How Snug is to Snug

[Sharpie44]

Another newbie question

I'm starting to think that maybe my .58 cal is the correct bore size and I'm just being a pansy newbie and not forcing it enough. I spent all night putting patches threw it once I discovered that if I really force it in there it loosens up after the first 3/4 of an inch.

I've been reading online and some people are saying that it should be tight enough to deform the ball and that seems about right.I mean I can get that sucker in there. I've got a hammer thats not the issue. :wink:

I'm concerned that it's not going to come out again or more importantly that it's going to explode in my face. I'm betting that I can force it past the first inch and it will slip down ok after that but what happens when it's shooting out of there and hits that tight spot. My .50 rife has a very consistent bore and i easily seat the ball every time. This is very different.

 

[longcruise]

Could this be more a problem of an abrupt (angular) crown?

 

[musketman]

I discovered that if I really force it in there it loosens up after the first 3/4 of an inch.

Lap the barrel with a good lapping compound, especially the muzzle end and see if that helps. I suspect some unseen pits are causing the tightness of the loading.

Also check to see of the lands and grooves are deformed at the muzzle, could have been banged up by the ramrod being forced through it. If so, you can use a small flat file to smooth away any burrs that are too big for the lapping compound to handle.

 

[roundball]

When I first got my GM .58cal x 1:70 round ball barrel, I had to use a firm palm smack on the 2" wooden ball of my short starter to get a Hornady .570 & .018" patch started, but then they seated down normally.

The barrel had very deep grooves...which I'm sure contributed to its excellent accuracy...and I concluded that the raised ends of the lands being so pronounced contributed to the firm starting...but it did get a little more normal starting after 200-300 shots as the newness/sharpness of the lands ends smoothed off a bit.

By contrast, a new .58cal Rice barrel I got a few months ago had more taper on the ends of the lands and balls started normally from the very beginning.

Different strokes for different folks of course, but for me, after going to some lengths and expense to buy uniform quality lead round balls, the last thing in the world I want to do it have a PRB combo so tight that I intentionally deform the ball when I start it.
I want it to be snug "against" the lands and ride them like a train rides its rails, with all the patching wadded down into the grooves doing the steering...but not "engraved" by the lands.

At least that works for me and my purposes.

 

[MikeChapin]

I load snug enough that it takes a sharp slap on the short starter to start the ball. After they are started they go down fine because the patch has imprinted into the ball and the ball has deformed a little to conform to the barrel. I generally use .010 undersized ball and a thicker patch than most people use.

I know a few shooters who use a little brass hammer to start the ball. That's a little more than I want to do but they all are great shots so I won't criticize their methods. It works for them.

As long as you can get the ball down on the powder it will come out the end and not explode when you fire it if you have a normal load. For those of use who have dry balled even a three or four grain load will cough the ball 5 or 10 yards down range.

 

[longcruise]

Also check to see of the lands and grooves are deformed at the muzzle, could have been banged up by the ramrod being forced through it.

I think this is dead on. Many barrels are crowned with considerable pressure with dull crowning tools which tends to fold the lands over a bit at the muzzle. Not only are they hard starters, they often tear the patch when starting.

With the crown corrected the problem will probably go away and you will probably be able to use a thicker and tighter patch/ball combo that often provides better accuracy.

 

[Sharpie44]

Well i think you were right. I used the thinnest patch I had and gave it a good smack. Right after the first quarter inch it slid right down. I was very happy. Although now I have a loaded BP gun sitting around but i don't relay have a problem with that since I'm going to the range tomorrow.

 

[ohio ramrod]

Another newbie question

I'm starting to think that maybe my .58 cal is the correct bore size and I'm just being a pansy newbie and not forcing it enough. I spent all night putting patches threw it once I discovered that if I really force it in there it loosens up after the first 3/4 of an inch.

I've been reading online and some people are saying that it should be tight enough to deform the ball and that seems about right.I mean I can get that sucker in there. I've got a hammer thats not the issue. :wink:

I'm concerned that it's not going to come out again or more importantly that it's going to explode in my face. I'm betting that I can force it past the first inch and it will slip down ok after that but what happens when it's shooting out of there and hits that tight spot. My .50 rife has a very consistent bore and i easily seat the ball every time. This is very different.

Many of the old time target rifles were intentionally made so that the first inch or so of the barell was a few .0001 of an inch undersised to "imprint" the patch and ball. This carried over to later "slug guns" Many of the false muzzles on target rifles also were .0003 undersized for the same reasons. Therefore I don't think you have a problem unless there are "Burrs" involved.

 

[necchi]

I think Mike2005 said it quite well.

 

[paulvallandigham]

A lot of barrels have " choke " put in them, whether smooth bore, or rifled, so that the PRB is squeezed down just before it leaves the muzzle. Some modern barrels have long, tapered, " Back Bores", where the " choke " actually is a barrel-long taper from breech to muzzle.

In the barrel you describe, I would be taking a long look at the muzzle crown, and at what shape the front of the lands are in . Look for any burrs. If there are burrs of any kind on the lands, it may explain why that last 1/4" is "tighter" than the rest of the barrel.

You can use a carriage bolt, or even the rounded ended of a file handle, backing emery cloth, to polish the crown of the barrel, and remove lots of the burrs occasionally seen there. And, you can contact Joe Wood, In Texas, and buy a coning tool from him for your caliber rifle. Use it to remove that constricted area, or even cone the muzzle, so you can load a PRB without the need of a short starter at all!

 

[Coot]

And, you can contact Joe Wood, In Texas, and buy a coning tool from him for your caliber rifle. Use it to remove that constricted area, or even cone the muzzle, so you can load a PRB without the need of a short starter at all!

:thumbsup: One less thing (no short starter) to deal with & a faster reload if hunting.