The start of the thread referred to post revolution.Besses were owned and issued by the army, it was kings property. One would ‘have some splaying’ to do if you had one.
That said, most every ship carried a musket that looked a lot like a sea service bess, and private folks did get officers fusils, again a gun that looked like a bess only smaller and lighter.
We have a prototype though. It was profitable because it was risky. Boone ended up in serious debt partly because he kept losing his behind when natives took his hides and guns. He owed money on those guns the hides would have paid for. Not to mention the land he owed money on. Rifles were not cheap even for the well healed. They were the Coopers, Dakotas, and Accuracy Internationals of their day..
Sure, but we also have to keep in mind that ALL of the Over Mountain Men and their families before the AWI, were considered criminals by the British Government for having illegally settled there.
Deer hides were big business and very profitable. Yes, a lot of risk, but also a chance to own land and build something for many folks who didn't have many options back then.
Gus
Good points, though in reality they actually were criminals. Especially by modern standards vis a vis the current political view of borders and such.
Fair enough, just noting that they were not merely "considered" criminals.I believe that is what I wrote.
Not going to get into a discussion of modern standards, as it has no bearing on the period we are discussing.
Gus
When people are poor almost any early flintlock might be found, a doglock fowler wouldn't be out of the relm of possibilities. Pick a gun YOU like best and create a storry around it. Many times men might have even lost the gun they started out with and were loaned or gifted a hand me down.Great discussion here guys thanks. I reslly like the early looming english fowlers no butt plate etc. Would that be somewhat acceptable to AWI period and this location?
I think perhaps a double barrel smooth rifle in about 72 cal. with 28 inch barrels. good for shot or patched ball and a tomahawk. Might have a good heat treated Hickory long bow and quiver of arrows wrapped in and oil cloth with trade steel points on the pack mule packed in line with body of the animal. There are times when a bow and arrow will beat a fire arm all to pieces in rate of fire and stealth.I know thats a broad question. I want to portray an average man living on what was then the frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain, living west of the appalachians. What styles would be appropriate, rifle or smooth bore more common? What styles are typically post revolution etc. Thanks
I didn’t see post, infact he mentioned the same men who fought at Kings Mountain.The start of the thread referred to post revolution.
My grandfather was a hunter and logger in Montana, Idaho and Washington from 1908-15. In 1911 he bought a used 1888 Winchester.As was stated, that is a very broad question. ---- Think of it in today's world. What gun does the average man use? There are MANY variables. That is true for today and for the time period questioned. I believe the best answer would be to research what guns were available at that time period and then make a determination based upon your character's persona. If they had money they might have the best gun(s) available. If they were poor they might be using an old, nearly work-out gun. If they had an ancestor that fought in the F&I War they might have inherited a nice weapon. Bottom line , go with what was available and your characters persona and situation.
From the o.p. of this topic,When people are poor almost any early flintlock might be found, a doglock fowler wouldn't be out of the relm of possibilities. Pick a gun YOU like best and create a storry around it. Many times men might have even lost the gun they started out with and were loaned or gifted a hand me down.
So, what if the gun he likes best after looking through a bunch of pictures is of a style that didn't develop until the 1790s to 1810s, and maybe developed further northeast?frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain
I believe in 1807 Manuel Lisa was carrying a Brown Bess while trading with the Indians. John Colter the same year is documented as carrying an Indian trade gun or Barnett gun. There were many Brow Bess muskets captured during the revolution. What happened to them?.....Who knows.I know thats a broad question. I want to portray an average man living on what was then the frontier of NC now modern day TN. These would have been the same men at the battle of kings mountain, living west of the appalachians. What styles would be appropriate, rifle or smooth bore more common? What styles are typically post revolution etc. Thanks
He knows what time period he is looking at, he can pick a rifle or smoothbore from that period of his choosing.From the o.p. of this topic,
So, what if the gun he likes best after looking through a bunch of pictures is of a style that didn't develop until the 1790s to 1810s, and maybe developed further northeast?
Example. A nice Lehigh. I really, really love this style, but, it would have been unheard of/unseen/unknown here in New England between 1755 and 1780, and I think the same can be said for the time and place that the o.p. has asked about.
Ounce told an Air Force young woman who was proclaiming quite loudly how those infantry troops next door were such brutes and should not be allowed out in public that there is only two jobs in the US military. You are infantry or you support the infantry and that's it. Hard for me to say as I was in SF but true none the less.Rifles get the romance, and smoothbores get the bulk of the work done.
Kind of the difference between Special Forces and regular infantry. S.F. gets some crazy, story worthy, gutsy, stuff done, but, as was said or written I forget where, "it is the regular troops that take the ground and hold the ground they take."
Rifles in that area at that time seem to have been more common than in other places. "Dikert" guns in various spellings get mentioned a few times in period writing. Almost any rifle style of that time period from places in Pennsylvania, Virginia, maybe Maryland and maybe N. Carolina,,,, that settlers would have come from would be possible.
Maybe someone better versed than I can list styles available to us now that would not be appropriate. Process of elimination might narrow the field, and thus the discussion.
A smooth bored, rear sighted, Type-G/Carolina trade gun would also be possible. As would many other fowling piece and musket options.
I've often wondered about the period accounts of Kings Mountain and other events in the area at that time regarding their mentions of rifles. We're rifles mentioned specifically because rifle ownership and use was still mentionable, news worthy if you will?
Much agreed... 2 of my direct gggg-grandfather were riflemen at Cowpens; one of them, from Augusta Co., VA, had joined Morgan's Rifles 4 years earlier, and even though the unit as such no longer existed, he completed his service once more fighting under Gen. Morgan there. The other one, along with his brother, was an Overmountain Man, and our family was living in the region of Ft. Nashborough (modern Nashville) by 1780... The brother fought at King"s Mountain. I also have ancestors who had settled in the Kain-tuck-ee by 1770. With all this, I have been pondering ( and posting) on this question a lot...There is little recorded evidence of how many combatants from the back woods carried smooth rifles ,vs. rifled guns.. One would have to think , that many used rifles due to the distances , and the precision , with which shots were executed. A rifleman turned the tide of battle at the battle of Saratoga , N.Y. by targeting officers. Battle of New Orleans , most of the British Officers were killed at substantial distance , before the first British volley was fired. An offhand comment by a backwoods participant at the Battle of King's Mtn. was , that some in the militia , described the action similar to a squirrel hunt.
Accurate shooting with little chance for a bayonet charge by the uniformed British................oldwood
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