How critical is patch size?

[worker11811]

I'm making a batch of patches to use in my .54 cal. T/C Renegade.

They are cut from Wal-Mart red pillow ticking. I made them 1-1/4" square.

Everything seems to be okay but there is some variation in size. Given that the cloth stretches and moves when you cut it, I think it would be very hard to make them all exactly the same size unless I used a punch.

I'd say the patches vary in either dimension by ±1/8" (e.g. They may range from 1-1/8" to 1-3/8".)

I can't imagine that the size of the patch is all that critical so long as it covers the ball enough to seal against the walls of the bore but is not so large that the excess material gathers up and fouls up inside the barrel. Am I right?

How precise must the patch dimensions be?

Maybe I'll buy a punch for the next batch. Right now, I don't have the spare cash. Besides, square patches are just as good as round. Eh?

 

[DOUBLEDEUCE 1]

My patches are cut square. I'm not that finicky. I don't think the rifle or pistol notice either. I am not too precise. I just make sure they are at least 1,1/8- 1,1/4". I shoot .45 and .50 cal. Cut them up with sewing scissors. :thumbsup:

 

[Dphar]

My 54 shoots best with patches cut at the muzzle with the ball flush.
But I use round patches most of the time.
Dan

 

[MSW]

i think Don is right- so long as you're getting a good seal, it shouldn't be anything to worry too much about. i usually cut mine at the muzzle, and i haven't seen a great deal of variation in accuracy from the way i used to patch (squares), but then again i'm not nearly as good a shot as most of the folks here.

do a test and see what works best for your rifle, then

make good smoke

 

[BrownBear]

I've run into problems with oversize patches when using a fairly tight jag for seating. Get enough material above the ball and the jag will grab it as you withdraw the rod, unseating the ball for a greater or lesser distance and creating a potentially dangerous air space. It's more of a problem with small calibers, but I've had it happen with larger ones too.

 

[fyrfyter43]

I've had the same problem. But I usually notice it as soon as I push the ball past the coned area of the barrel...the ball gets really hard to push home. Now if I use pre-cut patches, I make sure they're folded over the ball if they're too big. But I mostly cut at the muzzle anymore.

 

[flinthead]

Once you seat the ball flush with the muzzle cut off the excess patch with your knife, then they will all be the same. That's what I do. If you pre-cut your patches round how are you going to get the ball centered exactly in the middle of the patch?

I don't understand the idea of pre-cut circular patches when it is easier to just cut the patch at the muzzle.

 

[roundball]

I can't imagine that the size of the patch is all that critical so long as it covers the ball enough to seal against the walls of the bore

Agree...and if anything, error on the larger size to ensure enough margin is up past the circumference.

but is not so large that the excess material gathers up and fouls up inside the barrel. Am I right?

Actually that's really not a performance problem...the spin from the twist flares any excess at muzzle exit and the wind blast peels it all back and away from the ball.

square patches are just as good as round. Eh?

Absolutely

FYI...thinking about this very subject while at the range one hot summer day, I had a few 2.5" wide lubing patches prelubed with natural Lube 1000 I had microwave melted into them and they were hot, wet, sticky laying there in the sun.

I decided to try some as ball patches...seated the ball about an inch past the muzzle then folded all that excess back and forth on top of the ball like you'd fold the ends of a coin wrapper, and seated it down...leaned on it hard so I'd get maximum "stickiness".

The balls went into the bulls-eye same as if I'd used regular patches and the huge patches simply spin flared open at muzzle exit like a parachute and landed on the ground about 10 feet away.

 

[Grenadier1758]

First make sure that you have washed the sizing out of your patching material. The starches and other sizing don't really help your accuracy as much as as a washed patch.

Size doesn't matter all that much as long as the diameter is coverd by patch between the ball and the lands. Since my patch knife is handy, I cut the patch at the muzzle.

 

[Walks with fire]

I agree that cutting at the muzzle will give the best accuracy; pre-cuts are ok but cut at the muzzle is more consistant.

 

[worker11811]

Yup, I washed the fabric before using it.

The first couple I tried to cut came out all frayed on the edges so I turned the fabric 45º and cut on the bias. No frayed edges.

I melted a cake of beeswax in the microwave and added olive oil. (About 1/3 wax & 2/3 oil, more or less.) I put everything, patches and all, into an old coffee can and mixed them up real good. Dumped out the excess into an old, empty margarine tub then squeezed the wad of patches until no more came out. I put the lids on the containers and let them cool.

Now I've got myself a 1 lb. coffee can full of patches and a 1/4 lb. margarine tub full of lube.

BTW: I read in some forum messages where guys have put their patches and lube into a Ziplock baggie and microwaved the whole thing until it melts. That's okay but you've gotta' be careful you don't get the wax/oil so hot it melts through the bag! (Ask me how I know this! )

If weather and circumstances are with me, I hope to be able to hit the range tomorrow or Monday.

Thanks for all the advice! :thumbsup:

Question: About cutting patches at the muzzle...

What do you do? Just cut strips of cloth and slice them off with a knife?
What size do you cut the strips?
Do you use any old knife so long as it's good and sharp? (Historical correctness is not a priority for me at this point in the game.)
Do you pre-lube the material or dunk it in lube right before you load?

T.I.A!

 

[gordy]

Worker, as all the others have stated a square patch will do as good as a round.Sam Fadala did extensive experiments with patches in one of the early Loading manuals and found that the shape of the patch made no detectable difference in point of aim. I find the pre cut round patches to be more difficut to center so seldom use them. The majority of the time i cut strips and pre-lube and cut at the muzzle.

 

[jtmattison]

How precise must the patch dimensions be?

Maybe I'll buy a punch for the next batch. Right now, I don't have the spare cash. Besides, square patches are just as good as round. Eh?

As long as the ball is completely surrounded by patch it's good to go.

Square patches work just as good as round. so do triangular, octagonal...

HD

 

[LRB]

Pre-cut patches are faster to load, and with at least one extra step eliminated. By historical evidence, that was the common way patching was done. Thats why rifles had "patch boxes". However, there is certainly nothing wrong in cutting them at the muzzle if not in a hurry, but then this subject could easily lead into the patch knife, priming horn, ball starter controversy, and that has been hammered to death already.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Put the stacks of lubed wads on a plate to microwave them. Once the lube fully infiltrates all the fabric, THEN, and only then, store them in the plastic baggies.

Oh, I do the zapping in 10 second bursts, flipping the stacks over to let gravity help the migration of lube. When both end patches are "lubed", I am done. How many "zaps" it takes depends on how many patches are stacked in a column.

I put unlubed patches on the ends of each stack so they serve as a " Barometer" to tell me that all the patches are "lubed". The rest of the patches get lubed on one side only and then stacked.

 

[roundball]

Pre-cut patches are faster to load, and with at least one extra step eliminated.

No question about it...and once I learned that excess material had no negative effects on ball performance, I switched to patches that were a caliber or two larger than what I needed...ie: using .58cal patches for the 50 & 54 so I don't have to waste time trying to get a ball precisely centered

 

[Billnpatti]

If you are using Wal-Mart pillow ticking, it may be coated with a polymer on the inside that can foul your bore if it is turned to the outside when you load it. Keep the coated side next to the ball and you will be okay. The Wal-Mart pillow ticking that I bought was only about .010 thick. You might need a thicker patch material. If you do, you may have to go to a regualr fabric shop and look for real (old fashioned) pillow ticking. Not every place carries it any more and you may have to hunt for it. I have found a light weight denim that is perfect for my rifles. It has a herringbone texture and is sold by Wal-Mart. :2

 

[tg]

"o. If you pre-cut your patches round how are you going to get the ball centered exactly in the middle of the patch?'

Unless doing serious competion shooting it doesn't really matter

 

[Ken Rummer]

I agree with Brown Bear. Your jag can get stuck. I was using a cheaper plastic short starter with a screw-in button tip. The patch wrapped around the jag and the jag pulled out of the short starter. With luck was able to blow the prb and jag out with CO2. Ruined my day at the range.

Since then I have used smaller patches (1-1/8 for both 50 and 54) cut in squares from Wal-Mart ticking. The stripes in the ticking are a good guide to keep the width of the strip reasonably constant and I eyeball cutting the strip into patches. It seems to work for me. Another preventive measure is to go to the TotW site and buy the short starter with straight sides that can't grab the patch.

 

[roundball]

That problem can be eliminated on short starters and seating jags for ramrods by just tinkering with the diameter of the jag head...and/or ensuring there's enough of a recessed shaft on the jag, behind the seating head.

A short starter I got years ago for my .45s has a replaceable screw in brass seating button on the end of a stainless shaft...and when I first started using it, it would occasionally grip the pillow ticking and pull the ball back up to the muzzle.

I compared it's diameter to the .45cal ramrod jag which worked fine and found the short starter button to be larger diameter as if for a .50cal. I just took a minute and turned it down about .030"-.040" by rolling it on my belt sander while it was running and that was that.