Historical 2-Pistol Carry?

[Kmcmichael]

Although much later both Frank Hamer and Jimmy Cirillo both regularly carried 2 handguns. Both of these individuals had many more armed encounters than those fellows mentioned.

 

[Mad L]

Although much earlier (flintlock) it was commonly called "A Brace of Pistols" (two pistol).

 

[Stantheman86]

Although much later both Frank Hamer and Jimmy Cirillo both regularly carried 2 handguns. Both of these individuals had many more armed encounters than those fellows mentioned.

Jim Cirillo was a huge fan of the NY Reload.

Skeeter Skelton says he carried a pair of revolvers when he was a lawman and that was what, the 1940's - 50's?

 

[toot]

if one is good then two are better. sorta like taking pill's.

 

[toot]

a BRACE, wasn't that refering to the two pistols that were carried on either side of the saddle? a BRACE of horse pistols!

 

[Dave James]

Was in the LEO field from the late 60s to 05, barring court time,carried 2 to 3 handguns ,not much like the older days in they were main,backup and last ditch

 

[Stantheman86]

I recall reading Custer was carrying an Irish Constabulary 455 on that sunny June day...

I'd never heard that, it makes sense though.

 

[Mad L]

a BRACE, wasn't that refering to the two pistols that were carried on either side of the saddle? a BRACE of horse pistols!

I had always heard that as being a "Pomel Holster" and "bucket holster", I suppose may have been referred to as a "Brace".
My first hearing of a "Brace of Pistol" refered to sea goers who carried two and used as far perhaps as the 16/1500s. I have actually never heard it used for cartridge pistols. But sure if historical document stated such or just later authors speaking to old days such as with the term "longhunter".

 

[Notchy Bob]

But did anyone in history ever actually carry two percussion revolvers on their belt? I know cavalry carried two pistol but in saddle holsters. I imagine a Navy or Army sized pistol would be the best choice. I can see the benefits in the percussion era as reloads were extremely slow even using paper cartridges. I just haven’t been able to find many historical examples that this was every actually done in primary documentation and it seems like more of a modern movie Western trope at this point.

@Smokey Plainsman ,

The short answer is "yes."

This is John C. Cremony (1815-1879). He served with the 2nd Regiment, California Volunteer Cavalry, and may be best known for his book, Life Among the Apaches.

He was a real frontiersman, and the book is a fascinating read, as well as primary documentation. This is from page 23:

Note the date of 1850 in the first sentence, and at the bottom of the page reference to "...two belt and two holster six-shooters..." He refers to them again on page 65, as "...my four six-shooters, two of which were in my belt, and two in my holsters":

Captain Randolph Marcy, in his equally interesting and probably better known book, The Prairie Traveler (published in 1859), also mentioned revolvers in the belt (page 165):

He did say "pistols," but the general discussion on that and the preceding and subsequent pages made it clear he was discussing revolvers.

Another reference is from James F. Meline's Two Thousand Miles on Horseback: Kansas to Santa Fe in 1866 (p.14), where he described "...a hard-looking customer, on a California saddle, with a pair of pistols in his belt."

So, there is plenty of documentation of early frontiersmen carrying two percussion revolvers in the belt. In Cremony's case, he distinguishes the six-shooters in the belt from the two in holsters. This infers, to me, that in the 1850's "holsters" probably meant pommel holsters, carried on the saddle. Pistols "in the belt" were probably quite literally stuck in the belt at that time. In Rattenbury's Packing Iron: Gunleather of the Frontier West, we find that the Colt 1851 Navy revolver was adopted by the US military for mounted troops in 1855, and "Writing in 1856, George B. McClellan, then a captain with the First US Cavalry and recently an observer of the Crimean War, remarked, 'For my own regiment, armed with revolvers, there need be no [pommel] holster, for the men should follow the Russian system and always carry the pistol on the waist belt.'" (p.18). Subsequently, the American military began developing holsters for the belt, although I believe the cavalrymen of that time only carried one revolver. Regarding holsters for civilian use, I guess more research is needed. That famous photograph of Bill Hickok, shown above, appears to show the revolvers just stuck in his belt. Who is to say, though, if that was his customary mode of carry, at that relatively late date, or if it was just for the photo.

Something was said about cylinder-swapping for fast reloads. Cremony described reloading his revolver during a fire-fight, after he had emptied out all of his guns:

However, in Commerce of the Prairies, describing events between 1831 and 1839, Josiah Gregg made this intriguing statement:

He and his brother each had two revolvers and a repeating (revolving) rifle, but they each had "...thirty-six ready-loaded shots apiece." I don't see how they could manage that unless they had spare, pre-loaded cylinders. The rifle must have been the Colt Paterson M1838 Ring-Lever Rifle:

It is my understanding that the Paterson revolvers (handguns) were five-shooters, but the first model of this revolving ring-lever rifle held eight rounds. So the math adds up correctly, two five-shot revolvers plus one eight-shot revolving rifle = eighteen shots. Spare, loaded cylinders for all three would bring the total to 36.

So, we do have ample documentation of people on the frontier carrying two percussion revolvers on the belt. We don't know when they started carrying them in belt holsters, though, as opposed to just being stuck under the belt or sash, and I haven't found any statement that explicitly described "cylinder swapping," although Josiah Gregg's account implies it.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[Jim Wag]

Hi Notchy Bob

How did the confrontation between
Cremony and the Apache
Turn out?

Jim in La Luz

 

[Grenadier1758]

Cremony wrote about it.

 

[nightwolf1974]

And Josie had him a couple more as I remember

He carried 4.....2x Walkers, 1x 1860 Army, 1x 1849 Pocket Model.

 

[Notchy Bob]

How did the confrontation between
Cremony and the Apache
Turn out?

Jim in La Luz

Cremony devoted about three pages to a detailed description of the event. He didn't have time to finish loading his revolver before the Apache man was on him with a knife. The fight turned into a very intense hand-to-hand struggle with blades. It got pretty gritty. Cremony was down, but managed to dodge what would have been a fatal stab wound, and inflict one of his own. Cremony lived to tell about it, but the other fellow did not.

Here is a link to the book, which is available in its entirety online, for free: Life Among the Apaches

That particular episode is on pages 132-135, but the whole book is worth reading, for folks like us.

One thing that's really cool about Books Google (which supports that particular book and a ton of others) is the search function. If you go to that link and look in the center of the toolbar just above the digitized book, you'll see a box that says "Search in this book." Type in a word that interests you, like "six-shooter" or "mule" or "rifle" and it will search the entire book in a couple of seconds and show you every time that word occurs in the text, with a link to that page. It is sensitive to spelling, though, and if you are looking for something in particular, try alternate spellings.

I just typed "turkey" in the Search box and got five hits within the book. Evidently, Cremony and his Apache acquaintances were all fond of turkey hunting, and New Mexico was a good place to hunt them back then. Who knew? That may be of interest to blackpowder shooters and history buffs who like to hunt those birds now. Do we know anybody like that?

Now, back to six-shooters...

Notchy Bob

 

[Howard Pippin]

Cremony devoted about three pages to a detailed description of the event. He didn't have time to finish loading his revolver before the Apache man was on him with a knife. The fight turned into a very intense hand-to-hand struggle with blades. It got pretty gritty. Cremony was down, but managed to dodge what would have been a fatal stab wound, and inflict one of his own. Cremony lived to tell about it, but the other fellow did not.

Here is a link to the book, which is available in its entirety online, for free: Life Among the Apaches

That particular episode is on pages 132-135, but the whole book is worth reading, for folks like us.

One thing that's really cool about Books Google (which supports that particular book and a ton of others) is the search function. If you go to that link and look in the center of the toolbar just above the digitized book, you'll see a box that says "Search in this book." Type in a word that interests you, like "six-shooter" or "mule" or "rifle" and it will search the entire book in a couple of seconds and show you every time that word occurs in the text, with a link to that page. It is sensitive to spelling, though, and if you are looking for something in particular, try alternate spellings.

I just typed "turkey" in the Search box and got five hits within the book. Evidently, Cremony and his Apache acquaintances were all fond of turkey hunting, and New Mexico was a good place to hunt them back then. Who knew? That may be of interest to blackpowder shooters and history buffs who like to hunt those birds now. Do we know anybody like that?

Now, back to six-shooters...

Notchy Bob

Cremony devoted about three pages to a detailed description of the event. He didn't have time to finish loading his revolver before the Apache man was on him with a knife. The fight turned into a very intense hand-to-hand struggle with blades. It got pretty gritty. Cremony was down, but managed to dodge what would have been a fatal stab wound, and inflict one of his own. Cremony lived to tell about it, but the other fellow did not.

Here is a link to the book, which is available in its entirety online, for free: Life Among the Apaches

That particular episode is on pages 132-135, but the whole book is worth reading, for folks like us.

One thing that's really cool about Books Google (which supports that particular book and a ton of others) is the search function. If you go to that link and look in the center of the toolbar just above the digitized book, you'll see a box that says "Search in this book." Type in a word that interests you, like "six-shooter" or "mule" or "rifle" and it will search the entire book in a couple of seconds and show you every time that word occurs in the text, with a link to that page. It is sensitive to spelling, though, and if you are looking for something in particular, try alternate spellings.

I just typed "turkey" in the Search box and got five hits within the book. Evidently, Cremony and his Apache acquaintances were all fond of turkey hunting, and New Mexico was a good place to hunt them back then. Who knew? That may be of interest to blackpowder shooters and history buffs who like to hunt those birds now. Do we know anybody like that?

Now, back to six-shooters...

Notchy Bob

Thank you Notchy Bob for some very interesting articles. I'm going to read that book and I've already saved it.
Squint