I was just doing a web search looking for a rifle i'd seen featured in some magazine probably 20 or 25 years ago . It was a Hatfield flintlock with a real nice curly maple stock . I found the story of Ted Hatfield , the gunmaker , found a story where he went out of business and then found a story where he started a new business , Austin & Halleck . On the website it looks like the bread and butter are inlines but they do offer flintlock and percussion rifles that look real nice . Looking real nice is all i know about them . I'd sure like to hear some opinions .
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Hatfield - Austin & Halleck
- Thread starter atr
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You must be talking about something like the gun in this picture?
I found it in this post:
OLD AUSTIN POST
Another post about them:
Austin & Halleck Post
They have an ad in this months Muzzle Blasts. Says the price is starting at $539.
Their Website is www.austinhalleck.com
And yes, the front sight is installed backwards. Nice looking gun anyway if you ask me.
I found it in this post:
OLD AUSTIN POST
Another post about them:
Austin & Halleck Post
They have an ad in this months Muzzle Blasts. Says the price is starting at $539.
Their Website is www.austinhalleck.com
And yes, the front sight is installed backwards. Nice looking gun anyway if you ask me.
Zonie , i searched before posting but i couldn't find anything like what you found . I appreciate it . How big of a deal does anyone think the single wedge is ? The select model on thier website in a right hand flinter with that very nice stock is a shade under $800.00 . I don't possess the tools or skills so building one is out of the question but i don't want to base any decision on looks alone , even though i love that stock . Opinions , opinions , wherefore art thou , opinions ?
TwoShadows
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:imo
ropping $800 for a rifle from somewhere that goes in and out of business under another name from time to time dont sound like a sound investment to me. Putting a couple hundred with it and getting an "in the white" quality gun from someone like Tip Curtis....or TVM...or Track of the Wolf...seems much more feasable to me. Top quality parts from a reliable dealer that stays in business over the years is a safer way to spend my money. Most of these "in the white" guns are ready to shoot as they come to you and the finish is entirely up to you....if you tire of such a rifle, it is still worth the original price a couple of years down the road unless you use it for an anchor or scotchblock for your truck. :thumbsup:
ropping $800 for a rifle from somewhere that goes in and out of business under another name from time to time dont sound like a sound investment to me. Putting a couple hundred with it and getting an "in the white" quality gun from someone like Tip Curtis....or TVM...or Track of the Wolf...seems much more feasable to me. Top quality parts from a reliable dealer that stays in business over the years is a safer way to spend my money. Most of these "in the white" guns are ready to shoot as they come to you and the finish is entirely up to you....if you tire of such a rifle, it is still worth the original price a couple of years down the road unless you use it for an anchor or scotchblock for your truck. :thumbsup:
RussB
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:imo
TwoShadows......are you saying that is what has happened to Austin & Halleck? I though so much of the pictures that was posted that I went to the web site and kinda looked things over. I am seriously thinking about their "Fancy Flinter". But, if what you are saying is true, then I have to re-think this.
Would love to hear from others too, on their thinking on this. Stumpkiller, Musketman, Daryl, Maxi, Zonie, anyone?
Speak up man! I done went and told ya, I'm a poh boy, so say sumptin, before I become poh'er.
Russ
I do believe it's true that A&H has come and gone at least once since the 90's. But I don't know the reasons behind that. A&H Customer Feedback
I came up with an e-mail of someone in Customer Service. [email protected] I would send an e-mail asking what the current warranty and customer service policy is. You should get a feel for company atmosphere from how they respond to you and how they treat such a request. Because a company has a financial problem is not necessarily due to a faulty product. Could be they didn't charge ENOUGH for the labor and materials they put into it.
If you like, I'll fire off an e-mail and see what I get back in response.
Who's to say T/C might not discontinue sidelocks next week? Life is a crapshoot. If you like the rifle (I like that rifle - maple stocks, a real roundball twist, silver front sight, made in the USA) you'll have to decide whether potential future events outweight the present. Who guarantees any custom made rifles beyond the life of the gunsmith?
Follow your heart, Russ.
I came up with an e-mail of someone in Customer Service. [email protected] I would send an e-mail asking what the current warranty and customer service policy is. You should get a feel for company atmosphere from how they respond to you and how they treat such a request. Because a company has a financial problem is not necessarily due to a faulty product. Could be they didn't charge ENOUGH for the labor and materials they put into it.
If you like, I'll fire off an e-mail and see what I get back in response.
Who's to say T/C might not discontinue sidelocks next week? Life is a crapshoot. If you like the rifle (I like that rifle - maple stocks, a real roundball twist, silver front sight, made in the USA) you'll have to decide whether potential future events outweight the present. Who guarantees any custom made rifles beyond the life of the gunsmith?
Follow your heart, Russ.
Austin & Halleck's main product are In Lines. They make some of the most beautiful inlines I've seen, and I was sorely tempted to buy one once. Beautiful wood, checkering and a modern adjustable target trigger.
I didn't because I didn't like the idea of having to spend as much per shot as I do with my .25-06.
OK, I'll quit talking about In-Lines.
Getting back to sidelocks:
As was said, who knows if a company will be in business a year from now? We do know they have been around (in one form or another) for a few years now.
Hatfield on the other hand is gone.
If I were thinking about buying their Plains style, I don't think I would go for the high priced stock. I am into HC (Historically Correct) enough that the plainer stock would suit me.
There are very few Plains rifles with Curly Maple wood.
Most of the Hawkins were made with Straight grained Maple.
As for the single barrel wedge, Leman and Tryon both made this style of barrel retention in the 1800s (based on photos in some of my reference books).
The only real advantage I can see with having two wedges is if you loose one, you still have one so your gun is not out of action. I don't know that the modern shooter cares much about this, but the Trappers might have.
I don't know if the A&H wedge is "retained" with a slot and a "thru" pin or not. My Pedersoli Tryon uses this feature so it is impossible to loose the wedges.
I might consider paying somewhere in the low to mid $600 for one, but I don't think one would be worth $800+ to me.
Of course, we each have our desires and our spending limits.
If you don't mind the price, I'm not going to say your wrong.
I didn't because I didn't like the idea of having to spend as much per shot as I do with my .25-06.
OK, I'll quit talking about In-Lines.
Getting back to sidelocks:
As was said, who knows if a company will be in business a year from now? We do know they have been around (in one form or another) for a few years now.
Hatfield on the other hand is gone.
If I were thinking about buying their Plains style, I don't think I would go for the high priced stock. I am into HC (Historically Correct) enough that the plainer stock would suit me.
There are very few Plains rifles with Curly Maple wood.
Most of the Hawkins were made with Straight grained Maple.
As for the single barrel wedge, Leman and Tryon both made this style of barrel retention in the 1800s (based on photos in some of my reference books).
The only real advantage I can see with having two wedges is if you loose one, you still have one so your gun is not out of action. I don't know that the modern shooter cares much about this, but the Trappers might have.
I don't know if the A&H wedge is "retained" with a slot and a "thru" pin or not. My Pedersoli Tryon uses this feature so it is impossible to loose the wedges.
I might consider paying somewhere in the low to mid $600 for one, but I don't think one would be worth $800+ to me.
Of course, we each have our desires and our spending limits.
If you don't mind the price, I'm not going to say your wrong.
RussB
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Stumpkiller......"If you like, I'll fire off an e-mail and see what I get back in response."
Why don't you do that?....And post what they have to say.
I'm sure everyone is right about warranty, and customer service. Try as hard as they might, there is no way they could possibly please everybody. And, although they have a beautiful product, it's functioning could be crappy, and one would be stuck with no recourse.
I wish someone who owned one would chime in here.
However, the thought of a Bankruptcy, Ownership change, God knows what, WHILE they have your money and haven't shipped, is probably unfounded but can't be overlooked. (Same as any other company)
I discussed this with the War Department, and she jumped right in with a reminder of the few things that have happen in last four decades together. She doesn't understand how I could possibly be thinking of this after being warned. Perhaps she's right, but that gun could be the closest thing to a semi-custom I ever end up with.
Sorry I got long winded on this, but my thoughts seem to wander a bit while thinking about it. AND I'VE BEEN THINKING A LOT!
Where is atr.....the original poster? What are you thinking? Are you concerned?......Speak up, let's hash this out. My own thoughts have been biased, just from a picture.
I saw a picture of Marlin Monroe once, and I don't think it had near the effect on me as this stupid rifle.
Perhaps "waiting" is the name of the game at this point???
Respectfully, Russ
Why don't you do that?....And post what they have to say.
I'm sure everyone is right about warranty, and customer service. Try as hard as they might, there is no way they could possibly please everybody. And, although they have a beautiful product, it's functioning could be crappy, and one would be stuck with no recourse.
I wish someone who owned one would chime in here.
However, the thought of a Bankruptcy, Ownership change, God knows what, WHILE they have your money and haven't shipped, is probably unfounded but can't be overlooked. (Same as any other company)
I discussed this with the War Department, and she jumped right in with a reminder of the few things that have happen in last four decades together. She doesn't understand how I could possibly be thinking of this after being warned. Perhaps she's right, but that gun could be the closest thing to a semi-custom I ever end up with.
Sorry I got long winded on this, but my thoughts seem to wander a bit while thinking about it. AND I'VE BEEN THINKING A LOT!
Where is atr.....the original poster? What are you thinking? Are you concerned?......Speak up, let's hash this out. My own thoughts have been biased, just from a picture.
I saw a picture of Marlin Monroe once, and I don't think it had near the effect on me as this stupid rifle.
Perhaps "waiting" is the name of the game at this point???
Respectfully, Russ
I just fired off the following e-mail.
To: Ray Crow, A&H Customer Service Manager
Ray,
I found your e-mail address on the A&H website. My name is Charlie Pearsall and I am the Flintlock section moderator on the Muzzleloading Forum (www.muzzleloadingforum.com). Recently, a member posted an inquiry into the A&H line - specifically the Flintlock Mountain Rifles - and there were a few posts warning of problems in the past history of A&H. Here is the URL of that thread.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=26867&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=186&fpart=1#Post27126
The Mountain Rifles, especially the Fancy & Select options, represent a sizeable investment to a new M/L shooter. I certainly appreciate my poster's concern that his bankroll allows only one such investment, and he doesn't want to be orphaned with a rifle from a spectral company that comes and goes; and also begs the question of "is it a quality issue that caused the older entities to dissolve?"
In the interest of fair play I volunteered to approach you and get the facts, instead of allowing the speculations to continue. Specifically:
recent history of the company, warranty concerns, quality concerns and the concerns of an ongoing business under your current organization.
It pleases me to no end that A&H has taken the effort to produce a respectably authentic version of a plains rifle: in flintlock, maple stock and with a round ball twist. I will post you reply to the forum
Thank you very much,
Charlie Pearsall
Muzzleloading Forum (www.muzzleloadingforum.com)
Flintlock, Traditional Hunting & Shooting Accessories Moderator
To: Ray Crow, A&H Customer Service Manager
Ray,
I found your e-mail address on the A&H website. My name is Charlie Pearsall and I am the Flintlock section moderator on the Muzzleloading Forum (www.muzzleloadingforum.com). Recently, a member posted an inquiry into the A&H line - specifically the Flintlock Mountain Rifles - and there were a few posts warning of problems in the past history of A&H. Here is the URL of that thread.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=26867&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=186&fpart=1#Post27126
The Mountain Rifles, especially the Fancy & Select options, represent a sizeable investment to a new M/L shooter. I certainly appreciate my poster's concern that his bankroll allows only one such investment, and he doesn't want to be orphaned with a rifle from a spectral company that comes and goes; and also begs the question of "is it a quality issue that caused the older entities to dissolve?"
In the interest of fair play I volunteered to approach you and get the facts, instead of allowing the speculations to continue. Specifically:
recent history of the company, warranty concerns, quality concerns and the concerns of an ongoing business under your current organization.
It pleases me to no end that A&H has taken the effort to produce a respectably authentic version of a plains rifle: in flintlock, maple stock and with a round ball twist. I will post you reply to the forum
Thank you very much,
Charlie Pearsall
Muzzleloading Forum (www.muzzleloadingforum.com)
Flintlock, Traditional Hunting & Shooting Accessories Moderator
RussB , I first read about Hatfield rifles probably 20 years ago , maybe more . Can't remember the publication but the review that the rifle recieved was terrific . Fit , finish and accuracy were outstanding and it was beautiful with that curly maple stock . I just filed it away in the back recesses of my mind knowing that i could never afford a high end custom rifle like that . Over the last few years i've seen a few of them on gunsamerica and[url] gunbroker.com[/url] but out of my price range . I recently went searching for them and found out about Ted Hatfield forming his new company which is called Austin & Halleck . The flintlock rifles are half the price that they were 20 years ago but they've went from custom to semi-custom . When Hatfield was making Hatfield rifles he buried himself in debt with the notion of mass producing and trying to run with the big boys . Hatfield went under . Now under the Austin & Halleck name he is producing high end inlines but his flintlocks aren't totally custom anymore . The barrels are made in Spain . An item of interest is the new 2nd edition of Lymans Black Powder Handbook and Loading Manual written by Sam Fadala . On page 42 Sam refers to semi-custom rifles and in particular refers to the Austin & Halleck Mountain rifle as being mainly handbuilt with original classic lines . It's the only semi-custom that Sam refers to .
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atr
I own 3 Hatfields, two .50's and a .54, all percussion rifles. They are fine rifles and always attract attention at the shooting range, mostly due to the stocks, which all have the beautiful tiger striped maple. However they are not as accurate as my Austin & Halleck flintlock which I have had less than a year now.
I got the Austin & Halleck off a guy at Gunbroker for 300.00 dollars. If your not in a hurry to get the rifle, you should keep your eye on both Gunbroker and Auctionarms, The A&H is a very good rifle, but not in my opinion almost 600.00 dollars good.
I'm still looking for a Hatfield flintlock.I missed the last one I saw, A .36 cal on Gunsamerica for 800.00 dollars.I thought that was a little high for that rifle.
I own 3 Hatfields, two .50's and a .54, all percussion rifles. They are fine rifles and always attract attention at the shooting range, mostly due to the stocks, which all have the beautiful tiger striped maple. However they are not as accurate as my Austin & Halleck flintlock which I have had less than a year now.
I got the Austin & Halleck off a guy at Gunbroker for 300.00 dollars. If your not in a hurry to get the rifle, you should keep your eye on both Gunbroker and Auctionarms, The A&H is a very good rifle, but not in my opinion almost 600.00 dollars good.
I'm still looking for a Hatfield flintlock.I missed the last one I saw, A .36 cal on Gunsamerica for 800.00 dollars.I thought that was a little high for that rifle.
I got a response from A&H - printed here in its entirety:
RussB
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Thanks Stumpkiller, mighty kind of you to take on the task. I don't want to even try to read between the lines of what was said. I'll just take it as what it said, and kinda sleep on it for a while. Albeit, it seems VERY up-front to me. Who knows, one may just come my way at an affordable price.
Thanks again,
Russ
Thanks again,
Russ
Sorry about posting in the flint section but I just got my A&H mountain
Today... It's only a perc.. but I'm pretty happy with it.
Haven't shot her yet but if looks are any indication she'll put them where
I aim. fit and finish are all better than average blows my sons GPR out of the water if that helps.. and my sight is on right.. I'll be in this section alot in the future as I am going to have a flinter built as soon as I can decide on all the particulars... hope this was some help oh ya I got mine through ctico and price wasn't that bad..639 shipped with a hand select
stock... :thumbsup:
Today... It's only a perc.. but I'm pretty happy with it.
Haven't shot her yet but if looks are any indication she'll put them where
I aim. fit and finish are all better than average blows my sons GPR out of the water if that helps.. and my sight is on right.. I'll be in this section alot in the future as I am going to have a flinter built as soon as I can decide on all the particulars... hope this was some help oh ya I got mine through ctico and price wasn't that bad..639 shipped with a hand select
stock... :thumbsup:
