How do I determine value of a flintlock

[ballandcap]

I am/have been wanting a good quality full stock flinter for sometime. I have been watching the classifieds, other auction and sites as well as reading on the builders that a lot of people reccomend like TVM, Tip Curtis, Sitting Fox, and a few others that come to mind. I hope I don't open a can-o-worms on this one. Don't have the patience to wait for one to be built, just wanna see it and if I like it buy it.

I want a 100% complete gun that I can just enjoy and shoot instead of having to fuss with it before I can enjoy it. I don't even want one "in the white" A good build kit can come later, NOT now. I'll want to shoot it as soon as I get it.

What exactly makes the value of the rifle? Is it kind of perception and what the builders says they are worth or kind of a std all around price for certain stocks, parts, carvings etc... depending on what they are? I know this is a super newbee general question but looking to spend around 700.00 to maybe 1,050. I know good components for locks, triggers, and barrels like Siler, L&R, Davis, Green Mtn. And as far as the stock I guess what it is made of and how fancy it is. Also what the rifle has on it like carvings, medallions, patch boxes.

I just want to make sure I get a good rifle at a fair to great price. I know this is a terribly general question, but other than posting up when I see what my be a good deal that I find(if it is too good someone else may jump on it if I alert it to all). I am looking at one now just kind of wanted to ask. I missed the one in the classifieds recently for 850.00 Southern TVM.

Thanks all for the help to a newbee

 

[Dave K]

Many other things come into play, besides just the quality of componets. You can have a very good and fuctional gun in the price range you mentioned. From there though it can change in a hurry. There gets to be the "art" of the gun. Is the gun, an accurate representation of the period of gun you are looking for? Built really correctly, this will add to the price. Another is the builder. Just like in fine art, many guns with the right name on the barrel, just like in art, will increase it's value and also it's resale. You know a painting is just a painting, until you attach one of the names of the old masters like Rembrandt, then the value certainly makes a change.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Contact Tony Avant at TVMuzzleloading( www.avsia.com ) and see what they can make for you in either a Tennessee, or Southern Style Mountain rifle. I think you can find something in your price range, that comes without frills. My first rifle was a Tenn. Poor Boy, with plain wood, NO grease hole in the stock. and no frills. I wanted a gun for hunting, and I didn't want any flashy metal on it to scare away the deer. I gather from what you have written here that you are thinking along the same lines.

You can save a bit of money if you finish the stock and metal parts yourself. However, if you don't know how to do that, and don't want to learn, then having them complete the gun is the right way to go. With the experience I have now had since I bought my rifle, both browning metal, and finishing stocks, I would save the extra cost, and delay in getting the gun made and shipped to me, by doing that work myself. :thumbsup:

 

[Coot]

Not an easy question with a simple answer. You need to be a bit more specific with your intended use/uses to get some suggestions of what might be a good choice or direction or price range. Look at as many offerings as possible with their asking prices. TOW has good pictures posted which help to see some of the differences between guns at different price ranges. It is hard to beat actually handling the guns for a real appreciation for fit, finish and balance and overall feel. One of the main problems with so many "replica" guns is that (IMHO) they are copied from a picture and the balance & feel is way off. I bought my first contemporary longrifle used from a dealer in antique guns - paid more than any other gun I had ever bought up to that point but it was a fair price. Had a custom gun built a couple of years ago - now the builder is getting over twice what I paid as he is better known. See as many guns as you can & try to get a feel for what your area of interest is bringing in the way of prices. Its one thing to pay more than you want to and another to pay more than a gun is worth. Good luck in your search.

 

Ball,
I would not hesitate to contact Mat & Toni Avance at TVM. They build a fine rifle for a very reasonable price in various levels of cost. They are easy to look at, period correct and of fine quality. I have an early Virginia and would suggest you look into that style it is simple, graceful and accurate. Good luck.
Mark

 

[atki]

The nice thing about Track of the Wolf, is you can buy a gun and you have ten days to decide if you want it to keep it or not. If not all you are out is the shipping.

WB

 

[Stumpkiller]

What exactly makes the value of the rifle?

Quality materials will cost a minimum of $500. Average would be $600 or so for a nice rifle. The rest is labor. A craftsman gets more than a hack, but may take less time. Add another $1,200 for a well finished and tuned rifle without carvings beyone rudaments or inlays and patchbox. Then start adding $200 and $300 at a time for embellishments that your might like.

A patchbox is $12 worth of sheet brass and $300 worth of labor. Engraving can take it on past double or triple that depending on the complexity of the work.

In a used rifle the style either attracts you or not. You want a rifle that has been well cared for - no pitting or buggered up screw slots or other signs of abuse - and quality parts in the original build.

 

[ballandcap]

I have heard a lot about TVM and or Tennessee Valley Muzzleloaders. I guess one is Jack Garner and the other is Matt or Toni Avance?

There are 2 sites. Both below, which one are you all talking about?
http://www.tennesseevalleymanufacturing.com/catalog.php?category=tpbriflekit

or
http://www.avsia.com/tvm/

 

[Tommy Bruce]

The bottom address would be the one you want. As far as price/value goes, well it all starts with components, Rice barrels and Chambers locks seem to be the most preferred these days. A maple stock blank can run from 60 to several hundred dollars depending upon figure and density of the wood. The builders name also adds to the value of the gun. As far as the actual construction goes, look for good wood to metal fit and finish, no gaps anywhere. Are the lines of the rifle correct for the school? Carving and engraving can add several hundreds if not thousands of dollars to the cost of a rifle or diminish it's value if it's not done correctly. Ask yourself what you want. Do you want a copy of an origional or particular school of rifle done in the 18th century or a semi-custom gun that just has the look of an early gun? Patience is the name of the game here. Do some research, focus on what you want, continue to ask questions and make an educated by. Sometimes a 2000.00 gun is a better bargain that one for 700.00.

 

[OLDBRO]

This is whats tough.It's not easy to decide which way to go. You can walk into any gun shop around me and see hundreds of examples of every conceivable firearm except, muzzle loaders.The selection of flinters is a small percentage of those. The purest wants one thing the newb just wants to shoot.I have started asking about flint locks at the clubs I belong to. This is the reaction I get :shocked2: :youcrazy: :rotf:

 

[cowpoke1955]

Matt and Toni are with: http://www.avsia.com/tvm/ and Jack is with : http://tennesseevalleymanufacturing.com/ . What makes it even harder is the fact that they are located in the same city in Mississippi :rotf:

 

[Mike Brooks]

How to figure worth? I figure price of parts and a certain amount of dollars per hour for labor. Someday I hope to make as much as the guy who fixes toilets.....

 

[ozark57]

I know what you mean, Mike. If you don't like doing it you better find something else to do. True art in any form is a labor of love, and not always of high profit.

 

[Capt. Fred]

I've got a good budy who is a plumber Mike. You'd have to double your prices to make what he makes per hour. It's a head scratcher for sure.

I guess it's just good old economics. Everybody wants a toilet, and it's a pretty limited market for the art work you guys produce.

 

[tiger955]

I was at a home show a few years ago and saw a walnut toilet seat with some nice gold inlays, I can't see spending that much money for something I am just going to manure on though

 

[brubincam]

-----SILLY-----your supposed to sit on the seat and manure through the hole-----

 

[FPDoc]

That's what I like most about this forum, plain down-to-earth advice that just tells it like it is! :rotf:

 

[tg]

You will often see good deals on used guns in this forums classifieds and others as well there are usually used guns within your price range,if you see a particular gun check with the forum for value and details to look for and questions to ask the seller, I have bought several used guns over the years and have not been burnt, sometimes they may need refinished to ones own taste, or some wood might need removed but a used gun can be a very good way to go.

 

[Billnpatti]

Flintlocks are like a lot of products, the price will depend on the quality of the various components and the craftsmanship of the builder. Also, a plain un-adorned rifle will be less expensive than one with a lot of carving and inlays. If you are looking for a good shooter and are not wanting a "show gun", put your money into quality parts and good craftsmanship and forget the frills. In my humble opinion, TVM makes a fine rifle. Dixie Gun Works is over priced on their things so I'd pass them by. Sitting Fox makes a good usable gun but I think, for a little more money, TVM is a better choice. Spend your money wisely on quality and you will never be sorry. :thumbsup:

Just my humble opinion.....it's free and worth every penny of it. :haha:

 

[Billnpatti]

Yeah, there are two good things about fixing toilets. First you make good money and second, it will break you of the habit of biting your fingernails. :rotf: