooter I was quite interested to see what this thread had to say so I could learn something from it. All I learned is that nobody seems to agree on the proper procedure. I also learned there is a fair bit of discontent between the US and Hungarian shooter? Maybe not but it certainly sounds that way from the back and forth here. This is my first foray into the forums on this site other than to introduce myself on that thread and I am curious if this is how it is all the time or did I just happen to pick a rough starting point?

 

[tenngun]

I do not necessarily have to fire a minie, though, do I ?
And I have read (and maybe watched via a few YT videos) that minie are not necessarily that much more accurate than a PRB...?

In range about the same or ball a smig better, but range is more limited

 

[Griz44Mag]

Like three cuts in a pie crust, one to let out steam and two cause mama did it that way.

That by itself is good enough for me. Grandma always knew the right thing to say and do - did not matter what the subject was.

 

[dave951]

Well, I have to say that as another new cap and ball shooter I was quite interested to see what this thread had to say so I could learn something from it. All I learned is that nobody seems to agree on the proper procedure. I also learned there is a fair bit of discontent between the US and Hungarian shooter? Maybe not but it certainly sounds that way from the back and forth here. This is my first foray into the forums on this site other than to introduce myself on that thread and I am curious if this is how it is all the time or did I just happen to pick a rough starting point?

I think what you’re seeing is guys shooting a wide range of types of guns that even in their day, had different procedures. The military musket operates differently from a Fowler from a long rifle. The “cap and ball” era spanned a couple hundred years of changes to the tech and how it was used.

 

[Crow-Feather]

I have never before owned a muzzle loading rifle, but now I have my first: a .58 caliber muzzleloading 1863 Remington (Miroku Zouave). I have not yet fired it, but I noticed on some YouTube videos that upon firing a rifle, some shooters immediately cock their hammer to half cock before doing anything else.

Is this necessary? And if so, then why? What is the rationale behind this specific step?

I will not break in on the safety issue, it was extremely well covered. My guess is that with the hammer down blocking escaping air, it becomes difficult to put a patched ball down the bore.