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How do you Harden a Frizzen ?

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Michael76

32 Cal.
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Hello All ,
I am new to flint locks but not muzzle loading . I fact I just ordered my first flintier from TVM last week and can't wait until it arrives. I have read on the board something about hardening the frizzen. can somebody explain this process ? and dose it need to be done to a new gun?

Thanks
SWG
 
Smelly Woods Guy said:
I have read on the board something about hardening the frizzen. can somebody explain this process ? and dose it need to be done to a new gun?
Hardening a frizzen is something that occasionally needs to be done with cheap/low quality production flint guns.

I seriously doubt that anyone would need to harden a frizzen on a quality gun.
 
Yes, you are jumping the gun on frizzen being hardened or not. All siler locks are cast by chambers and then assembled by others, with some exceptions. I have never seen one that needed it off the bat, now for others of less quality I can't say that.
 
I bought a rifle from Matt at TVM and within a week the flint was gouging the frizzen. I sent it back to them and they hardened it, but they didn’t bother to clean up the gouges. So I agree that with most new semi-custom flintlocks you will not have to worry about it, unless its from TVM.
 
Visited with Tip Curtis the other day and the frizzen lifespan question came up.Mr. Curtis then showed me his 50-year old competition rifle with its original hardened frizzen.He said when he competed he went through multiple cases of powder every year.I'm no longer worried about the frizzens on quality locks.
 
Smelly Woods Guy said:
Hello All ,
I am new to flint locks but not muzzle loading . I fact I just ordered my first flintier from TVM last week and can't wait until it arrives. I have read on the board something about hardening the frizzen. can somebody explain this process ? and dose it need to be done to a new gun?

Thanks
SWG

You asked a simple question about the process that really requires a technical answer. Without getting into the history of the steel and iron industry, steels have carbon added to the metal, the more carbon in the alloy, the harder the steel can be. All steel can be hardened to a point but some at their hardest are softer than others at their softest.

It has to do with the alloy. Simply put, some steels are not suitable to be hardened into a working part like a frizzen, saw blade, spring or file. Others on the other hand are manufactured to be harder, like tool steel.

To harden a steel it's brought to a high temperature and then cooled quickly or nearly instantly by quenching in oil or water or a mixture of both.

When it reaches that temperature it's usually cherry red and is non magnetic. Quenching leaves it hard. So hard in fact, if it's a tool steel; it's too hard to work. For instance the teeth on a file or rasp can only be raised or formed when the steel is annealed or soft. It's the same for shaping and drilling the bolt holes for the frizzen this must be done when the steel is soft or at least soft enough to work.

A steel that is too hard can be annealed. When a steel is annealed it is heated, not quite as hot as in the hardening process; and is allowed to cool slowly. This makes it suitable to work. This is related to the temper in a knife. A knife needs to be hard enough to keep an edge but soft enough to sharpen and not break.

It can get rather complicated and and hard to explain.Just like a knife blade, a frizzen can be too hard. So hard and brittle in fact, that it will not spark and is prone to breakage.

So not only can a frizzen be too soft it can also be too hard. L&R had a run of locks in the past years that had problems with their frizzens being too hard. The solution, annealing.

Now before modern cast steels, wrought iron was worked and case hardened. Case hardening puts a layer of harder, carbonized iron, "steel" on the out side surface of the softer iron. This is done by packing carbon laden material like bone meal, bits of leather and other organic material around the iron part into a sealed crucible that's heated at high heat on a forge for several hours. The contents of the crucible are dumped into a quench. After the quench the iron part now has a skin of hardened steel.

Today if a frizzen is made of too a soft steel that will not harden by heat and quench it can be case hardened. A product called Casenit, was a powder that allowed the process to be accomplished with a torch.

I hope that explains some of your question. Not only can a frizzen be too soft it can also be too hard.

Most factory locks are done well and it's doubtful you will have a problem with a new lock. As you cane see it can be rather complicated and sometimes theses parts are not perfect all the time.
 
Foxfire 5 has a pretty good explanation of this and other gun smithing questions...

I would just send one of my Silers back to Jim and let him take care of it..... :thumbsup:
 
You're fairly close with most of that, but in the case of a too hard frizzen, you don't anneal, you simply re-temper at a higher heat. Iron/steel loses magnetic draw at 1414°. That does not vary, however, that is not hot enough to quench for hardness, merely an indicator that you are getting close to the correct heat which is about 60°more with high carbon steels, and that 60°does make a difference. If using color as a heat guage, heat about one shade of red beyond non-magnetic, and you should be close enough.
 
One other thing to add..., folks on YouTube who show "rehardening" or "hardening" of a frizzen by wrapping it in leather and then placing the frizzen in a steel can, followed by crushing the mouth of the can closed and dropping it into a fire..., and then dropping the can into cold water, are not "hardening" their frizzen, nor are they adding carbon to it. They are, at best, changing the temper. They may see an increase in sparks, but they must have had a very bad frizzen to think that any small improvement in sparking is a "fix".

LD
 
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