Hunting loads for my .58 black powder rifle

[lou puleff]

After my missed deer the other day I'm wondering if I shouldn't have set my rifle up differently. Thinking I should have used more powder so it shoots flatter without having to use the rear adjustable sight for different yardages and just hold lower or higher. I was using 100 grains of Swiss 2f and using the adjustable rear buckhorn for different distances I'm thinking I should have gone to at least 150 grains if not more and just use a higher or lower hold any thoughts on the subject ?
Thanks !!

 

[gemmer]

100 gr is plenty of powder. How far was the shot?

 

[Okie Hog]

Are you firing patched round balls ?

 

[tenngun]

Round ball is a poor projectile
It sheds velocity rapidly.
The faster you drive it the faster it loses velocity. A ball at 2200 fps will lose down to 1100 at a hundred yards. At 1100 fps it slows to 800 at that same range, and your not going to get that fast in a .58
Depending on your barrel length 150 grain 2f will give about 1600 fps, three f might get you another hundred. Let’s say 1800 just for fun
At a hundred yards your down to a thousand
At say 1300 your down to nine.
A 260 ball at eight hundred fps will go through a deer and the one behind it you didn’t see.
Sighted at hundred yards a midrange and drop are within an inch.
Rb get close
Boys get kills clean and fast at a hundred and fifty yard even longer. They know their gun, thier range and get ‘good shots’
All and all though a rb tops out at a hundred yards
For what ever reason deer and targets never act the same.

 

[lou puleff]

100 gr is plenty of powder. How far was the shot?

Shot was 180 yards

 

[lou puleff]

Are firing patched round balls ?

Yes patched round ball. I really wanted to shoot a deer with my GRRW-CA .58 I've had it since I think 2016 and haven't killed anything with it I could have used a in line with a scope on this hunt but was holding firm on my Hawken for this trip.

 

[lou puleff]

Are firing patched round balls ?

Yes

 

[smokepolehall]

That's really too far for a PRB my friend.

 

[Dave Marsh]

I use 80 grains in my 58 and would never even consider a shot at a deer at over 100 yards.

 

[Okie Hog]

i hunt hogs and deer using .50. .54 and .58 guns. Most of my shots are <75 yards.

IMO: a 180 yard shot with a round ball i very iffy. Round ball calculator. Use .57 as ball diameter:

http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/rbballistics/web_apps/rb_ballistics.html

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Shot was 180 yards

That's too far for what you are shooting, if you are trying to hit a conventional target OR hunting. In fact there are no commercially available barrels today that will work.

What you're trying to do has been accomplished before. As a reference you need to refer to The Sporting Rifle and Its Projectiles by James Forsyth. Forsyth tried and succeeded in doing exactly what you appear to be working on.

The problem for a hunting rifle is two fold. Accuracy for one, and enough velocity and inertia upon impact to take the animal. To launch a patched round ball that far with a flat enough trajectory, and enough speed at impact you will need a larger charge than you so far are using, and probably a large caliber.

You will need a custom rifled barrel of 1:104 twist rate or slower, perhaps as slow as 1:120, AND custom rifling as well. This allows the patch to survive the explosion of the powder that is needed, and as a bonus will give a very low amount of fouling. As for the rifling, you need very thin and sharp lands to help hold the patch at the high velocities that you are generating. Foryth recommended that such a rifle be .69 caliber.


(Please excuse the illustration as the Forsyth should have 6 lands, not four as illustrated. The illustration is to provide an idea of how different the lands are from factory rifling)

LD

 

[2 shots]

too far, get closer. its not a .308

 

[lou puleff]

too far, get closer. its not a .308

I get it but it's not possible in this spot to get closer myself the deer would have to on their own if I try to set up any closer I bust them out in the dark if I take any more steps. I understand the thought of getting closer but here in AZ that's not a easy proposition much different than the area I grew up hunting in. I was not shooting off hand and was practicing out to 200 yards.

 

[lou puleff]

i hunt hogs and deer using .50. .54 and .58 guns. Most of my shots are <75 yards.

IMO: a 180 yard shot with a round ball i very iffy. Round ball calculator. Use .57 as ball diameter:

http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments/rbballistics/web_apps/rb_ballistics.html

I agree it's pushing it.

 

[longcruise]

I think your caliber and load are adequate. Upping the powder charge will help a bit with the trajectory but that's not really the problem. The problem is knowing the range precisely and having a very good rest that you are familiar with and practicing at the distances you expect to shoot. You really need a rangefinder. At those distances a five yard mistake can easily be a miss or worse.

Then, there's the wind. It's surprising how far the wind can move a ball.

 

[lou puleff]

I think your caliber and load are adequate. Upping the powder charge will help a bit with the trajectory but that's not really the problem. The problem is knowing the range precisely and having a very good rest that you are familiar with and practicing at the distances you expect to shoot. You really need a rangefinder. At those distances a five yard mistake can easily be a miss or worse.

Then, there's the wind. It's surprising how far the wind can move a ball.

I have a range finder but I didn't have time to range him. But I always range different spots ahead of time and try to memorize them but my depth perception with the lighting was wrong !!

 

[jdw276]

I have a range finder but I didn't have time to range him. But I always range different spots ahead of time and try to memorize them but my depth perception with the lighting was wrong !!

Might consider switching from a RB to a REAL or some pointy thing. Will help extend the range and energy. Will thump your shoulder a bunch more from the added weight of the projectile but you do get more yardage and controlled accuracy as the range increases.

 

[longcruise]

I have a range finder but I didn't have time to range him. But I always range different spots ahead of time and try to memorize them but my depth perception with the lighting was wrong !!

Here's a chart along with a screenshot of the inputs. Based on a muzzle velocity of 1750 and a 115 yard zero and range in 5 yard increments.

Not saying the inputs are applicable to you or even precise but it shows how fast the ball is dropping when it gets out there.

Just posting for general information.

 

[lou puleff]

Here's a chart along with a screenshot of the inputs. Based on a muzzle velocity of 1750 and a 115 yard zero and range in 5 yard increments.

Not saying the inputs are applicable to you or even precise but it shows how fast the ball is dropping when it gets out there.

Just posting for general information.

View attachment 359796View attachment 359797

Nice chart thank you ! I’m going to have to do a lot more testing I’m already planning on bringing up a cardboard deer target and place it where the deer was standing and see with that load what it does then start upping my charge and see in real world application what it does.

 

[Antelope Pete]

Instead of doing that why not do the right thing and work on getting to around 100 yds. give or take a little. Getting closer is what it's all about and the rest of us that hunt open country try to figure out how to do it. Sometimes you can, sometimes you can't.