If I was a man living on the frontier during the revolution what would I have carried?

[Md80runway23]

I know thats a broad question. I want to portray an average man living on what was then the frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain, living west of the appalachians. What styles would be appropriate, rifle or smooth bore more common? What styles are typically post revolution etc. Thanks

 

[oldwood]

There is little recorded evidence of how many combatants from the back woods carried smooth rifles ,vs. rifled guns.. One would have to think , that many used rifles due to the distances , and the precision , with which shots were executed. A rifleman turned the tide of battle at the battle of Saratoga , N.Y. by targeting officers. Battle of New Orleans , most of the British Officers were killed at substantial distance , before the first British volley was fired. An offhand comment by a backwoods participant at the Battle of King's Mtn. was , that some in the militia , described the action similar to a squirrel hunt.
Accurate shooting with little chance for a bayonet charge by the uniformed British................oldwood

 

[Artificer]

I know thats a broad question. I want to portray an average man living on what was then the frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain, living west of the appalachians. What styles would be appropriate, rifle or smooth bore more common? What styles are typically post revolution etc. Thanks

Are you talking about PRE AWI or POST AWI?

For Pre AWI, Moravian Rifles from Salem, NC were popular as were rifles that came from the Germanic (including Moravian) gunsmiths who settled in Winchester, VA. Smoothbore Trade Guns were also very popular.

I think what is considered the typical "Poor Boy" Iron Mounted Rifles were all or mostly Post AWI, BUT I may be wrong about that to some degree.

Gus

 

[Dibbuk]

Just a WAG on my part, but I expect they would have brought whatever they usually hunted with, whether it was smoothbore or rifle, so I think both would have been present.

 

[tenngun]

I would hazard it’s up to you. Rifles were known and shot but still mostly new, few southern rifles from F and I, so they have just became a ‘thing’ in the last decade or so.
smoothbores would never not be common.
a rifle might cost a months or twos earnings a smoothbore a few weeks
A Hunter may want the precision of a rifle, but most men were to busy to hunt a lot. And there was little corrected vision. A nearsighted man could put deer in the pot with a smoothie, but would shoot no better with a rifle, was it worth the expense?
Shoot a time and place appropriate gun of your choosing.

 

[oldwood]

It is stated in 1750 Moravian records , there were as few as one usable gun per 100 souls in America. There also was no money ,so buying guns was done with animal hides , tradable goods, grain , whatever commodities around. You can bet a gun bought on credit would be a very basic "lock , stock ,and barrel " w/ little to no decoration on it. Smooth or rifled ????????

 

[Daveboone]

I always thought that there would have been a great number of Brown Bess rifles around after the American Revolution. I would think they would have been a very versatile and serviceable frontier gun...buck or ball, shot, very sturdy, ....at least perhaps a gun made up from the parts, or a cut down version.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I know thats a broad question. I want to portray an average man living on what was then the frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain, living west of the appalachians. What styles would be appropriate, rifle or smooth bore more common? What styles are typically post revolution etc. Thanks

So the "over mountain men" most likely were fellows mostly from the Holston Valley in what is now mostly Tennessee. William Bean first settled near what is today Johnson City TN in 1769. That valley was "connected" back in the 18th century to The Great Wagon Road, which after going through Winchester VA, down to what today is Roanoake VA, and (iirc) went down what is today US 21 to Charlotte, NC... but was called in that portion the Carolina Road. What later became the city of Roanoake VA was actually a junction of "roads" and "paths".

Why that's important, is as mentioned, the "road" down into that area was more from as far North as Carlisle PA, than say from the ports of NC. SO..., the good news is that the folks that came down that road and then turned West, carried quite often Pennsylvania longrifles. PLUS as Gus pointed out, along that Carolaina Road you have what is today Salem, NC. Rifles from that region would be fine for post AWI impressions.

How far "post" AWI do you wish to go? If not many years, than an AWI rifle or even a pre-AWI rifle style would be quite acceptable.

LD

 

[Md80runway23]

Thanks for all the replies. I really want to stay AWI period. I love smoothbores and would like to stay with them if accurate and possible.

 

[Brokennock]

Rifles get the romance, and smoothbores get the bulk of the work done.
Kind of the difference between Special Forces and regular infantry. S.F. gets some crazy, story worthy, gutsy, stuff done, but, as was said or written I forget where, "it is the regular troops that take the ground and hold the ground they take."
Rifles in that area at that time seem to have been more common than in other places. "Dikert" guns in various spellings get mentioned a few times in period writing. Almost any rifle style of that time period from places in Pennsylvania, Virginia, maybe Maryland and maybe N. Carolina,,,, that settlers would have come from would be possible.
Maybe someone better versed than I can list styles available to us now that would not be appropriate. Process of elimination might narrow the field, and thus the discussion.
A smooth bored, rear sighted, Type-G/Carolina trade gun would also be possible. As would many other fowling piece and musket options.

I've often wondered about the period accounts of Kings Mountain and other events in the area at that time regarding their mentions of rifles. We're rifles mentioned specifically because rifle ownership and use was still mentionable, news worthy if you will?

 

[CookedOff]

Howdy, A similar question was posed to an "Old West" forum. The consensus was that very few people could afford a rifle or a Peacemaker-type pistol The most common firearms were smoothbore shotguns. ( I am unable to footnote my data). Assuming that folks on the frontier were pretty much dirt poor, the cheapest effective firearm would be the most common.

 

[tdoyka]

i would "guess" that smoothbores outnumbered the rifles. buck and ball usually denotes what they would have at that time.

 

[tenngun]

I always thought that there would have been a great number of Brown Bess rifles around after the American Revolution. I would think they would have been a very versatile and serviceable frontier gun...buck or ball, shot, very sturdy, ....at least perhaps a gun made up from the parts, or a cut down version.

Besses were owned and issued by the army, it was kings property. One would ‘have some splaying’ to do if you had one.
That said, most every ship carried a musket that looked a lot like a sea service bess, and private folks did get officers fusils, again a gun that looked like a bess only smaller and lighter.

 

[Flintlock]

It's a heck of a lot cheaper to shoot a rifle than a common smoothbore. Less lead by far and half the powder. Economics were the reason rifles were carried west of the seaboard in the first place. Hunting small game with shot unless absolutly neccesary was wasteful.

 

[Cattywompuss]

What a lot of people miss but what Loyalist Dave mentioned is how going from western VA to Tennessee is different than folks in western North Carolina. Right between what we call Tennessee and what we call North Carolina was a big ball of angry Cherokees stretching from Southwest VA to North GA. There was definitely commerce between NC and Tenn, but it was hindered pre and post AWI by Cherokees.

They were basically the same people, but divided by a nation of natives. The first folks to settle in those mountains weren't average. Some were adventurous, some were desperate, but none of then were fully settled for a long time due to political and social instability. This would likely influence what was available, and a great deal probably was improvised over time. While surveying/hunting Kentucky, Boone's guns and furs and general stuff was seized a few times by various native folk.

 

[tenngun]

It's a heck of a lot cheaper to shoot a rifle than a common smoothbore. Less lead by far and half the powder. Economics were the reason rifles were carried west of the seaboard in the first place. Hunting small game with shot unless absolutly neccesary was wasteful.

That’s a trueism we don’t talk about a lot. Often the ‘what would you carry for survival’ thread comes up. And myself and some others come up with smooth as the best. However a ‘square load’ 70 grains of powder and an ounce of shot, can kill a rabbit sized animal, up to turkey sized. You’ll starve on a bunny a day. A turkey will feed you well one to two days. A duck will do you for a day or goose.
Thats a hundred shots of powder to a pound six and a half pounds of shot.
Seven and a half pounds total.
A deer will feed you for a week. And a hundred shots in a .50 closer to four and a half pounds.
Powder and lead were more expensive then today in terms of average income.
But….
inventories of frontier sold goods indicates a lot of shot going west…. Hmm

 

[Artificer]

I've often wondered about the period accounts of Kings Mountain and other events in the area at that time regarding their mentions of rifles. We're rifles mentioned specifically because rifle ownership and use was still mentionable, news worthy if you will?

While probably not every one of the Over Mountain Men had rifles, they were still in the time period before the AWI when the trade in deer hides was so huge and profitable and that would have made rifles much more affordable, even to fairly poor folks.

I think its safe to say that a large enough percentage of them must have had rifles, though I can't document what percentage that would have been.


Gus

 

[Cattywompuss]

While probably not every one of the Over Mountain Men had rifles, they were still in the time period before the AWI when the trade in deer hides was so huge and profitable and that would have made rifles much more affordable, even to fairly poor folks.

I think its safe to say that a large enough percentage of them must have had rifles, though I can't document what percentage that would have been.


Gus

We have a prototype though. It was profitable because it was risky. Boone ended up in serious debt partly because he kept losing his behind when natives took his hides and guns. He owed money on those guns the hides would have paid for. Not to mention the land he owed money on. Rifles were not cheap even for the well healed. They were the Coopers, Dakotas, and Accuracy Internationals of their day..

 

[Flintlock]

Carry 50 .69 cal balls with you on a trek, now carry 50 .48 cal balls ( common size years ago). I commonly load my .45 with 25-30 grains of FFG to take grouse, ducks and rabbits with 47 grains my common load, or 50 grains or less in the .50 cal. We can make a pound of powder go a long way with a rifle.

 

[Cattywompuss]

Regarding weight, we are also leaving out the fact that longhunters and trekkers had horses. This is a known fact. While weight is still definitely a factor, as the pelts pile up the weight in lead and powder goes down. Scouts, Rangers, and such might have been on foot, but hunters were not.